From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 3 13:54:30 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56233 for opro ; Tue, 03 Feb 98 13:54:25 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886503937:15:05360:83; Tue, 03 Feb 98 11:05:37 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0619097; 3 Feb 98 11:05 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ak1025445; 3 Feb 98 11:04 GMT From: "Bernard G. Hill" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 10:38:04 +0000 Organization: Subject: subscribe To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980203.103804.41@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 21:43:05 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Hello, I hope that I haven=91t offended anyone, but I sent a contribution to the discussion group on the 23 Jan, and since then I have not received any mailings. Is the group still functioning? Have you had some problems? I would still like to receive mailings. Berni. --=20 Bernard G. Hill Tel/Fax: 01633 880197 Zion, Church Road Undy, Newport e-mail bernard.hill@virgin.net Monmouthshire NP6 3EN=20 To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 3 13:54:34 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56235 for opro ; Tue, 03 Feb 98 13:54:33 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886504002:15:05653:79; Tue, 03 Feb 98 11:06:42 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0619530; 3 Feb 98 11:06 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id am1025445; 3 Feb 98 11:05 GMT From: Nic Cox Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 10:42:26 +0000 Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) Subject: Re: Full stop- Double space? To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980203.104226.81@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 11:30:54 EST X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c << Likewise - I only started to use double spaces in the past year, as it does make sentence breaks easier to read - like serifs on typefaces, it leads your eye to the natural breaks between sentences. I think it makes a real difference, particularly in small print and narrow aspect ratio fonts. >> ... but can lead to that other horror of "white space rivers" when using full justification. Nic Cox To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 3 13:54:41 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56237 for opro ; Tue, 03 Feb 98 13:54:38 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886504018:15:05705:79; Tue, 03 Feb 98 11:06:58 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0619513; 3 Feb 98 11:06 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id al1025445; 3 Feb 98 11:05 GMT From: Chris Chorley Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 10:41:15 +0000 Organization: Subject: Editing Master Pages To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980203.104115.29@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 12:39:55 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I tried editing the master pages for an OPro document which was originally created under 2.46, and worked perfectly up to now in 2.48. All I did was try to add a footer by changing the value from 0 to 10. Click ok and the whole machine locks with no message. The document is only four A4 pages, with the default master page. I'll get round it by creating a new document, but I'm glad I saved it *before* trying to add a footer. RPC/SA 20Mb RAM OPro 2.48 Chris. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 3 13:54:45 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56239 for opro ; Tue, 03 Feb 98 13:54:44 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886504036:12:18843:79; Tue, 03 Feb 98 11:07:16 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0619702; 3 Feb 98 11:06 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ap1025445; 3 Feb 98 11:06 GMT From: Matthew Hambley Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 10:38:50 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: One vs Two spaces after full stop To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980203.103850.94@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 10:40:41 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I thought I would chip in with my tuppence worth on this topic. Just for the record I prefer two spaces after a full stop. I think that probably the only leason we can draw from this protracted and repeating discussion is that people have different preferences when it comes to the number of spaces after a full stop. As far as I can see there is no hard and fast rule on the subject so the best route to take would be to allow the software to cope with both. -- (\/)atthew Hambley ---------------------\ term : ceemah@cee.hw.ac.uk \ "What's a network?" holiday : mhambley@arcade.demon.co.uk \ B.Gates, early '80s web : http://www.cee.hw.ac.uk/~ceemah/ \---------------------------------- To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 3 13:54:49 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56241 for opro ; Tue, 03 Feb 98 13:54:48 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886504053:15:05960:80; Tue, 03 Feb 98 11:07:33 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0619702; 3 Feb 98 11:07 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ar1025445; 3 Feb 98 11:07 GMT From: Alf Chamings Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 10:44:06 +0000 Organization: Subject: OPro: type 5 crash saving default doc To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980203.104406.21@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 16:12:19 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I find I cannot save a document created from a click on the icon bar icon without a type 5 crash (version 2.48(. I suppose the answer lies somewhere in my failure to follow instructions to the letter: I upgraded my working copy and not a newly installed copy of 2.46. Anybody else found this problem? I will reinstall and then upgrade following the instructions to see if it goes away Alf -- mailto:AlfChamings@ed.ac.uk Health and Safety for the Royal Infirmary of Edinburgh tel +44 131 536 3251 fax +44 131 536 3283 http://www.med.ed.ac.uk/hew/ for occupational and environmental health To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 3 13:54:55 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56243 for opro ; Tue, 03 Feb 98 13:54:53 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886504104:12:19159:83; Tue, 03 Feb 98 11:08:24 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ac0620087; 3 Feb 98 11:07 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aq1025445; 3 Feb 98 11:06 GMT From: Alan Adams +44 1327 356463 Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 10:42:03 +0000 Organization: Subject: View spelling errors To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980203.104203.50@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 14:33:17 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I like the option to view spelling errors. I also remember a discussion, but not the solution, about files coming up with every word underlined. When this happens, I simply turn off the option, and turn it back on. However, I have a different version of the problem to report. In a document where I am viewing spelling errors, if I select a piece of text, and drag and drop it elsewhere, the target paragraph (at least Ithink that is the scope of it) is underlined red. This is reproducible at will. I am running OPro 2.46 on RiscOS 3.7, StrongARM. Alan Adams To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 3 13:55:01 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56245 for opro ; Tue, 03 Feb 98 13:54:58 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886504243:12:19805:82; Tue, 03 Feb 98 11:10:43 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0621435; 3 Feb 98 11:10 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ad1025445; 3 Feb 98 11:09 GMT From: "Peter Daniel" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 10:40:01 +0000 Organization: University of Salford Subject: Re:Full stop- Double space? To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980203.104001.74@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 10:49:02 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c > On Mon, 19 Jan 1998, Alf Chamings wrote: > > : Sounds like we had better follow suit. I do not think I will be going over > : all our policies and procedures to eliminate double spaces, though. I have > : only started to use a double space since my (old school) secretary convinced > : me it looked better (and was more easily read). I wonder who decided that > : was all wrong and why. Perhaps it is just a reaction against an established > : convention for the sake of being 'modern'. > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > > When did people stop using double space, then? It wasn't May 1st this > year was it? ;-) > Do you mean last year? > > Nigel > -- > E-mail: nigel.parker@iee.org > > P'Lodge: 01223 338999 > Mobile: 0411 384803 > > Girton College, Cambridge, England, CB3 0JG. > > > > To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk > with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l > To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Visit my web site: http://rampage.ml.org/users/~peter/ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 3 13:55:06 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56247 for opro ; Tue, 03 Feb 98 13:55:04 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886504245:15:06732:82; Tue, 03 Feb 98 11:10:45 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0621337; 3 Feb 98 11:10 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id bw1025445; 3 Feb 98 11:09 GMT From: Roger Mayne Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 10:38:28 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re:Full stop- Double space? To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980203.103828.41@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 10:37:37 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Wed 21 Jan, Dave Allen wrote: > I have never heard such twaddle being written about something so > unimportant. All I know, is that the single space looks wrong and > cramped, to me, so, I will continue with double spacing, right or > wrong. I was not even aware that there was a convention or rule. I think this proves the point of my original posting on this subject regarding the lowering of standards by the use of computers and DTP by untrained users. Buy the book Dave. On Wed 21 Jan, Ray Dawson wrote: > I normally use one space, but one of my clients insists on two. Ray, you and I both know that if your client insists on two spaces after a full point, then you put two spaces after a full point. I see from your signature that you are a braille specialist. Is this, perhaps, the reason for your client insisting on two spaces? This I could well understand and would have every sympathy with. Regards Roger -- Roger Mayne mailto:darprint@eurobell.co.uk Darprint, Lithographic Printers Unit 21, r/o 8-14 St. Vincents Road, Dartford, Kent, DA1 1XZ Tel: 01322 227574 Fax: 01322 291237 To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 3 13:55:13 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56249 for opro ; Tue, 03 Feb 98 13:55:12 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886504280:12:20024:81; Tue, 03 Feb 98 11:11:20 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id af0621337; 3 Feb 98 11:10 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id bx1025445; 3 Feb 98 11:10 GMT From: Dave Allen Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 10:40:26 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: !The and extra spaces To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980203.104026.81@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 11:49:22 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Tue 20 Jan, Tim King wrote: > On Mon 19 Jan, Roger Mayne wrote: > > On Fri 16 Jan, Tim King wrote: > > > > Nearly forty years ago I served a seven year apprenticeship as a compositor > > (metal typesetting) which included three years at Art College being > > instructed in the numerous aspects of typesetting and design for print. > > There is only one way to do a job and that is the right way! > > > > The standards which I was taught all those years ago are still applicable > > today and I would urge anyone "doing what they like" to buy one of the > > excellent books on typography available to aid them in perfecting their > > skills. > Can you, please, recommend one of these 'excellent books', for me to read. I would dearly like to improve my skills at the computer. I've noticed the tendency of secretaries to offer mediocre typing, the lazy placing of addresses, for example. -- | _ \ __ ___ _____ / _ \| | |___ _ _ | |_) / _` \ V / -_) | _ | | / -_) ' \ |____/\__,_|\_/\___| |_| |_|_|_\___|_||_| dave@allendr.demon.co.uk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 3 13:55:21 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56251 for opro ; Tue, 03 Feb 98 13:55:18 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886504287:12:20075:89; Tue, 03 Feb 98 11:11:27 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id af0621820; 3 Feb 98 11:11 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ab1025445; 3 Feb 98 11:10 GMT From: Alan Adams +44 1327 356463 Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 10:40:50 +0000 Organization: Subject: Double space or not? To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980203.104050.30@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 14:05:12 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c After reading the discussion on whether to put two spaces after a full stop, it seems that it would be useful to look at the reasons behind it. One writer reported a recommendation to put two spaces in a fixed font, but not in a proportional font. (Have I got that the right way round?) It occurs to me that the big difference here is the width of the space character. In a proportional font, it's small, so using two would actually look more like using a single space in a fixed font. So the advice I think I remembered correctly above, would seem to be exactly wrong. Be that as it may, should we actually be looking at how to print and display , rather than fiddling with the number of them. Would it be possible, for example, to use something like a ligature, only with more rather than less space between the characters. This would then adjust the spacing automatically, and you would only need one space. Alan Adams To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 3 13:55:27 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56253 for opro ; Tue, 03 Feb 98 13:55:26 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886504342:12:20384:80; Tue, 03 Feb 98 11:12:22 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0622180; 3 Feb 98 11:12 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id as1025445; 3 Feb 98 11:11 GMT From: Alan Adams +44 1327 356463 Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 10:41:38 +0000 Organization: Subject: Picture runaround curves To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980203.104138.88@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 14:30:10 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c A recent writer to the newsgroup has found a problem I reported some months ago. David's reply to both of us was the same - allow more error when calculating the curves. I had done that before reporting the problem, although I didn't take the value more than about ten times its original setting. Maybe x100, x1000 would help? However, after that discussion, I realised that for my needs there was a much better solution - simply draw an irregular frame round the draw file. I realise that will not work for many drawings, but it did for mine. Sometimes the simple solutions work better than the complex ones. I got the distinct impression that in some cases the error factor had no discernable effect. I was working with a complex bezier curve, and it seemed that the runaround curve always had the same number of points as the bezier. In addition, when the points on the bezier were too close together, loops occurred. I did not do exhaustive experiment to check this - I has a magazine to produce. A simple way to reproduce the problem is to create a single letter in, say, Trinity, set it to a large point size, and convert it to a path. Then ask OPro to create a runaround curve. Alan Adams To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 3 13:55:32 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56255 for opro ; Tue, 03 Feb 98 13:55:30 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886504349:15:07292:81; Tue, 03 Feb 98 11:12:29 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0622424; 3 Feb 98 11:12 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id by1025445; 3 Feb 98 11:11 GMT From: Elliott Grosvenor Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 10:43:41 +0000 Organization: The Western Commercial Arts Co. Subject: Re: !The and extra spaces To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980203.104341.50@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 15:52:32 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c In message <19980120.094628.01@risc.demon.co.uk> you wrote: > On Mon 19 Jan, Roger Mayne wrote: > > On Fri 16 Jan, Tim King wrote: .... lots of good stuff about the declining standards of design and typography. I have never admitted to this before but here goes. I am a design and print professional and I tend to keep quiet (as quiet as I can) about these declining standards because the bigger the gap between what we do professionally and what others do because they happen to have the equipment, the better. It makes it easier for me to sell my skills if I can point to a previously printed job of mine then instantly compare it with the the other 90% of printed matter in my client's office. I don't want the self-taughts and philistines to know the secrets of the black art, the world's second oldest profession. -- Kevin Simpson BA(Hons) The Western Commercial Arts Co. http://www.wcartsco.demon.co.uk graphic design - typeface design - typography - illustration - printing To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 3 13:55:37 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56257 for opro ; Tue, 03 Feb 98 13:55:35 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886504388:05:10179:86; Tue, 03 Feb 98 11:13:08 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ac0622180; 3 Feb 98 11:12 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id an1025445; 3 Feb 98 11:11 GMT From: Nic Cox Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 10:44:30 +0000 Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) Subject: Re: Double spaces To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980203.104430.69@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 11:30:53 EST X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c What a lot of correspondence on this matter! In many (most?) fonts, notice that the width of the bounding box for a period is the same as that of a fixed space and of a (variable) space before it is varied. (In big letters, type XXXXXX and just below XXX.XXX. They should line up.) Each of these is half the width of a numeral bounding box, which in turn is the same width as characters such as 151, all presumably designed to let the accountants line up their figures ... ... so if you use one period and one space at the end of a sentence, you have the equivalent space of two spaces (or two periods) between the words at the end of one sentence and the beginning of the next ... unless, of course, your text is fully justified and the variable spaces aren't the same width as fixed spaces any more ... but if it isn't, and you used a period and two spaces you are really voting for THREE space widths between words at the end of a sentence. An ellipsis has a width of more than three periods. Hands up all those people who type three periods (as I have in this mail) instead of occupying the "proper" amount of space on the line! How I miss those days melting lead! Nic Cox To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 3 13:55:42 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56259 for opro ; Tue, 03 Feb 98 13:55:40 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886504392:12:20604:79; Tue, 03 Feb 98 11:13:12 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0622180; 3 Feb 98 11:13 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id cc1025445; 3 Feb 98 11:12 GMT From: "Bernard G. Hill" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 10:37:40 +0000 Organization: Subject: Test spacing To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980203.103740.65@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 23 Jan 1998 20:11:03 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Hi My contribution to the subject of the size of spaces after full stops is to draw attention to a small book by Eric Gill, who designed the typeface carrying his name, entitled 'An Essay on Typography'. He is very interested in the fact that unless text is deliberately manipulated for a specific purpose, its main function is to be read as easily as possible. He maintained that to this end, spaces should be as small as possible, since we separate words in our minds as we read. While he was in charge of the Nonesuch Press, he insisted that thin spaces should be used. A thin space is 20% of an em, an em being a space equal to the point size of the type in use. There will, of course, be times when larger spaces at the end of sentences are beneficial in slowing down the pace of reading. He hated justified type except for very long lines, because the extra space in justified type makes reading more difficult. It is very difficult to get justified type which does not show rivers of white space running down the page. Justified type is used only because the page overall looks smarter, but it is not so easy to read. I haven=91t got the references to hand but research has been done which supports that. My work has been very much influenced by his teaching. Many of the effects used today have resulted from the use of the typewriter with its monospaced single face type. Emphasis could be gained by underlining. There is no need to underline when a bold or italic face can be used. Underlining, tends to compete with the text rather than enhancing it. Best wishes Berni =20 --=20 Bernard G. Hill Tel/Fax: 01633 880197 Zion, Church Road Undy, Newport e-mail bernard.hill@virgin.net Monmouthshire NP6 3EN=20 To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 3 13:55:49 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56261 for opro ; Tue, 03 Feb 98 13:55:47 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886504444:12:20915:81; Tue, 03 Feb 98 11:14:04 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0623139; 3 Feb 98 11:13 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id cd1025445; 3 Feb 98 11:13 GMT From: Elliott Grosvenor Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 10:42:52 +0000 Organization: The Western Commercial Arts Co. Subject: Re:Full stop- Double space? To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980203.104252.75@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 15:30:18 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c In message <19980121.085430.47@risc.demon.co.uk> you wrote: > You fellers must just like to confuse people, I reckon. Now you have > gone and confused yourselves. I have never heard such twaddle being > written about something so unimportant. All I know, is that the > single space looks wrong and cramped, to me, so, I will continue with > double spacing, right or wrong. I was not even aware that there was a > convention or rule. :-) There aren't any rules as such. However a typesetter/designer will aim for an even gray texture to the set text and will do all he can to avoid holes or rivers of white. This means that in some typefaces the gap between the words after a full point will actually be made smaller and in some typefaces the gap will be made bigger. This is usually handled by auto kerning and can often (although not easily on an Acorn system) be tweaked to exactly match the designer's personal preferences. If handled in this way the gap will vary according to what letter the next word starts with. For example a fullpoint-space-T or -W etc will be kerned tighter than a fullpoint-space-P or L. On the basis that the typesetting system is sophisticated enough to do it properly for you, you should not put two spaces after a full point. However if doing so provides the right "feel" to the text... We professionals think this is VERY important. I suppose thats the difference between asking your neighbour to design your sales literature and asking a designer. -- Kevin Simspson BA(Hons) The Western Commercial Arts Co. http://www.wcartsco.demon.co.uk graphic design - typeface design - typography - illustration - printing To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 3 13:55:54 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56263 for opro ; Tue, 03 Feb 98 13:55:53 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886504483:15:07914:79; Tue, 03 Feb 98 11:14:43 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0623390; 3 Feb 98 11:14 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ce1025445; 3 Feb 98 11:13 GMT From: Tom Tanner Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 10:44:53 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Double spaces (was: Various) To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980203.104453.77@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 22 Jan 98 22:20:33 GMT X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Wed 21 Jan 98 (08:50:28 +0000), 95ncp@eng.cam.ac.uk wrote: >On Tue, 20 Jan 1998, David Pilling wrote: > >: From: Roger Mayne >: >I do not wish to offend anyone with this email, but the statement >: "do >what you like" only compounds the problem which I have observed >: through my professional capacity due to the proliferation of home >: computer use. : >: So which is right, single or double spaces after full stops? >: >: One thing I may do is an applet which cleans up documents, sort of >: like 'lint' lets call it 'fluff', typical sort of job would be to >: remove double spaces after full stops or put them in, if we could >: decide. >Someone else has suggested that the existence of en and em spaces may >be something to do with having a bigger "sentence gap" than a "word >gap". I guess that a regular space bar space is an en one, so perhaps >an applet which changed an en space after a full stop into an em space >could prove the solution... No. Ugh, horrible. A space is a variable width thing which is fiddle with by justifcation. It is, by default, about 1/4 the width of an em (or it was when I did hand composing). However, 2 spaces after a full stop is something horrible started in the period of (yech) typewriters. It don't look nice on the printed page. En spaces are / were used for tabular matter or spacing out headlines and such like, and, really have very little relevance today. (sob). >This would overcome the wrapping problems associated with double >spaces. > > >Nigelr -- Regards (PC) / Love from (non PC but nicer) [delete as applicable] Thos -- T. R. Tanner email: ttehtann@argonet.co.uk; ZFC A; Clanorak and StrongArmed web page: http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/ttehtann Warning: Here be random taglines! To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 3 13:56:01 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56265 for opro ; Tue, 03 Feb 98 13:56:00 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886504484:05:10682:83; Tue, 03 Feb 98 11:14:44 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ae0623349; 3 Feb 98 11:14 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id az1025445; 3 Feb 98 11:13 GMT From: Ariancylch Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 10:45:19 +0000 Organization: Lylmik Supervisory body Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980203.104519.76@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 22 Jan 1998 05:45:26 +1200 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c In message <19980121.085323.85@risc.demon.co.uk> Ray Dawson wrote: > On 20 Jan, David Pilling wrote: > > > So which is right, single or double spaces after full stops? > > Neither or both. The space after a full stop is a different animal to > the word space, but different users have their own preference as to > which they use - one or two as we don't have the real one. Incidentally, we likely do. Another 'common' complaint I've heard is that we don't have the various sizes of '-' that are used. However, if you load !Chars, as found in most 'Apps' icons, and switch it to, say, Palatino.Roman, you'll find that there are several widths of '-'. The ' ' is a little harder to see, but I'm fairly sure I found one in some font (of course, not all fonts have all characters, so it's not quite that simple). The difficulty is, of course, in getting at them, since they don't appear on the keyboard, most people forget about the rest (hence ... instead of the proper elipsis :P) As David said, something like enhanced justification that did it for you would be most useful. Might be an interesting exercise to see if an applet that would time how long between each '-' you entered was, and if they were close enough together it could insert a wider '-'... -- I won't use words again | Faith | May god stand between you they don't mean what I meant |manages| and harm in all the empty they don't say what I said | - JMS | places where you must walk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 3 13:56:07 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56267 for opro ; Tue, 03 Feb 98 13:56:04 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886504504:15:07980:85; Tue, 03 Feb 98 11:15:04 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0623349; 3 Feb 98 11:14 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id cg1025445; 3 Feb 98 11:14 GMT From: "waddell@which.net" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 10:39:37 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Double spaces (was: Various) To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980203.103937.40@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 10:38:26 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Wed 21 Jan, Nigel Parker wrote: > On Tue, 20 Jan 1998, David Pilling wrote: > > : From: Roger Mayne > : >I do not wish to offend anyone with this email, but the statement "do > : >what you like" only compounds the problem which I have observed through > : >my professional capacity due to the proliferation of home computer use. > : > : So which is right, single or double spaces after full stops? > : > : One thing I may do is an applet which cleans up documents, sort of > : like 'lint' lets call it 'fluff', typical sort of job would be to > : remove double spaces after full stops or put them in, if we could decide. > > Someone else has suggested that the existence of en and em spaces may be > something to do with having a bigger "sentence gap" than a "word gap". I > guess that a regular space bar space is an en one, so perhaps an applet > which changed an en space after a full stop into an em space could prove > the solution... > > This would overcome the wrapping problems associated with double spaces. My mother used to teach typing to national exam standards. The rule for typists was single space after commas etc, double space after a full stop. Others have come to a logical conclusion why. Proportional spacing, in theory, does away with the need for that, the end result is, again in theory, obtained by the proportional spacing. The only problem is that the proportion of space between different sentences will vary, will it not, depending on the number/length of words on individual lines where full justification is used? I like the idea of an applet but not to faff about with ens and ems. An applet which turned a double space after a full stop into two hard spaces would probably deal with the matter consistently but only most of the time. I will need to try it but what happens if the end of a sentence in a fully justified text is only 2 letter spaces from the end of a line and the first work of the next sentence is 8 letters long? It will pull the last word of the previous sentence down to the next line, which may produce too much white space in the line above. ?Solution anyone? -- John Waddell, Langbank, Renfrewshire waddell@which.net To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 3 13:56:12 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56269 for opro ; Tue, 03 Feb 98 13:56:10 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886504560:15:08228:79; Tue, 03 Feb 98 11:16:00 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0623845; 3 Feb 98 11:15 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id bj1025445; 3 Feb 98 11:14 GMT From: Brian Carroll Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 10:43:15 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Full stop- Double space? To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980203.104315.37@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 18:44:05 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On 21 Jan, Roger Mayne wrote: > On Tue, 20 JAN, Brian Carroll wrote: > >OK Roger. So what is /your/ professional typographer's > >recommendation space between sentences? That sounds abrupt and rude. Sorry. But thanks for coming back with this interesting quotation: > The Printers Bible, 'Rules for Compositors and Readers' by Horace > Hart, which we still refer to today, states, and I quote: [snip] > (b) The space of the line should be used after all full points in > normal text. A special direction, 'Close, with extra space after > sentence full points', will be given for works which require an > extra space after sentence full points (e.g. some bibliographies, > dictionaries, and Classical texts). Though below you draw attention to the first sentence (so I ought to change to using single spaces forthwith), the second leaves open why certain works need double spaces. I presume that even if it is some sort of mystical convention is is really because /someone/ has decided it looks better that way. Ie, typographer's artistic judgement has been applied. If this is so, the matter still seems to be unresolved. > (c) Letter-spacing within words is not allowed for overcoming > justification problems (except very occasionally, e.g. in extremely > narrow measures). > (d) Where an em rule or a hyphen occurs in a line of letter-spaced > capitals, small capitals, or figures, there should be a > corresponding space each side of the rule or hyphen. How does one insert an em-space in OPro? > ......................... The misused use of letter-spacing > within justified text is one that irritates me the most and if I > was the programmer of OvationPro I would not have incorporated it > or at least not have allowed it on justified text. It is never used > here for any reason except display lines. As an amateur, could you explain this a bit more please? I think it's the printer's terminology I do not understand fully - eg, 'letter-spacing', 'justified'. Be patient, I really would like to be able to follow you. Brian. -- ________________________________________________________________________ Brian Carroll, Ripon, North Yorkshire bric@argonet.co.uk Using Pluto v1.03m, 19-01-98 ________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 3 13:56:20 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56271 for opro ; Tue, 03 Feb 98 13:56:18 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886504572:15:08277:82; Tue, 03 Feb 98 11:16:12 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0623845; 3 Feb 98 11:15 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ci1025445; 3 Feb 98 11:15 GMT From: "waddell@which.net" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 10:39:13 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Using !Organiser To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980203.103913.23@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 21 Jan 1998 10:29:02 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Wed 21 Jan, Howe , Chris wrote: > Ovation people- > > I'm preparing to write to Archice magazine about using !Organiser with > !Ovation to manage and organise private correspondence. > > Here is what I have so far. I'd appreciate any comments/ideas, privately > if not of general interst to the List... > > Thanks > Chris Howe, Bath > > --- > > As a user of Acorns for some time, I have been trying to find an optimum > way of managing private correspondence. On the Beeb I used the excellent > Corplan, which comprehensively managed addresses, templates, salutations > and records of letters sent. It was based on Wordwise plus macros, and > limited mostly by the reliability and speed of the old 100k discs I had. about what used to happen > Using the !Stationery applet facility in Ovation Pro, I have installed a > new template for my letters. This is optimised for Window envelopes. A > text frame lives +under' the window in the envelope. I select my Address > from !Organiser and get it to type the address for me into the window. > (It can output to the +keyboard buffer' using +paste at cursor'). It's a > tad slow but entirely intuitive and nice to use. Now since the window is > a bit small, I have arranged an overflow frame linked from the target > frame. This is because normally if the text overfills its frame one > cannot type in anymore; input is lost. The user gobbles up any overflow > in the second frame manually by perhaps combining lines, then auto > inserts the date (a non-changing date is needed because we must record > when the letter was sent) using keyboard short-cuts. One must ensure the > Salutations match (Corplan used to match +Dear Sir' with +Yours > Faithfully' automatically). A parallel zip drive enables me to keep lots > of backups. The down side of having the overflow frame is that it takes > extra storage, significant if there are a lot of letters to store. > > So now I have a RISC-based system nearly as nice as the 8-bit. On the > wish list would be the ability of !Organiser to do a keyword out of > context search for addresses (this can be done indirectly by exporting > the data into a temporary file and doing a find) and maybe not have > Ovation lose overflow characters (the user would only have to ensure > there was no Overflow indication from the bottom of the frame then). > Since Ovation has a comprehensive programming language of its own, more > complex systems can be envisaged. As a comparison, I have heard that an > entire correspondence system (composition, sending & filing) for a > Solicitors office may be implemented in the MS Word macro facility. I use a simpler method which seems to work quickly. I regularly write either to indivuals or mail merge correspondence to 50 odd organisations. For individuals I have a memo pro forma and a letter pro forma. I have several letter pro formas for the mail merges to suit the purpose of the exercise. For letters or other pro formas where I do not want text to move, I use an aditional frame for the address - this frame sized so that I know it will take all necessary lines of text in the largest address. I have CSV files in !Edit for my mail merges. I have relevant labels documents which I use to print out self adhesive labels. My secretary simply sticks these on the 50 odd envelopes making her life easier. For single items of correspondence, I have a small number of directories, named thematically and each directory contains !Edit text files, one for each address. These directories sit permanently on my pinboard. Some of the textfiles, which I might use several times a day, themselves sit on the pinboard. Some of the pro formas also sit on the pinboard. To send a letter to Bloggs, the shipping agent, I double click on the pinboard 'myhead'(ed notepaper)icon and up comes the letter. I double click on the 'agents' directory on the pinboard and up comes the open directory. I drag and drop the address into the letter and begin to type the letter. If like me you send out regular mail merge correspondence and do not want to write your signature 50 odd times, you might find my solution useful. I had my signature scanned into a file and this now sits in an otherwise empty OvnPro document. For a mail merge letter, i pull the scan into the document so that when it prints out, each letter contains my signature - I use a laser printer so this looks very professional. The scan is also very useful when sending letters by ArcFax. -- John Waddell, Langbank, Renfrewshire waddell@which.net To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 4 14:21:09 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56383 for opro ; Wed, 04 Feb 98 14:21:06 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886583557:15:09272:81; Wed, 04 Feb 98 09:12:37 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id af0627515; 4 Feb 98 9:12 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ad2009875; 4 Feb 98 9:10 GMT From: Colin Thompson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 09:05:52 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Test spacing To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980204.090552.91@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 09:33:41 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On 03 Feb, Bernard G. Hill wrote: > Hi > My contribution to the subject of the size of spaces after full stops is > to draw attention to a small book by Eric Gill, who designed the > typeface carrying his name, entitled 'An Essay on Typography'. I don't think we should be listening too much to a man who had sex with his sister and his dog! Eric Gill that is not Mr Hill!! :-) -- Colin Thompson Mail to - colinet@atlantis.aust.com Web site - http://www.atlantis.aust.com/~colinet To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 4 14:21:16 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56385 for opro ; Wed, 04 Feb 98 14:21:15 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886583624:05:03209:80; Wed, 04 Feb 98 09:13:44 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0628200; 4 Feb 98 9:13 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ai2009875; 4 Feb 98 9:11 GMT From: Nigel Parker Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 09:02:38 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Double spaces To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980204.090238.37@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 13:17:23 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Tue, 3 Feb 1998, Nic Cox wrote: [double space stuff] : An ellipsis has a width of more than three periods. Hands up all those people : who : type three periods (as I have in this mail) instead of occupying the "proper" : amount : of space on the line! How I miss those days melting lead! I use the Ellipsis module from, ISTR, Justin Fletcher. Whenever you type three dots in a row it will type three backspaces followed by the ellipsis cahracter! I have it installed in my boot sequence - it's great. Nigel -- 0411 384803 nigel.parker@iee.org Girton College, Cambridge, England, CB3 0JG. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 4 14:21:21 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56387 for opro ; Wed, 04 Feb 98 14:21:20 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886583637:05:03209:190; Wed, 04 Feb 98 09:13:57 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0628230; 4 Feb 98 9:13 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ab2009875; 4 Feb 98 9:12 GMT From: Rupert Thompson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 09:03:21 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980204.090321.17@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 12:58:26 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Tue 03 Feb, Ariancylch wrote: > As David said, something like enhanced justification that did it for you > would be most useful. Might be an interesting exercise to see if an > applet that would time how long between each '-' you entered was, and if > they were close enough together it could insert a wider '-'... !Expand already does this. A pair of hyphens become an en-rule; an en-rule followed by a hyphen becomes an em-rule, and an em-rule followed by a hyphen becomes a bullet point. And then a bullet point followed by a hyphen becomes a mid-line point. Other things like \x become a multiplication sign. All in real-time as-you-type. And freely downloadable from my website. -- Rupert Thompson Queens' College, Cambridge, CB3 9ET, UK http://rjet1.quns.cam.ac.uk/ (when my computer's on!) To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 4 14:21:25 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56389 for opro ; Wed, 04 Feb 98 14:21:24 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886583694:15:10215:79; Wed, 04 Feb 98 09:14:54 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0628726; 4 Feb 98 9:14 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ak2009875; 4 Feb 98 9:13 GMT From: Keith Hopper Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 09:04:25 +0000 Organization: Subject: Editing Master Pages To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980204.090425.63@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 09:15:20 +1200 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On 03 Feb, Chris Chorley wrote: > I tried editing the master pages for an OPro document which was originally > created under 2.46, and worked perfectly up to now in 2.48. All I did was > try to add a footer by changing the value from 0 to 10. Click ok and the > whole machine locks with no message. The document is only four A4 pages, > with the default master page. I'll get round it by creating a new document, > but I'm glad I saved it *before* trying to add a footer. > RPC/SA 20Mb RAM OPro 2.48 Ah! I've had this one intermittently right from version 2.42 -- but thought it was something to do with my lack of knowledge about how to use the application. kh To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 4 14:21:30 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56391 for opro ; Wed, 04 Feb 98 14:21:27 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886583708:05:03831:79; Wed, 04 Feb 98 09:15:08 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ac0629231; 4 Feb 98 9:15 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aq2009875; 4 Feb 98 9:14 GMT From: Martin Devon Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 09:04:47 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Full stop- Double space? To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980204.090447.41@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 18:21:28 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c > > [snip] > > > (b) The space of the line should be used after all full points in > > normal text. A special direction, 'Close, with extra space after > > sentence full points', will be given for works which require an > > extra space after sentence full points (e.g. some bibliographies, > > dictionaries, and Classical texts). > > Though below you draw attention to the first sentence (so I ought to > change to using single spaces forthwith), the second leaves open why > certain works need double spaces. I can perhaps add a candle-power of 'lux' or 'phos' (phws? phows? How does one render o-mega into English?) to the reference to classical texts. Latin and Greek texts as originally written are all upper case. Lower case only came in during 4th century AD but then did not use capitals at all. Full stops are not found in original upper case texts. So it is a matter of attempting to use spaces to inject some semblance of legibility into what what may otherwise appear a great slab of solid lettering! Add to that, Roman confusion between U and V, or Attic confusion between S and T, and as to whether H exists at all...but I think this is getting us right off subject, so I'll just put a Latin full stop to this -- Martin Devon IT Consultant Stonar School To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 4 14:21:34 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56393 for opro ; Wed, 04 Feb 98 14:21:33 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886583760:12:12879:79; Wed, 04 Feb 98 09:16:00 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ac0629214; 4 Feb 98 9:15 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aj2009875; 4 Feb 98 9:12 GMT From: Dr A G Gray Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 09:04:04 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980204.090404.06@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 98 13:57:52 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Tue 3 Feb 98 (10:45:19 +0000), julian@southern.co.nz wrote: .... about different length dashes: >Might be an interesting exercise to see if an applet that would time how long >between each '-' you entered was, and if they were close enough together it >could insert a wider '-'... I use Sam Kington's !Quotes and its 'Diphthong' facility to do this. One hyphen is a hyphen, two makes an en-dash, and three and em-dash. And two full-stops make an ellipsis. You can do (almost) the same sort of thing with OP's 'expand abbreviations'. -- Alan.Gray@argonet.co.uk Dr A.G.Gray. Great Warley, Essex. UK http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/alan.gray N 51 33'58" E 00 17'35" G3XQU (DXCC=323/328) Acorn RiscPC S/A 202MHz To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 4 14:21:38 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56395 for opro ; Wed, 04 Feb 98 14:21:37 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886583800:15:10814:79; Wed, 04 Feb 98 09:16:40 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0628200; 4 Feb 98 9:16 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ar2009875; 4 Feb 98 9:14 GMT From: Rob Hemmings Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 09:05:10 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Picture runaround curves To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980204.090510.09@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 98 (19:49:39 +0100) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Tue 3 Feb 98 (10:41:38 +0000), alan.adams@gecm.com wrote: >A recent writer to the newsgroup has found a problem I reported some >months ago. David's reply to both of us was the same - allow more error >when calculating the curves. I had done that before reporting the >problem, although I didn't take the value more than about ten times its >original setting. Maybe x100, x1000 would help? > >However, after that discussion, I realised that for my needs there was >a much better solution - simply draw an irregular frame round the draw >file. I realise that will not work for many drawings, but it did for >mine. Sometimes the simple solutions work better than the complex ones. I have exactly the same problems that Alan Adams has explained with runaround curves - they really do seem very difficult to use easily and effectively no matter what the error setting is. However, thanks Alan for the excellent idea above - I'd stupidly forgotten all about OvationPro's abilty to draw frames of any shape and use them to repel text! -- ------------------------------------------------------------- Rob Hemmings Southport Tel: +44 (0)1704 573210 robh@argonet.co.uk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 4 14:21:43 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56397 for opro ; Wed, 04 Feb 98 14:21:42 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886583801:05:04467:93; Wed, 04 Feb 98 09:16:41 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id af0629697; 4 Feb 98 9:16 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id as2009875; 4 Feb 98 9:15 GMT From: Martin Devon Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 09:05:31 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Double space or not? To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980204.090531.51@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 17:50:20 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Tue 03 Feb, Alan Adams +44 1327 356463 wrote: > After reading the discussion on whether to put two spaces after a full stop, > it seems that it would be useful to look at the reasons behind it. > > One writer reported a recommendation to put two spaces in a fixed font, but > not in a proportional font. (Have I got that the right way round?) That was me, quoting the University of Cambridge Local Examinations Syndicate verbatim. > > It occurs to me that the big difference here is the width of the space > character. In a proportional font, it's small, so using two would actually > look more like using a single space in a fixed font. So the advice I think I > remembered correctly above, would seem to be exactly wrong. Not so, I think. In a fixed-pitch font the dot is in the middle of the character space, so needs space after it (as one did with an old-style typewriter). In a proportional font the dot is right over on the left with the space accumulated on the right. The dot is therefore close to the text it terminates and separated by space from the following. No addition is required. Examine the setting head from an IBM typesetting machine! Now, shall we consider the *vertical* spacing between paragraphs? ;) -- Martin Devon IT Consultant Stonar School To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 4 14:21:49 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56399 for opro ; Wed, 04 Feb 98 14:21:48 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886583914:15:11484:79; Wed, 04 Feb 98 09:18:34 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0600316; 4 Feb 98 9:18 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aa2009875; 4 Feb 98 9:15 GMT From: Mr R Coleman Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 09:06:36 +0000 Organization: Subject: Printing To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980204.090636.46@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 98 00:05:49 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I have recently written a printer status program which sits on the icon bar and changes it's icon to reflect the state of the printer on the parallel port, it also checks the state of the printer when you print from another application or drag a file to the !Printer icon. It does this by watching for a couple of printer messages. The filename is !PrnStat and it is available for downloading from my web site http://www.argonet.co.uk/homepages/coleman I would be grateful for any *constructive* comments. Thanks Richard Coleman -- --. --. --. --. : : --- --- .---------------------------------------------. |_| |_| | _ | | | | |_ | |Internet provider for all Acorn RISC machines| | | |\ | | | | |\| | | '---------------------------------------------' | | | \ |_| |_| | | |__ | coleman@argonet.co.uk (Home) R.I.Coleman@brs0602.wins.icl.co.uk (Work) http://www.argonet.co.uk/homepages/coleman To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 4 14:21:53 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56401 for opro ; Wed, 04 Feb 98 14:21:52 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886583948:05:05384:86; Wed, 04 Feb 98 09:19:08 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0600262; 4 Feb 98 9:18 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id av2009875; 4 Feb 98 9:16 GMT From: Rupert Thompson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 09:02:59 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Full stop- Double space? To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980204.090259.99@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 11:30:31 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Tue 03 Feb, Brian Carroll wrote: > On 21 Jan, Roger Mayne wrote: > > > (b) The space of the line should be used after all full points in > > normal text. A special direction, 'Close, with extra space after > > sentence full points', will be given for works which require an > > extra space after sentence full points (e.g. some bibliographies, > > dictionaries, and Classical texts). > > Though below you draw attention to the first sentence (so I ought to > change to using single spaces forthwith), the second leaves open why > certain works need double spaces. I presume that even if it is some > sort of mystical convention is is really because /someone/ has > decided it looks better that way. Ie, typographer's artistic > judgement has been applied. If this is so, the matter still seems to > be unresolved. In the case of Classical texts, I posit that it's because neither Latin nor Greek starts a sentence with a capital letter. The extra wide space would serve to delimit sentences, when otherwise there would be minimal visual clue. Looking at an Oxford Classical Text of Cicero, it does appear to be the case that the setter has used double spaces at sentence ends, which is something I'd never noticed before. The really annoying thing is, though that !THe doesn't insert a second space after a full stop unless the next character is a capital letter ;-( -- Rupert Thompson Queens' College, Cambridge, CB3 9ET, UK http://rjet1.quns.cam.ac.uk/ (when my computer's on!) To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 4 14:22:00 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56403 for opro ; Wed, 04 Feb 98 14:21:59 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886583949:12:14297:80; Wed, 04 Feb 98 09:19:09 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0600720; 4 Feb 98 9:18 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ay2009875; 4 Feb 98 9:17 GMT From: "Roger Darlington" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 09:03:43 +0000 Organization: University of Salford Subject: book making To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980204.090343.15@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 14:07:56 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Dear All, I am trying to write a book using OP. It is an A4 landscape-format book with each page split into two equal sections down the middle. At the top of each section is a drawing, at the bottom explanatory text. Like thus: ------------------------------------ l piccy l piccy l l l l l l l l text l text l l____________l___________l <--fold here l piccy l piccy l l l l l l l l text l text l l l l l------------------l---------------- l Although not well represented by the above drawing, the pages have a strict layout, with the piccies always the same size and always at the top, and the corresponding text at the bottom. I have tried drawing a master page like the above with text and piccy frames in, and then filling up all the pages with piccies and text in the document. I have text-flow between all text sections. To get the text of the next picture below the correct text, I have used '+ next-page' characters where appropriate. This works fine. But the problem comes when I find I need to add another section (which could be anywhere in the document). It is easy to get the text to go to the next section by adding another '+ next page' character in the appropriate place, but the pictures remain stubbornly in the same section and do not move. I have tried 'embedding' the pictures (in the master frames) but this does not have the desired effect. It is perhaps the design of the master pages? Does anyone know how I should design the master pages so that I can insert sections at will, with both text and pictures keeping together. Where is the 'page editing/moving' bit of OPro? (or, in my case, the half-page editing/moving bit of Opro) Has anyone got a solution? Perplexed. Roger Roger Darlington 1 fells Grove Worsley Manchester M28 7JN Home Tel - (0161) 799 9845 R.W.DARLINGTON@acoustics.salford.ac.uk Work Tel - (0161) 295 3399 It's all done by mirrors To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 4 14:22:04 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56405 for opro ; Wed, 04 Feb 98 14:22:03 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886584003:05:05712:79; Wed, 04 Feb 98 09:20:03 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0600740; 4 Feb 98 9:19 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aw2009875; 4 Feb 98 9:16 GMT From: Keith Hopper Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 09:06:58 +0000 Organization: Subject: An eye for beauty To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980204.090658.05@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 09:33:41 +1200 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Greetings, As a learner at the seat of the mighty, may I offer a few thoughts on the beauty of the printed word. When computers were only being used by experts, there came the time when I decided that some sort of computer help with type-setting should be done. At the time I was on the staff at Leeds University and spent the entire summer vacation one year in the hands of the University Printer -- a man of infinite patience and wisdom -- learning at least the rudiments of the art. His maxim was that spacing between puctuated segments of text should be handled as one would handle laying out individual characters on a poster -- by inserting sufficient space/kerning to make the result LOOK even (NOT be even by measurement!!!). This means, for example that a section ending in an italic font and punctuation mark followed by a section in a Roman or Script font needed extra/less kerning than when the font did not change. I was further instructed that where some form of parenthetic segment was involved then the 'parenthesis markers' should be in the font and size of the last character of the contents (except in VERY special circumstances). May I therefore suggest that any DTP program can only provide facilities for the user to create the visual image which is in his minds eye. It is all a matter of beauty being in the eye of the beholder. That is why typography is an art, not a science! kh PS Why shouldn't we find ourselves tweaking kerning here and there to produce the effect that we want? I do it all the time. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 4 14:22:12 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56407 for opro ; Wed, 04 Feb 98 14:22:09 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886584053:12:14949:81; Wed, 04 Feb 98 09:20:53 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0600919; 4 Feb 98 9:20 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ba2009875; 4 Feb 98 9:17 GMT From: David Pilling Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 09:06:13 +0000 Organization: Subject: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980204.090613.65@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 03 Feb 98 18:41:51 GMT X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c From: "Bernard G. Hill" >I hope that I haven=91t offended anyone, but I sent a contribution to the >discussion group on the 23 Jan, and since then I have not received any >mailings. Is the group still functioning? Have you had some problems? I would >still like to receive mailings. I think Ian has been off site on network installing duties, hence the break. From: Chris Chorley >I tried editing the master pages for an OPro document which was originally >created under 2.46, and worked perfectly up to now in 2.48. All I did was >try to add a footer by changing the value from 0 to 10. Click ok and the >whole machine locks with no message. The document is only four A4 pages, >with the default master page. I'll get round it by creating a new document, >but I'm glad I saved it *before* trying to add a footer. Strange how these things go. I believe I fixed that bug last week. A workaround is to save the document as DDL and then reload. You should then be able to set the footer size. From: Alf Chamings >I find I cannot save a document created from a click on the icon bar icon >without a type 5 crash (version 2.48(. I suppose the answer lies somewhere >in my failure to follow instructions to the letter: I upgraded my working >copy and not a newly installed copy of 2.46. Anybody else found this >problem? I'm sure this is due to you installing the original version of the Version applet. As I commented a couple of weeks back a fixed version appeared on the web site the next day. Sorry for the trouble. From: Alan Adams +44 1327 356463 >I like the option to view spelling errors. I also remember a discussion, but >not the solution, about files coming up with every word underlined. When this >happens, I simply turn off the option, and turn it back on. Yes thats a workaround, but the bug is fixed in 2.48. >In a document where I am viewing spelling errors, if I select a piece of text, >and drag and drop it elsewhere, the target paragraph (at least Ithink that is >the scope of it) is underlined red. I'd be interested to hear if that goes away when you use 2.48, probably it will. From: Brian Carroll >As an amateur, could you explain this a bit more please? I think >it's the printer's terminology I do not understand fully - eg, >'letter-spacing', 'justified'. Be patient, I really would like to be >able to follow you. In OPro the general area is 'enhanced justification' in the format windows. See pages 66-68 in the manual. Interestingly 'en space' is in the index but not in the manual text so I can't tell you how to produce one 8-) News ==== An applet by Chris Ford which provides relational database functionality on CSV files and a way of handling citations in academic type papers is available from; http://sp50.sp.phy.cam.ac.uk/ Note you will need OPro 2.48 to use this. ********************************************************************** **** My last posting - 2 weeks back - seems to not have appeared. **** **** It is repeated below. **** ********************************************************************** From: Nick Kaijaks >The 'Reverse' option in the text options and info bar button seems >to have stopped working for me in 2.48. Anyone else? any solution? Works OK for me... From: David Williams >I have upgraded to 2.48 and find that various options on the Misc > Insert >Menu do not work correctly. This rings a bell. There's an applet which produces lists of fonts, and the original version installs itself on the insert menu in such a way that it upsets it. The fixed version is on the Beebug web pages. From: Jeff Clewley >Being in the process of converting from Impression Publisher >to Ovation Pro, the one thing I find difficult is that when using >the check as you type option in spellcheck that there does not >appear to a keyboard only route to correcting a misspelt word, Well obviously when check as you type goes beep, you can hit a key and get the spell checker window open with a list of alternatives. Beyond that you're into an old complaint - you can't choose one of the alternatives without using the mouse. What you can do is manually fix the word in the icon in the spell check window and hit return. I do agree that this might be better if it worked the other way, but making the change means scrapping the current system completely. Which as ever we're loath to do because of existing documentation and so on. From: Carl Cepurneek >>remove double spaces after full stops or put them in, if we could decide. >Have it an option of course! BTW how would it deal with $24.95, ..., and >.subdir.file? Well that's easy, a full stop has at least one space after it. So we'd have an option with two buttons marked 'correct' and 'wrong' for the number of spaces after a full stop. Hmm. All this may seem trivial, but I think documents look better if you're consistent, which ever rule you choose to use. And imposing consistency is something the program could do easily. >>{string s="thesaurus$running"; >> if(!getenvs(s)) {osclis("wimptask run>.!Run");pause(5)}}{'C_T} >That didn't work for me even after mutiple typing checks; Neded ';' got '}' Sorry, needs a semicolon after the pause(5) From: "Dr. P.N. Young" >May I have an idiot's question? I don't have !ColSupp loaded, as I don't need >it (I think). I don't seem to have drawfile problems, though I don't use them a >lot. Do I need !ColSupp if I don't do other than bog standard four-ink-cartidge >Stylus Color prints???? Maybe I have a problem I don't know about :-) The Colour supplement also supports image processing, which is probably why people have seen the problems they have. But yes if you don't want to be able to twiddle images, and you don't want to do colour separations, and you don't want to drive Turbo drivers in CMYK mode, then yes you don't need it. From: Roger Mayne >text set. The misused use of letter-spacing within justified text is one that >irritates me the most and if I was the programmer of OvationPro I would not >have incorporated it or at least not have allowed it on justified text. Hmm. 8-( you should see how the books on Quark drool over this feature. From: "Howe , Chris" >Pro, I actually lost more functionality; that merger (in its initial >incarnation) could not seem to skip records and just print one item. I hope the functionality in 2.48 is as least as good as Impression was. >text frame lives +under' the window in the envelope. I select my Address > from !Organiser and get it to type the address for me into the window. >(It can output to the +keyboard buffer' using +paste at cursor'). I wonder if it will let you save chunks of text, or use the global clip board, or like err um ArcFax allows drag and drops of names and addresses? I suppose another possibility, would be to have an OPro document with all your names and addresses in. When you want to send a letter, find the address, mark it off, then click on 'label' (lablel applet), and assuming you have a label set up which resembles a letter, there you are. General ramblings ----------------- I see Archive recently referred to 2.48 as 'useable but incomplete'. I guess I asked for that by putting the word 'experimental' on the upgrade pages. Anyway 2.48 was my best effort at fixing problems in 2.46, it is a relatively conservative effort. So far I am aware of no *new* bugs in 2.48. There won't be any more 'versions' of 2.48, or a final release of it. What will come next is 2.49 with fixes for one or two more bugs that have come to light, and some new features like the global clipboard. >From the web logs, it seems about 33% of OPro users may have upgraded. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 6 13:48:20 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56598 for opro ; Fri, 06 Feb 98 13:48:18 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886759213:15:04288:80; Fri, 06 Feb 98 10:00:13 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0602847; 6 Feb 98 9:59 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ae2010437; 6 Feb 98 9:57 GMT From: Brian Adam Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 09:53:54 +0000 Organization: Subject: DDL - how useful is it? To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980206.095354.82@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 05 Feb 1998 21:23:07 +1300 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c The save box offers DDL format. How useful is this? What other applications can read it? Brian --=20 B r i a n =A0 A d a m J e w e l l e r y E y e w e a r =A0=20 brian@adam.co.nz ph/fx +64 9 817 6816 NEW ZEALAND http://www.adam.co.nz/workshop/ NEXT - Queenstown Mar11 to Mar18 1998=20 To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 6 13:48:34 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56600 for opro ; Fri, 06 Feb 98 13:48:25 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886759258:12:26267:80; Fri, 06 Feb 98 10:00:58 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0603598; 6 Feb 98 10:00 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id al2010437; 6 Feb 98 9:58 GMT From: Ray Dawson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 09:50:51 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980206.095051.98@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 12:29:34 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On 04 Feb, Dr A G Gray wrote: > And two full-stops make an ellipsis. What happenes when you write a sentence ending in an abbreviation etc.. Perhaps three full stops should make an elipsis? Ray D -- ===================================. | M a g R a y Document Services | Ray Dawson Tel: 0181 864 7208 | the print and braille specialists | rayd@argonet.co.uk '===================================' http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/rayd To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 6 13:48:39 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56602 for opro ; Fri, 06 Feb 98 13:48:38 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886759269:15:04881:80; Fri, 06 Feb 98 10:01:09 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0603694; 6 Feb 98 10:00 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id am2010437; 6 Feb 98 9:59 GMT From: Nico ter Haar Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 09:51:13 +0000 Organization: Subject: upgrades 245->248 To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980206.095113.68@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 13:43:01 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Hello, Maybe Ian wants to repeat details about how to get the upgrade from 245->248 (or 246 using the webupgrades to get 248). This is address, pricing, payment method, original disk return? etc. thanks nico -- Nico ter Haar, StrongARM 202MHz at home! nico.terhaar@tip.nl ----> FoonGrep2 now supports the December 1997 CDfoon ! Pulstar Pages WWW site -- http://www.tip.nl/users/nico.terhaar/ To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 6 13:48:43 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56604 for opro ; Fri, 06 Feb 98 13:48:42 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886759281:12:26384:80; Fri, 06 Feb 98 10:01:21 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0604054; 6 Feb 98 10:01 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id an2010437; 6 Feb 98 9:59 GMT From: Rupert Thompson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 09:51:35 +0000 Organization: Subject: OEFPro version 1.20 To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980206.095135.69@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 00:23:17 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I've just posted version 1.20 of the !OEFPro applet to my website (address in sig). This should be a bit faster than the previous version -- thanks to David Pilling for suggesting the improvement. !OEFPro works in conjunction with Easy Font Professional to try to avoid the 'Missing font' error on loading a document which contains deactivated fonts. It tries to activate such fonts invisibly. -- Rupert Thompson Queens' College, Cambridge, CB3 9ET, UK http://rjet1.quns.cam.ac.uk/ (when my computer's on!) To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 6 13:48:49 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56606 for opro ; Fri, 06 Feb 98 13:48:46 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886759324:12:26689:80; Fri, 06 Feb 98 10:02:04 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0604051; 6 Feb 98 10:01 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ak2010437; 6 Feb 98 9:58 GMT From: Alan Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 09:49:19 +0000 Organization: Subject: A Plea To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980206.094919.10@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 14:19:38 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Hello OVPro users, I agree with Keith Hopper "An Eye of Beauty." Can this please draw an end to the endless chat about full points and spacing. Lets get back to some views, comments, etc. about the best DTP package around. As for slagging off Eric Gill one of the world's greatest Typographers thats the absolute pits. Alan Esplen Great Waltham, Essex, England. Graphic Designer email: a.esplen@btinternet.com To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 6 13:48:53 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56608 for opro ; Fri, 06 Feb 98 13:48:51 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886759369:15:05496:83; Fri, 06 Feb 98 10:02:49 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ah0604034; 6 Feb 98 10:02 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ao2010437; 6 Feb 98 9:59 GMT From: Rob Hemmings Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 09:53:31 +0000 Organization: Subject: Underlining of spelling mistakes To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980206.095331.57@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 98 (20:51:14 +0100) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I definitely like this feature but is there any chance the underlines could be made a little thinner? I feel they look a bit ugly at the current width. -- ------------------------------------------------------------- Rob Hemmings Southport Tel: +44 (0)1704 573210 robh@argonet.co.uk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 6 13:48:57 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56610 for opro ; Fri, 06 Feb 98 13:48:56 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886759407:05:16258:85; Fri, 06 Feb 98 10:03:27 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0603694; 6 Feb 98 10:03 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id au2010437; 6 Feb 98 10:01 GMT From: tony van der Hoff Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 09:51:58 +0000 Organization: Subject: 2.45 upgrade To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980206.095158.60@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 16:42:02 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Having finally got round to installing 2.46 in preparation for the upgrade to 2.48, I came across the following problem: The 2.45 -> 2.46 upgrde pack consists only of disks 1 & 2, in exchange for the 2.45 copies. In the 2.46 !ReadMe it states that !System has moved from disk 2 to disk 3. The !Install process gets its knickers in a right twist when it can't find !System on disc 3, and aborts. 2.46 seems to work OK with 2.45's modules, but am I courting problems by running it this way? Furthermore, I now no longer have a complete installation package, so can't completely reload OPro should that disaster occur! I'm definately courting trouble that way! Any advice anyone? Can/will you send me disk 3, Ian?? -- Tony van der Hoff | E-Mail: tony@mk-net.demon.co.uk Buckinghamshire, England | ---------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 6 13:49:03 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56612 for opro ; Fri, 06 Feb 98 13:49:02 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886759417:12:27283:80; Fri, 06 Feb 98 10:03:37 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0604765; 6 Feb 98 10:03 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id at2010437; 6 Feb 98 10:01 GMT From: "andy.ling@quantel.com" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 09:48:56 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: book making To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980206.094856.80@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 11:24:52 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c > I am trying to write a book using OP. > > It is an A4 landscape-format book with each page split into two > equal sections down the middle. At the top of each section is a > drawing, at the bottom explanatory text. [snip.. lots of stuff] A quick tought occurs. Couldn't you make your master page the size of half A4 (which after all is the size of your page). Then insering a new page would push all the rest down (including the pictures). Then you could use the Imposition applet to print two pages on a single A4 sheet. Hope this helps Andy Ling To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 6 13:49:08 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56614 for opro ; Fri, 06 Feb 98 13:49:07 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886759502:05:16914:82; Fri, 06 Feb 98 10:05:02 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0603598; 6 Feb 98 10:04 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id av2010437; 6 Feb 98 10:02 GMT From: "andy.ling@quantel.com" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 09:52:22 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980206.095222.56@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 17:21:37 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c >> Is the group still functioning? Have you had some problems? I would >>still like to receive mailings. >I think Ian has been off site on network installing duties, hence the break. Does this mean the list is run manually? All the mailing lists I've dealt with (admitedly in the UNIX world) were automatic and didn't really need any looking after. Or maybe it just needs Ian to look after it when it breaks, which is perhaps too often. If it is a manual process I guess we owe Ian more than I thought :-) Anyway it's good to see it's back again. Andy Ling To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 6 13:49:15 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56616 for opro ; Fri, 06 Feb 98 13:49:11 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886759507:15:06352:81; Fri, 06 Feb 98 10:05:07 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0605473; 6 Feb 98 10:04 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aw2010437; 6 Feb 98 10:02 GMT From: Dave Allen Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 09:52:46 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Double spaces To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980206.095246.07@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 19:47:16 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Wed 04 Feb, Nigel Parker wrote: > On Tue, 3 Feb 1998, Nic Cox wrote: > > [double space stuff] > : An ellipsis has a width of more than three periods. Hands up all those people > : who > : type three periods (as I have in this mail) instead of occupying the "proper" > : amount > : of space on the line! How I miss those days melting lead! > > I use the Ellipsis module from, ISTR, Justin Fletcher. Whenever you type > three dots in a row it will type three backspaces followed by the ellipsis > cahracter! I have it installed in my boot sequence - it's great. > Now come on you fellers! What is an ellipsis and what do you use it for? -- | _ \ __ ___ _____ / _ \| | |___ _ _ | |_) / _` \ V / -_) | _ | | / -_) ' \ |____/\__,_|\_/\___| |_| |_|_|_\___|_||_| dave@allendr.demon.co.uk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 6 13:49:20 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56618 for opro ; Fri, 06 Feb 98 13:49:19 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886759541:12:28131:81; Fri, 06 Feb 98 10:05:41 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ae0604054; 6 Feb 98 10:05 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id bc2010437; 6 Feb 98 10:03 GMT From: Alf Chamings Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 09:49:42 +0000 Organization: Subject: Enhanced justification To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980206.094942.44@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 15:52:57 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Wed 04 Feb, David Pilling wrote: > > > From: Roger Mayne > >> text set. The misused use of letter-spacing within justified text is one >> that irritates me the most and if I was the programmer of OvationPro I >> would not have incorporated it or at least not have allowed it on >> justified text. > > Hmm. 8-( you should see how the books on Quark drool over this feature. > I think Roger is right about this. I had just ticked the enhanced justification button on the basis that an enhancement is likely to be a good thing. I didn't pay a lot of attention to what it produced until I saw Roger's comment. Then I noticed that in some circumstances (perhaps extreme ones) it makes words look decidedly peculiar even in a memo using 12pt text across an A4 sheet in a single column. In fact I think I will try switching justification off altogether for more types of document. Regards Alf -- mailto:AlfChamings@ed.ac.uk Health and Safety for the Royal Infirmary of Edinburgh tel +44 131 536 3251 fax +44 131 536 3283 http://www.med.ed.ac.uk/hew/ for occupational and environmental health To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 6 13:49:25 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56620 for opro ; Fri, 06 Feb 98 13:49:23 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886759564:05:17395:80; Fri, 06 Feb 98 10:06:04 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ah0606635; 6 Feb 98 10:05 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id bh2010437; 6 Feb 98 10:04 GMT From: "Peter Daniel" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 09:50:06 +0000 Organization: University of Salford Subject: Re: Test spacing To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980206.095006.78@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 13:13:29 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c > Hi > > My contribution to the subject of the size of spaces after full stops is to > draw attention to a small book by Eric Gill, who designed the typeface carrying > his name, entitled 'An Essay on Typography'. > > He is very interested in the fact that unless text is deliberately manipulated > for a specific purpose, its main function is to be read as easily as possible. > He maintained that to this end, spaces should be as small as possible, since we > separate words in our minds as we read. While he was in charge of the Nonesuch > Press, he insisted that thin spaces should be used. A thin space is 20% of an > em, an em being a space equal to the point size of the type in use. There will, > of course, be times when larger spaces at the end of sentences are beneficial > in slowing down the pace of reading. > > He hated justified type except for very long lines, because the extra space in > justified type makes reading more difficult. It is very difficult to get > justified type which does not show rivers of white space running down the page. > Justified type is used only because the page overall looks smarter, but it is > not so easy to read. I haven=91t got the references to hand but research has been > done which supports that. My work has been very much influenced by his teaching. > > Many of the effects used today have resulted from the use of the typewriter > with its monospaced single face type. Emphasis could be gained by underlining. > There is no need to underline when a bold or italic face can be used. > Underlining, tends to compete with the text rather than enhancing it. > I agree with the last point - underlining should be banned. > Best wishes > Berni > =20 > > --=20 > Bernard G. Hill Tel/Fax: 01633 880197 > Zion, Church Road > Undy, Newport e-mail bernard.hill@virgin.net > Monmouthshire NP6 3EN=20 > > > > To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk > with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l > To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Visit my web site: http://rampage.ml.org/users/~peter/ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 6 13:49:31 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56622 for opro ; Fri, 06 Feb 98 13:49:30 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886759600:05:17741:85; Fri, 06 Feb 98 10:06:40 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0604051; 6 Feb 98 10:06 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id be2010437; 6 Feb 98 10:04 GMT From: "Bernard G. Hill" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 09:48:33 +0000 Organization: Subject: Typography To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980206.094833.46@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 05 Feb 1998 22:07:19 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Hello again, I am sorry that I was totally ignorant of the correlation between sexual deviance and typographic layout, when I drew attention to the work of Eric Gill. My appologies for this stupid mistake. On a serious note, I would like to suggest that fixed spaces of different values, such as those available in 'Pagemaker'=AE be implemented in OP. Not that these would be used for general work but they are useful for that special place. I know kerning can be used, but that is not always convenient.=20 Someone asked about achieving an en space. Numerals are on an en body, so if any digit is used and the type colour set to white this will do as a work around for the odd occasion. If the numeral used in this way is given a style, then changing the type colour will enable these 'hidden' characters to be found should the need arise. On thing I would like to be able to see and easily change without going through menus, is the leading which is being used at the cursor point in the text. Could this be part of the the Info Palette? When setting up display panels, as opposed to normal text, I find it very useful to be able to change the leading to get the vertical spacing just as I want it. Multiple line spacing is too course an adjustment much of the time. Best wishes to all, Berni. --=20 Bernard G. Hill Tel/Fax: 01633 880197 Zion, Church Road Undy, Newport e-mail bernard.hill@virgin.net Monmouthshire NP6 3EN=20 To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 6 13:49:37 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56624 for opro ; Fri, 06 Feb 98 13:49:35 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886759662:15:07288:81; Fri, 06 Feb 98 10:07:42 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0605676; 6 Feb 98 10:07 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ay2010437; 6 Feb 98 10:03 GMT From: "Peter Daniel" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 09:50:30 +0000 Organization: University of Salford Subject: Menus To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980206.095030.18@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 13:33:34 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Can anyone explain how I can re-arange the menu structure of OvationPro slightly. I have found the files that create the menus but so far editing them has met with little success. Although I realize this is not the view of the development team I would prefer Applets to add them selves to the logical menu rather than the applets menu. For example 'Version' and 'Access' should be on the file menu next to 'Info' Similarly the menu options for the colour, page and style pallets would go nicely on the end of the 'View' menu. Does anyone else agree or am I just being awkward. Ideally I would like an applet that allows you to edit the menus by dragging and dropping items from one menu to another and even let you create your own menu headings and items. Any takers? Peter ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Visit my web site: http://rampage.ml.org/users/~peter/ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 6 13:49:42 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56626 for opro ; Fri, 06 Feb 98 13:49:40 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886759704:15:07602:80; Fri, 06 Feb 98 10:08:24 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ac0607367; 6 Feb 98 10:08 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id bi2010437; 6 Feb 98 10:05 GMT From: David Pilling Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 09:53:07 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980206.095307.94@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 04 Feb 98 18:55:00 GMT X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c From: Nigel Parker >I use the Ellipsis module from, ISTR, Justin Fletcher. Whenever you type >three dots in a row it will type three backspaces followed by the ellipsis >cahracter! I have it installed in my boot sequence - it's great. From: Rupert Thompson >!Expand already does this. A pair of hyphens become an en-rule; an >en-rule followed by a hyphen becomes an em-rule, and an em-rule followed >by a hyphen becomes a bullet point. And then a bullet point followed by >a hyphen becomes a mid-line point. Other things like \x become a >multiplication sign. All in real-time as-you-type. And >freely downloadable from my website. Botom line something akin to the ligature applet should be able to handle all these special characters. From: Rob Hemmings >I have exactly the same problems that Alan Adams has explained with runaround >curves - they really do seem very difficult to use easily and effectively no >matter what the error setting is. However, thanks Alan for the excellent idea >above - I'd stupidly forgotten all about OvationPro's abilty to draw frames of >any shape and use them to repel text! I think you should also be able to use the auto-runaround and then edit the results by hand. From: "Roger Darlington" >It is an A4 landscape-format book with each page split into two >equal sections down the middle. At the top of each section is a >drawing, at the bottom explanatory text. I can think of two approaches. One is as you hinted to use text stories and embed the pictures in them. The text of pictures and page throws must of course be put into the master frames in the document, and not into the master pages. Frames will have to be big enough to allow for the default indent. I can't see why that won't work. Plan B, is that when you want a new 'section' you use the insert page feature to create a new page with empty picture boxes. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 6 13:49:49 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56628 for opro ; Fri, 06 Feb 98 13:49:47 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 886759727:05:18723:80; Fri, 06 Feb 98 10:08:47 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0605473; 6 Feb 98 10:08 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id bk2010437; 6 Feb 98 10:05 GMT From: Ian MacDougall Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 09:54:18 +0000 Organization: Beebug Ltd Subject: 2.45 and the list To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980206.095418.02@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 09:46:44 +0100 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c In message you wrote: > Maybe Ian wants to repeat details about how to get the upgrade from > 245->248 (or 246 using the webupgrades to get 248). This is address, > pricing, payment method, original disk return? etc. Return of original disc 1 and 2 with a hard backed SAE for return. As you can see below this alarms people. In message <57w3WJAapJ20Ewtt@mk-net.demon.co.uk> you wrote: > Having finally got round to installing 2.46 in preparation for the > upgrade to 2.48, I came across the following problem: > > The 2.45 -> 2.46 upgrde pack consists only of disks 1 & 2, in exchange > for the 2.45 copies. In the 2.46 !ReadMe it states that !System has > moved from disk 2 to disk 3. The !Install process gets its knickers in > a right twist when it can't find !System on disc 3, and aborts. > > 2.46 seems to work OK with 2.45's modules, but am I courting problems by > running it this way? > > Furthermore, I now no longer have a complete installation package, so > can't completely reload OPro should that disaster occur! I'm definately > courting trouble that way! > Any advice anyone? Can/will you send me disk 3, Ian?? Well it is all a bit of a hotch potch, but 2.45 and 2.46 are very similar. Since you installed 2.45 your system will have been upgraded, it is only the picker module that is added, if memory serves. You need to you install only to install the program, it effectively copies all the rest of the discs over as they are which you can do manually. I basically didn't want to send out three discs *free* when two would do. If anyone suffers a system failure so severe that their hard disc is wiped along with all of their backups I'll gladly send them the picker module. In message <802565A1.005ECC4A.00@buffer1.HQ.quantel> you wrote: > Does this mean the list is run manually? All the mailing lists I've dealt > with (admitedly in the UNIX world) were automatic and didn't really need > any looking after. It was my intention to move the mailling list to our Linux machine and run it under majordomo or listserv. The current system could probably be more automated, but I don't want to think about it just yet and it always seems easier to stick with something that vaguely works rather than move to something new. There is quite a lot of manual intervention required, so if you could all be a bit more careful about where you send you posts and limit the content of your posts to that which is relevant I think things would be easier for me (for example I still read all the posts even though David does all the hard work because people continue to send signoff / signon requests to ovationp-l instead of maillist and we even had some 'helpful' chap trying to warn us all of a ***** VIRUS ALERT *****, do not open email entitled etc etc). -- Ian MacDougall Beebug Ltd To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 10 13:52:45 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56932 for opro ; Tue, 10 Feb 98 13:52:43 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887102760:12:11832:85; Tue, 10 Feb 98 09:26:00 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0610303; 10 Feb 98 9:25 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id af1001499; 10 Feb 98 9:24 GMT From: "andy.ling@quantel.com" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 09:17:35 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: OEFPro version 1.20 To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980210.091735.65@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 10:43:09 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c > !OEFPro works in conjunction with Easy Font Professional to try to > avoid the 'Missing font' error on loading a document which contains > deactivated fonts. It tries to activate such fonts invisibly. Is there a version that works with Looksystems Font Directory Pro? Andy Ling To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 10 13:52:50 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56934 for opro ; Tue, 10 Feb 98 13:52:49 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887102791:15:25650:83; Tue, 10 Feb 98 09:26:31 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0610807; 10 Feb 98 9:26 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aj1001499; 10 Feb 98 9:25 GMT From: Peter Blenkinsop Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 09:19:29 +0000 Organization: Subject: Selecting areas To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980210.091929.35@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 1998 14:30:16 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Is it possible to get OvationPro to select an area on a page which is not whole lines. For example if a document is in two columns, tabs or space separated, can OP be made to select the right hand column only? I'd like to do this to get out lists of names when they are typed onto a page. -- This is my signature using Pluto Contained in the last character of this line is the secret of the universe. Rats!! I've run out of space for the last character. Peter Blenkinsop To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 10 13:52:54 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56936 for opro ; Tue, 10 Feb 98 13:52:53 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887102796:15:25659:82; Tue, 10 Feb 98 09:26:36 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ai0610540; 10 Feb 98 9:26 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ai1001499; 10 Feb 98 9:25 GMT From: Alan Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 09:17:14 +0000 Organization: Subject: 2.48 and applets To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980210.091714.00@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 17:42:57 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I have a problem with applets can anybody offer any advice please. I have down loaded v2.48 and carefully the followed instructions to upgrade my current version (2.46) The program runs but the menu does not show applets the last item being misc. I have reinstalled all the applets as per instructions. In fact I have reinstalled starting from scratch every thing 3 times but still without sucess. Help! Alan Esplen Great Waltham, Essex, England. Check out Anne & Alans Home Page http://www.btinternet.com/~a.esplen email: a.esplen@btinternet.com To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 10 13:52:59 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56938 for opro ; Tue, 10 Feb 98 13:52:58 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887102896:05:27364:81; Tue, 10 Feb 98 09:28:16 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0611607; 10 Feb 98 9:27 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aq1001499; 10 Feb 98 9:27 GMT From: Mr T J Chubb Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 09:20:10 +0000 Organization: Subject: Colour Supp 1.02 To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980210.092010.89@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 98 21:34:05 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I have tried to upgrade Colour Supplement to version 1.02 and have followed the instrucitons which accompanied the upgrade. Unfortunately, when I try to reload OPro, I get an error message about trap handlers and stacks and OPro will not load. I have had to revert to version 1.00. Any ideas? Many thanks, Tom C. -- --. --. --. --. : : --- --- .---------------------------------------------. |_| |_| | _ | | | | |_ | |Internet provider for all Acorn RISC machines| | | |\ | | | | |\| | | '---------------------------------------------' | | | \ |_| |_| | | |__ | tomc@argonet.co.uk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 10 13:53:04 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56940 for opro ; Tue, 10 Feb 98 13:53:02 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887102912:12:12929:85; Tue, 10 Feb 98 09:28:32 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ae0610807; 10 Feb 98 9:27 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ao1001499; 10 Feb 98 9:26 GMT From: Dr A G Gray Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 09:16:28 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980210.091628.07@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 98 14:18:58 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Fri 6 Feb 98 (09:50:51 +0000), rayd@argonet.co.uk wrote: ....after my comments on using !Quotes for special characters: >> And two full-stops make an ellipsis. > >What happenes when you write a sentence ending in an abbreviation etc.. I've never considered this: it doesn't 'look right' with two full stops though. Sort of hiccup rather than ellipsis ;-) >Perhaps three full stops should make an elipsis? !Quotes only counts *two* keypresses. And using OP's 'Expand abbreviations' won't work without a space before the three full stops... -- Alan.Gray@argonet.co.uk Dr A.G.Gray. Great Warley, Essex. UK http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/alan.gray N 51 33'58" E 00 17'35" G3XQU (DXCC=323/328) Acorn RiscPC S/A 202MHz To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 10 13:53:09 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56942 for opro ; Tue, 10 Feb 98 13:53:08 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887102918:05:27478:82; Tue, 10 Feb 98 09:28:38 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0611553; 10 Feb 98 9:28 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ak1001499; 10 Feb 98 9:25 GMT From: Colin Thompson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 09:19:49 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: A Plea To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980210.091949.51@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 22:03:21 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On 06 Feb, Alan wrote: > As for slagging off Eric Gill one of the world's greatest Typographers > thats the absolute pits. I'm not slagging off his work but he was a SERIOUSLY weird and perverted guy. Read his biography. I think Gill Sans in excellent and I even know it isn't the font used by London Transport. He also was a pretty unoriginal sculptor and artist. -- Colin Thompson Mail to - colinet@atlantis.aust.com Web site - http://www.atlantis.aust.com/~colinet To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 10 13:53:14 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56944 for opro ; Tue, 10 Feb 98 13:53:13 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887102927:15:26473:81; Tue, 10 Feb 98 09:28:47 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0611628; 10 Feb 98 9:28 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ap1001499; 10 Feb 98 9:26 GMT From: Stefan Bellon Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 09:16:51 +0000 Organization: Subject: Where to upgrade Ovation Pro? To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980210.091651.88@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 17:44:40 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On 04 Feb, David Pilling wrote: [snip a lot] > From the web logs, it seems about 33% of OPro users may have upgraded. Sorry, I subscribed just a few days ago and therefore I don't know anything about a new version. But I see you all writing about version 2.48! I own version 2.46. Where is that web site where I can download the upgrade from? TIA. Greetings, -- _____ _____ ____ ____ ____ _ _ | ___/_ _| __| __/ __ | \| | Stefan Bellon |___ | | | | __| __| __ | | bellonsn@trick.informatik.uni-stuttgart.de /_____| |_| |____|_| |_||_|_|\_| sbellon@studbox.uni-stuttgart.de To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 10 13:53:20 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56946 for opro ; Tue, 10 Feb 98 13:53:18 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887102982:05:27954:81; Tue, 10 Feb 98 09:29:42 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0612110; 10 Feb 98 9:29 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ba1001499; 10 Feb 98 9:28 GMT From: Rupert Thompson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 09:18:20 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Double spaces To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980210.091820.80@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 12:35:23 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Fri 06 Feb, Dave Allen wrote: > On Wed 04 Feb, Nigel Parker wrote: > > On Tue, 3 Feb 1998, Nic Cox wrote: > > > > [double space stuff] > > : An ellipsis has a width of more than three periods. Hands up all those people > > : who > > : type three periods (as I have in this mail) instead of occupying the "proper" > > : amount > > : of space on the line! How I miss those days melting lead! > > > > I use the Ellipsis module from, ISTR, Justin Fletcher. Whenever you type > > three dots in a row it will type three backspaces followed by the ellipsis > > cahracter! I have it installed in my boot sequence - it's great. > > > Now come on you fellers! What is an ellipsis and what do you use it for? 'Ellipsis' is Greek for 'leaving out' -- it's the sequence of three dots that you use to indicate that something has been omitted. There's a special character for it in most fonts. And to the point: I've update !THe. Version 1.50 now automatically converts a sequence of three dots into an ellipsis character, and converts them back into dots again when you delete one of them. Just like the ligatures applet for fi and fl ligatures. -- Rupert Thompson Queens' College, Cambridge, CB3 9ET, UK Research Fellow http://rjet1.quns.cam.ac.uk/ To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 10 13:53:26 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56948 for opro ; Tue, 10 Feb 98 13:53:24 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887103009:05:28031:82; Tue, 10 Feb 98 09:30:09 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0612282; 10 Feb 98 9:29 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id bd1001499; 10 Feb 98 9:28 GMT From: David Pilling Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 09:18:42 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980210.091842.51@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 06 Feb 98 19:24:32 GMT X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c From: Brian Adam >The save box offers DDL format. How useful is this? Very! >What other applications can read it? None. The advantages of DDL are. That it supports everything that OPro does. No other format is going to do that. DDL allows you to see the structure of documents in a readable form - lets you fix things or do large scale editing of documents in a text editor. DDL is an open interface to OPro documents - compare with the situation surrounding loading Impression files. It's also a common denominator for import/export modules. Finally DDL is often a way of cleaning up documents, export as DDL and reload. From: Rob Hemmings >I definitely like this feature but is there any chance the underlines could be >made a little thinner? I feel they look a bit ugly at the current width. Spelling mistakes always look ugly. I could put a big red S through each word if you want. It does have to be eye catching. From: "Bernard G. Hill" >On a serious note, I would like to suggest that fixed spaces of different >values, such as those available in 'Pagemaker'=AE be implemented in OP. A very simple extension would be to allow codes for fixed jumps in horizontal or vertical directions. That would open the way to many things. >On thing I would like to be able to see and easily change without going through >menus, is the leading which is being used at the cursor point in the text. >Could this be part of the the Info Palette? Space is limited on the info pal. Could be an addon palette though. I recall defining some key presses in this list a few months back to allow easy stepping of leading. From: "Peter Daniel" >Can anyone explain how I can re-arange the menu structure of >OvationPro slightly. >Although I realize this is not the view of the development team I >would prefer Applets to add them selves to the logical menu rather >than the applets menu. Some applets do this. For example Arrange sticks itself on the object menu. A menu editor is doable, but a significant project. I think the plan would be to laydown that menus were going to be coded along regular lines. At the moment they tend to be 'optimised' using programmers tricks. You'd end up with a menu 'compiler' which took a design and output the script files necessary. David Pilling To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 10 13:53:32 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56950 for opro ; Tue, 10 Feb 98 13:53:30 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887103029:12:13855:81; Tue, 10 Feb 98 09:30:29 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0612463; 10 Feb 98 9:30 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id be1001499; 10 Feb 98 9:29 GMT From: Tim King Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 09:20:33 +0000 Organization: Subject: Embedded To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980210.092033.63@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 10:21:50 +1200 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Fri 06 Feb, David Pilling wrote: > > From: "Roger Darlington" > > >It is an A4 landscape-format book with each page split into two > >equal sections down the middle. At the top of each section is a > >drawing, at the bottom explanatory text. > > I can think of two approaches. > > One is as you hinted to use text stories and embed the pictures in them. > The text of pictures and page throws must of course be put into the master > frames in the document, and not into the master pages. Frames will have to > be big enough to allow for the default indent. I can't see why that won't > work. > > Plan B, is that when you want a new 'section' you use the insert page > feature to create a new page with empty picture boxes. > > Sure. Now, related... When I make up a book with lots of illustrations I start off by embedding them (after finishing what I determine is all the editing, of course!). Then I'll do the general formatting, and then, once everything is just right, I'll 'unembed' them and place them in their final positions (and tidy up any loose formatting that might generate). Fine, except that then, invariably, at the last minute, along come some more editorial changes, and the picture placement gets thrown to etc. (similar to Roger's issue). I've never been particularly happy with the way that embedding works ie sees the graphic as a text character - though it does seem to be the de facto standard afaik. It's always struck me as a bit of a work around. The picture's not really a character, so why define it as one? Would it be possible to mark their positions in some other way - like eg with a bookmark (or similar)? The advantages would be that text flow would more accurately resemble the final (wysiwyg - from the start), and there'd be less mucking around at the end. And my last minute edits wouldn't completely stuff up the document! tim -- d e - S i g . ph +64 9 478.3114 To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 10 13:53:37 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56952 for opro ; Tue, 10 Feb 98 13:53:36 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887103286:05:00307:89; Tue, 10 Feb 98 09:34:46 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0614492; 10 Feb 98 9:34 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id az1001499; 10 Feb 98 9:27 GMT From: Rupert Thompson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 09:17:58 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: DDL - how useful is it? To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980210.091758.23@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 10:42:52 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Fri 06 Feb, Brian Adam wrote: > The save box offers DDL format. How useful is this? > What other applications can read it? If you wanted to write a program to convert OP documents into, say, Word or TeX, you'd want to do it via DDL format, which is nice and easy to parse. Similarly, going the other way round, you wrestle with the Word binary format and create a DDL file, and then leave OP to worry about creating the binary format from it. I haven't needed to do so since I switched to OP, but when I was using Impression I had some documents which I needed to process -- one, for example, was an alphabetical index of words in Mycenaean. I needed a reverse alphabetical order index (eg. wa-na-ka gets indexed as ka-na-wa). If I'd exported as a text file, I'd've lost some significant information encoded as styles. DDF (Impression's equivalent of DDL) was a handy half-way house for a custom C program to work on. -- Rupert Thompson Queens' College, Cambridge, CB3 9ET, UK Research Fellow http://rjet1.quns.cam.ac.uk/ To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 10 13:53:44 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA56954 for opro ; Tue, 10 Feb 98 13:53:42 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887103357:15:29227:81; Tue, 10 Feb 98 09:35:57 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0614546; 10 Feb 98 9:35 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id bg1001499; 10 Feb 98 9:29 GMT From: tony van der Hoff Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 09:19:05 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: 2.45 and the list To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980210.091905.56@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 14:30:08 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c In message <19980206.095418.02@risc.demon.co.uk>, Ian MacDougall writes > >In message <57w3WJAapJ20Ewtt@mk-net.demon.co.uk> you wrote: >> >> Furthermore, I now no longer have a complete installation package, so >> can't completely reload OPro should that disaster occur! I'm definately >> courting trouble that way! >> Any advice anyone? Can/will you send me disk 3, Ian?? > >Well it is all a bit of a hotch potch, but 2.45 and 2.46 are >very similar. Since you installed 2.45 your system will have been >upgraded, it is only the picker module that is added, if memory serves. > Sorry, I don't understand that statement. Are you saying that the 2.45 !System is, or is not, compatible with 2.46? What is the picker module, and what is the current version number? >You need to you install only to install the program, it effectively >copies all the rest of the discs over as they are which you can do >manually. > I think you're saying that if I need to re-install just do so for the program files, without any of the other bits, and copy the rest manually. Hmm... >I basically didn't want to send out three discs *free* when two >would do. If anyone suffers a system failure so severe that >their hard disc is wiped along with all of their backups I'll >gladly send them the picker module. > Well, now, doesn't this just deserve some comment? In the first place, I really welcome the opportunity to upgrade to 2.48 for free, and must congratulate you on the effort you've put in to the upgrade suite. In the second place, my main objective was to inform you of a hole in the 2.45 to 2.46 upgrade procedure. I'm disappointed that you haven't accepted it as such. However, what you've just said (and, I'm sure, you didn't mean) displays a penny-pinching attitude worthy of the BillyGates himself! One of the joys of the Acorn scene always has been the professionalism of the suppliers. Surely Beebug dos not now want to undermine this single- handedly? This situation arises out or your (OK, Beebug's) decision to issue 2.45 as the *final free* uprgade to some users, and then to supersede it with 2.46 to others. Although we complained about this at the time, we were placated, and didn't make too big a deal out of it, because you assured us that the differences were so minor, that no-one would be disadvantaged. Because of the upgrade problems this is now patently not the case. I recognise with gratitude that you compensated for this by making 2.46 available by disk-swap to 2.45 users. It is so sad that you've then gone and spoiled it all by not exchanging all 3 disks. I'm sure this is not your decision alone, but perhaps you'd like to inform your management that Beebug seems to be spoiling the upgrade for the proverbial hap'orth of tar, especially after all the effort you put in to the internet upgrade. In any case, your logic is fundamentally flawed, as you could have asked for three disks back so the extra disk could have been recycled (I have certainly received recycled disks from you in the past). Postage was pre-paid anyway, (by SAE) so that wouldn't have made any difference. Any extra expense would have been at most minimal. I was not asked for any contribution to the upgrade to 2.46, but (with the exception that I believe I should have received it in the first place) would have been quite prepared to pay (say) a fiver to cover the cost of disks. Ultmately, I suspect it doesn't matter in my case, I have enogh experience of Risc-OS to know what's going on. However, to call the present situation a hotch-potch is putting it mildly. It is sad that it is David's reputation which will suffer along with Beebug's. -- Tony van der Hoff | E-Mail: tony@mk-net.demon.co.uk Buckinghamshire, England | ---------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Feb 12 14:05:29 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57117 for opro ; Thu, 12 Feb 98 14:05:28 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887282845:05:16495:80; Thu, 12 Feb 98 11:27:25 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ah0625789; 12 Feb 98 11:26 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ad1028304; 12 Feb 98 11:25 GMT From: Paul Hutton Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 09:14:14 +0000 Organization: Subject: OEFPro V 1.20 To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980212.091414.74@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 18:43:19 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Does anyoje know where I can get hold of !OEFPro 1.20 to avoid the above messages? E-mails to me please, rather than crowd the list. -- Paul Hutton on an Acorn Risc PC with Strong Arm "Peu s'en fallut que je ne mourusse d'ennui dans mon village" A beautiful French sentence... To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Feb 12 14:05:34 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57120 for opro ; Thu, 12 Feb 98 14:05:33 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887282872:15:17042:80; Thu, 12 Feb 98 11:27:52 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0626076; 12 Feb 98 11:27 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aj1028304; 12 Feb 98 11:26 GMT From: John Hollier Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 09:11:43 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Selecting areas To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980212.091143.35@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 10:47:25 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On 10 Feb, Peter Blenkinsop wrote: > Is it possible to get OvationPro to select an area on a page which is not > whole lines. For example if a document is in two columns, tabs or space > separated, can OP be made to select the right hand column only? > I'd like to do this to get out lists of names when they are typed onto a > page. Peter I don't know about OP but StrongEd can do this sort of thing. Any good? John Hollier -- John D Hollier Canterbury UK To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Feb 12 14:05:39 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57122 for opro ; Thu, 12 Feb 98 14:05:38 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887282935:12:20908:80; Thu, 12 Feb 98 11:28:55 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0626661; 12 Feb 98 11:28 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ak1028304; 12 Feb 98 11:26 GMT From: Alan Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 09:12:05 +0000 Organization: Subject: 2.48 and applets To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980212.091205.21@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 11:19:58 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I have already posted this feb 6 but it has failed to appear I have a problem with applets can anybody offer any advice please. I have down loaded v2.48 and carefully the followed instructions to upgrade my current version (2.46) The program runs but the menu does not show applets the last item being misc. I have reinstalled all the applets as per instructions. In fact I have reinstalled, starting from scratch, every thing 3 times but still not working . Help! Alan Esplen Great Waltham, Essex, England. email: a.esplen@btinternet.com To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Feb 12 14:05:44 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57124 for opro ; Thu, 12 Feb 98 14:05:42 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887282937:05:17061:82; Thu, 12 Feb 98 11:28:57 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ac0625789; 12 Feb 98 11:28 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id an1028304; 12 Feb 98 11:27 GMT From: Alf Chamings Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 09:15:01 +0000 Organization: Subject: Unable to load 2.48 To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980212.091501.98@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 11:41:00 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c After a troubled start with 2.48 which I thought I had seen the back of after I re-upgraded using a fresh 2.46 and then replaced !Version as advised, I now find I cannot load OPro at all. I get: 'No stack for trap handler. Internal error branch through zero at &03813AE8, pc=00000000:registers at 00119494' Help! Alf -- mailto:AlfChamings@ed.ac.uk Health and Safety for the Royal Infirmary of Edinburgh tel +44 131 536 3251 fax +44 131 536 3283 http://www.med.ed.ac.uk/hew/ for occupational and environmental health To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Feb 12 14:05:49 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57126 for opro ; Thu, 12 Feb 98 14:05:48 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887282938:15:17219:82; Thu, 12 Feb 98 11:28:58 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0626643; 12 Feb 98 11:28 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id am1028304; 12 Feb 98 11:27 GMT From: MattLB Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 09:13:53 +0000 Organization: UKC Subject: Re: Selecting areas To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980212.091353.21@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 22:06:07 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Peter Blenkinsop wrote: > > Is it possible to get OvationPro to select an area on a page which is not > whole lines. For example if a document is in two columns, tabs or space > separated, can OP be made to select the right hand column only? Despite being generally inferior to OP, one feature of MSWord that I do like is being able to Alt-Drag to select any rectangular area of text, in just the way you describe. AFAIK you can't do this in OP, but it's definitely one for the wishlist. MattLB To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Feb 12 14:05:53 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57128 for opro ; Thu, 12 Feb 98 14:05:52 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887282950:12:20992:80; Thu, 12 Feb 98 11:29:10 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0626610; 12 Feb 98 11:29 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id al1028304; 12 Feb 98 11:27 GMT From: Frank Lester Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 09:13:10 +0000 Organization: Subject: Total page number To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980212.091310.79@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 10:28:20 +0100 (BST) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c My previous query seems to have got lost in the system. Is there any way to access the total number of pages in a document? The information is there in the info box, I would like to access that to use as an insert in a document. e.g. for faxes:- "page one of pages." so it will automatically put in the correct no of pages. Thanks, -- Frank Lester "Omahanui" Waitangi Falls Road RD1 Waiuku,New Zealand To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Feb 12 14:05:58 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57130 for opro ; Thu, 12 Feb 98 14:05:57 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887282992:05:17243:80; Thu, 12 Feb 98 11:29:52 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0627156; 12 Feb 98 11:29 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ao1028304; 12 Feb 98 11:28 GMT From: Michael Ben-Gershon Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 09:15:45 +0000 Organization: My Office Subject: Right to left text bit in Draw Files not recognised To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980212.091545.72@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 09:07:05 +0200 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Ovation Pro (along with Impression and ArtWorks) ignores the right-to-left text bit in Draw Files. This prevents it from importing DrawFiles with right-to-left text from EasiWriter/TechWriter, which is a shame. As there are no word-wrap problems with simple text in Draw files, this should not be too much of a problem to fix. Is it possible? Michael Ben-Gershon mybg@netvision.net.il To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Feb 12 14:06:02 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57132 for opro ; Thu, 12 Feb 98 14:06:01 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887283048:15:18057:80; Thu, 12 Feb 98 11:30:48 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ac0627489; 12 Feb 98 11:30 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id av1028304; 12 Feb 98 11:29 GMT From: Ariancylch Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 09:10:37 +0000 Organization: Lylmik Supervisory body Subject: Re: DDL - how useful is it? To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980212.091037.62@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 23:18:04 +1200 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c In message <19980210.091758.23@risc.demon.co.uk> Rupert Thompson wrote: > On Fri 06 Feb, Brian Adam wrote: > > The save box offers DDL format. How useful is this? > > What other applications can read it? > > If you wanted to write a program to convert OP documents into, say, Word > or TeX, [snip] Speaking of which, has anyone gone anyway into an OP->TeX translator? -- I won't use words again | Faith | May god stand between you they don't mean what I meant |manages| and harm in all the empty they don't say what I said | - JMS | places where you must walk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Feb 12 14:06:07 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57134 for opro ; Thu, 12 Feb 98 14:06:06 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887283097:15:18443:81; Thu, 12 Feb 98 11:31:37 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0627156; 12 Feb 98 11:31 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aw1028304; 12 Feb 98 11:29 GMT From: Ariancylch Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 09:11:21 +0000 Organization: Lylmik Supervisory body Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980212.091121.52@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 23:45:20 +1200 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c In message <19980210.091842.51@risc.demon.co.uk> David Pilling wrote: > From: Rob Hemmings > > > I definitely like this feature but is there any chance the > > underlines could be made a little thinner? I feel they look a bit > > ugly at the current width. > > Spelling mistakes always look ugly. I could put a big red S through > each word if you want. It does have to be eye catching. If you're going to change it, put a small 'sp' in red ink in the left hand margin, and gently underline the offending word. -- I won't use words again | Faith | May god stand between you they don't mean what I meant |manages| and harm in all the empty they don't say what I said | - JMS | places where you must walk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Feb 12 14:06:12 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57136 for opro ; Thu, 12 Feb 98 14:06:11 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887283100:15:18469:81; Thu, 12 Feb 98 11:31:40 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0627836; 12 Feb 98 11:31 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ax1028304; 12 Feb 98 11:29 GMT From: Ray Dawson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 09:12:26 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Selecting areas To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980212.091226.80@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 16:50:33 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On 10 Feb, Peter Blenkinsop wrote: > Is it possible to get OvationPro to select an area on a page which is not > whole lines. For example if a document is in two columns, tabs or space > separated, can OP be made to select the right hand column only? > I'd like to do this to get out lists of names when they are typed onto a > page. No, but I have heard that the latest StrongEd can do it. If so, export the text and work on it. Ray D -- ===================================. | M a g R a y Document Services | Ray Dawson Tel: 0181 864 7208 | the print and braille specialists | rayd@argonet.co.uk '===================================' http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/rayd To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Feb 12 14:06:17 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57138 for opro ; Thu, 12 Feb 98 14:06:16 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887283119:15:18499:90; Thu, 12 Feb 98 11:31:59 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0628047; 12 Feb 98 11:31 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id az1028304; 12 Feb 98 11:30 GMT From: Nico ter Haar Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 09:15:24 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Where to upgrade Ovation Pro? To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980212.091524.25@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 13:40:35 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c In on Tue 10 Feb, Stefan Bellon wrote: > On 04 Feb, David Pilling wrote: > > [snip a lot] > > > From the web logs, it seems about 33% of OPro users may have upgraded. > > Sorry, I subscribed just a few days ago and therefore I don't know > anything about a new version. But I see you all writing about version > 2.48! I own version 2.46. Where is that web site where I can download > the upgrade from? TIA. > I think it's time for a FAQ and maybe Hints&Tips list. nico -- Nico ter Haar, StrongARM 202MHz at home! nico.terhaar@tip.nl ----> FoonGrep2 now supports the December 1997 CDfoon ! Pulstar Pages WWW site -- http://www.tip.nl/users/nico.terhaar/ To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Feb 12 14:06:22 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57140 for opro ; Thu, 12 Feb 98 14:06:21 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887283132:15:18624:81; Thu, 12 Feb 98 11:32:12 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0628104; 12 Feb 98 11:31 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ay1028304; 12 Feb 98 11:30 GMT From: Alan Muscat Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 09:14:39 +0000 Organization: Grapevine Digital Arts Subject: Re: DDL - how useful is it? To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980212.091439.31@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 00:50:46 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c In message <19980210.091758.23@risc.demon.co.uk> you wrote: > On Fri 06 Feb, Brian Adam wrote: > > The save box offers DDL format. How useful is this? > > What other applications can read it? > > If you wanted to write a program to convert OP documents into, say, Word If I created a simple file in OPro, and then saved out as DDL, would Word be able to load it and keep some the formatting of the original document. I have a 50 page report to do, shortly and the client wants it done in Word. It waouls be nice to be able to do a fair wack of the doc in OPro and them convert to Word. -- Alan Muscat *************** Grapevine Digital Arts *********************** ************** http://www.gvine.demon.co.uk ********************* For the correct email address make demo read demon. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Feb 12 14:06:27 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57142 for opro ; Thu, 12 Feb 98 14:06:25 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887283146:12:22142:81; Thu, 12 Feb 98 11:32:26 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0628322; 12 Feb 98 11:31 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ba1028304; 12 Feb 98 11:30 GMT From: Philip Powell Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 09:16:29 +0000 Organization: Sharp Edge Subject: Re: Where to upgrade Ovation Pro? To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980212.091629.97@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 12:06:55 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c In message <19980210.091651.88@risc.demon.co.uk> Stefan Bellon wrote: >On 04 Feb, David Pilling wrote: > >[snip a lot] > >> From the web logs, it seems about 33% of OPro users may have upgraded. > >Sorry, I subscribed just a few days ago and therefore I don't know >anything about a new version. But I see you all writing about version >2.48! I own version 2.46. Where is that web site where I can download >the upgrade from? TIA. > >Greetings, > Try; http://www.beebug.com/software/ovpro/upgrade248/index.html and follow the instructions. HTH -- Philip Powell Looking north across the Derwent Valley and Northumberland to the Cheviot To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Feb 12 14:06:32 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57144 for opro ; Thu, 12 Feb 98 14:06:30 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887283168:12:22421:80; Thu, 12 Feb 98 11:32:48 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0628527; 12 Feb 98 11:32 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id be1028304; 12 Feb 98 11:31 GMT From: Rupert Thompson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 09:10:58 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: OEFPro version 1.20 To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980212.091059.00@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 10:17:00 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Tue 10 Feb, andy.ling@quantel.com wrote: > > !OEFPro works in conjunction with Easy Font Professional to try to > > avoid the 'Missing font' error on loading a document which contains > > deactivated fonts. It tries to activate such fonts invisibly. > > Is there a version that works with Looksystems Font Directory Pro? No, but provided Font Directory Pro provides a similar interface to other programs to be able to turn fonts on and off, it shouldn't be too hard to modify !OEFPro. What happens is that the applet traps a missing font event, sets an OS variable OEFPro$Env, and then runs a BASIC program .!OEFPro.Resources.FontOn. You'd just need to change FontOn to work with a different font manager. Provided, as I say, that there's a similar interface via a SWI or *-command. -- Rupert Thompson Queens' College, Cambridge, CB3 9ET, UK http://rjet1.quns.cam.ac.uk/ (when my computer's on!) To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Feb 12 14:06:37 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57146 for opro ; Thu, 12 Feb 98 14:06:35 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887283224:05:18637:81; Thu, 12 Feb 98 11:33:44 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0627156; 12 Feb 98 11:33 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id bf1028304; 12 Feb 98 11:32 GMT From: Philip Powell Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 09:16:08 +0000 Organization: Sharp Edge Subject: Re: 2.48 and applets To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980212.091608.31@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 12:14:22 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c In message <19980210.091714.00@risc.demon.co.uk> Alan wrote: >I have a problem with applets can anybody offer any advice please. > >I have down loaded v2.48 and carefully the followed instructions >to upgrade my current version (2.46) The program runs but >the menu does not show applets the last item being misc. >I have reinstalled all the applets as per instructions. >In fact I have reinstalled starting from scratch >every thing 3 times but still without sucess. >Help! > > >Alan Esplen Great Waltham, Essex, England. > Assuming the Applets dir is inside !OvPro, you need to double click on an applet for it to become active. If you look in the Applets dir you will probably see that each applet is of the form: !Abbrev- (minus sign on the end) Double click on each applet you want installed so they look like this: !Abbrev (no minus sign on end) HTH -- Philip Powell Looking north across the Derwent Valley and Northumberland to the Cheviot To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Feb 12 14:06:43 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57148 for opro ; Thu, 12 Feb 98 14:06:40 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887283259:05:18938:81; Thu, 12 Feb 98 11:34:19 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0629336; 12 Feb 98 11:34 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id bh1028304; 12 Feb 98 11:32 GMT From: "\"James White (Acorns in Spain" MMDF-Warning: Parse error in original version of preceding line at post.mail.demon.net Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 09:13:31 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980212.091331.38@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 22:24:41 +0100 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Tue 10 Feb, David Pilling wrote: >=20 > > From: "Bernard G. Hill" > > >On thing I would like to be able to see and easily change without goin= g through > >menus, is the leading which is being used at the cursor point in the t= ext. > >Could this be part of the the Info Palette? >=20 > Space is limited on the info pal. Could be an addon palette though. > I recall defining some key presses in this list a few months back > to allow easy stepping of leading. > Here they are, from April '97 :- [............ >Can this be done with a button macro? Yes - good idea! A macro akin to this will increase the leading, { string s,p,q; int n; getleading(s); p=3Dq=3D""; if(schar(s,0)=3D=3D'-' || schar(s,0)=3D=3D'+') p=3Dmids(s,0,1); if(schar(s,slen(s)-1)=3D=3D'%') q=3D"%"; n=3Dstoi(s)+1; s=3Dp+itos(n)+q; setleading(s); } change the +1 to -1 to decrease it. Attach that to a couple of buttons or keys... David Pilling ...........] There are already two button macros for leading, in !Macros.=20 They are 'vshiftup' and 'vshiftdown'. They just need to be ticked to bring them up on the Button Bar. I personally like the one above. Being a bit indolent, I simply reprogrammed 'singlespc' and 'doublespc'. JW --=20 -------------------------------------------- Sibelius in Spain mailto:jacorn@ibm.net Sibelius in Andaluc=EDa mailto:pmoya@valnet.es -------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Feb 12 14:06:50 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57150 for opro ; Thu, 12 Feb 98 14:06:48 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887283297:05:19084:83; Thu, 12 Feb 98 11:34:57 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0629581; 12 Feb 98 11:34 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id bj1028304; 12 Feb 98 11:33 GMT From: David Pilling Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 09:12:47 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980212.091247.35@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 98 14:37:40 GMT X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c From: "andy.ling@quantel.com" >> !OEFPro works in conjunction with Easy Font Professional to try to >> avoid the 'Missing font' error on loading a document which contains >> deactivated fonts. It tries to activate such fonts invisibly. >Is there a version that works with Looksystems Font Directory Pro? No but there could be. From: Peter Blenkinsop >Is it possible to get OvationPro to select an area on a page which is not >whole lines. For example if a document is in two columns, tabs or space >separated, can OP be made to select the right hand column only? No. From: Alan >I have down loaded v2.48 and carefully the followed instructions >to upgrade my current version (2.46) The program runs but >the menu does not show applets the last item being misc. >I have reinstalled all the applets as per instructions. >In fact I have reinstalled starting from scratch >every thing 3 times but still without sucess. Obviously it can't find the applets. This might be because you've changed the variables which point to them (set up in the !Run file) OvationPro$Applets and OvationProApplets$Path. Or you are not copying the applets into the right copy of OPro. From: Mr T J Chubb >I have tried to upgrade Colour Supplement to version 1.02 and have followed the >instrucitons which accompanied the upgrade. Unfortunately, when I try to >reload OPro, I get an error message about trap handlers and stacks and OPro >will not load. I have had to revert to version 1.00. You can only use the new colour supplement with OPro 2.48. If it's the actual upgrade thats going wrong, I'd suggest a nice dainty single click on Freshens start button, otherwise there's the danger of it doing the upgrade twice. From: Stefan Bellon >Sorry, I subscribed just a few days ago and therefore I don't know >anything about a new version. But I see you all writing about version >2.48! I own version 2.46. Where is that web site where I can download >the upgrade from? TIA. The upgrade is now accesible from the OvationPro home page on www.beebug.com. From: Tim King >I've never been particularly happy with the way that embedding works ie sees >the graphic as a text character - though it does seem to be the de facto >standard afaik. It's always struck me as a bit of a work around. The >picture's not really a character, so why define it as one? Would it be >possible to mark their positions in some other way - like eg with a bookmark >(or similar)? The advantages would be that text flow would more accurately >resemble the final (wysiwyg - from the start), and there'd be less mucking For some situations embeded pictures as large characters is OK. Other packages have the concept of pictures which are associated with bits of text or maintain their positions relative to some point in the text. I suppose that as long as you don' want text flow around these frames then it would not be too hard. The other thing which is doable is the embedded frame which text flows around the bottom of. Like an embedded frame appearing in place of a drop cap. The thing which is not doable is the recursive flow, where flow in one text story can (by moving a frame) generate flows in other text stories and so on... From: tony van der Hoff >Sorry, I don't understand that statement. Are you saying that the 2.45 >!System is, or is not, compatible with 2.46? What is the picker module, >and what is the current version number? 2.45 and 2.46 have only slight differences, and these differences are limited to the main !OvnPro application. Just the !RunImage and maybe a script file or two. !System and the colour picker module are part of RISC OS. Most people will have up to date copies of !System, or at least up to date enough ones, independent of OvationPro. I have picker 0.39 July 96, thats on a SA 3.70 machine. >I think you're saying that if I need to re-install just do so for the >program files, without any of the other bits, and copy the rest >manually. Hmm... For the upgrade you only need to install !OvnPro again, in fact its better you don't install anything more. >However, what you've just said (and, I'm sure, you didn't mean) displays >a penny-pinching attitude worthy of the BillyGates himself! For some companies in the Acorn world at the moment, saving time and money is vital. David Pilling To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 13 13:56:40 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57235 for opro ; Fri, 13 Feb 98 13:56:39 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887363448:15:14763:82; Fri, 13 Feb 98 09:50:48 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0626441; 13 Feb 98 9:50 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ac2014771; 13 Feb 98 9:47 GMT From: Peter Howard Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 09:34:52 +0000 Organization: Subject: OvnPro 2.48 To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980213.093452.40@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 14:49:01 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Where do I find the !Version applet, please? Peter H. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 13 13:56:45 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57237 for opro ; Fri, 13 Feb 98 13:56:43 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887363502:12:12767:87; Fri, 13 Feb 98 09:51:42 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ad0627067; 13 Feb 98 9:51 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id am2014771; 13 Feb 98 9:49 GMT From: David H Wild Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 09:34:31 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: OEFPro version 1.20 To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980213.093431.32@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 20:46:07 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On 12 Feb, Rupert Thompson wrote: > > Is there a version that works with Looksystems Font Directory Pro? > No, but provided Font Directory Pro provides a similar interface to > other programs to be able to turn fonts on and off, it shouldn't be too > hard to modify !OEFPro. Font Directory Pro does this for you. Just drag the file to the FontDir icon on the iconbar, and the necessary fonts will be loaded - presuming that you still have them, obviously it won't do anything about fonts in a file from another source which might have used fonts that you don't have. -- __ __ __ __ __ ___ _____________________________________________ |__||__)/ __/ \|\ ||_ | / | || \\__/\__/| \||__ | /...Internet access for all Acorn RISC machines ___________________________/ dhwild@argonet.co.uk Uploaded on Thu,12 Feb 1998.21:21:21 To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 13 13:56:49 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57239 for opro ; Fri, 13 Feb 98 13:56:48 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887363546:05:13640:80; Fri, 13 Feb 98 09:52:26 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0626786; 13 Feb 98 9:51 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id af2014771; 13 Feb 98 9:47 GMT From: Paul Hutton Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 09:36:20 +0000 Organization: Subject: Printing Possibility To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980213.093620.99@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 20:58:41 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c A suggestion... How about a printing option "print current page" and being able to type in page numbers in a dialogue box, to print a non-chronological selection of pages? Just an idea... -- Paul Hutton on an Acorn Risc PC with Strong Arm "Peu s'en fallut que je ne mourusse d'ennui dans mon village" A beautiful French sentence... To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 13 13:56:55 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57241 for opro ; Fri, 13 Feb 98 13:56:54 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887363560:12:13282:81; Fri, 13 Feb 98 09:52:40 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0627401; 13 Feb 98 9:52 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id al2014771; 13 Feb 98 9:49 GMT From: Alf Chamings Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 09:33:45 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Unable to load 2.48 To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980213.093345.60@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 13:51:27 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c > After a troubled start with 2.48 which I thought I had seen the back of > afte>r I re-upgraded using a fresh 2.46 and then replaced !Version as > advised, I no>w find I cannot load OPro at all. > > I get: 'No stack for trap handler. Internal error branch through zero at > &03813AE8, pc=00000000:registers at 00119494' > > Help! I seem to have solved the problem - trouble with my applets again. I think it was just a daft mistake with downloaded applets still in archive form. It is certainly loading ok at the moment. Alf -- mailto:AlfChamings@ed.ac.uk Health and Safety for the Royal Infirmary of Edinburgh tel +44 131 536 3251 fax +44 131 536 3283 http://www.med.ed.ac.uk/hew/ for occupational and environmental health To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 13 13:57:00 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57243 for opro ; Fri, 13 Feb 98 13:56:58 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887363573:05:13734:83; Fri, 13 Feb 98 09:52:53 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ad0627332; 13 Feb 98 9:52 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ak2014771; 13 Feb 98 9:48 GMT From: Richard Cassidy Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 09:32:35 +0000 Organization: Subject: Change of harddrive - install disaster To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980213.093235.22@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 11:30:33 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Well, I've just upgraded my harddrive and got a new IDE interface. So, of course OvationPRo now won't run unless I reinstall it. First the installer won't accept the 2.48 because it says its the wrong version, now the program disc 1 comes up with a pile of errors and installer won't run at all. I'm at the end of a project with a *very* tight deadline - what can I do - I'm begging :( Cheers, Richard -- richard@graphitedesign.co.uk _______________________________________________________________________ Graphite Design & Presentation http://www.graphitedesign.co.uk Information enquiries@graphitedesign.co.uk Sales sales@graphitedesign.co.uk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 13 13:57:05 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57245 for opro ; Fri, 13 Feb 98 13:57:03 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887363587:15:15436:85; Fri, 13 Feb 98 09:53:07 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0627078; 13 Feb 98 9:52 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id an2014771; 13 Feb 98 9:49 GMT From: Rupert Thompson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 09:35:35 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: DDL - how useful is it? To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980213.093535.88@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 15:06:47 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Thu 12 Feb, Ariancylch wrote: > In message <19980210.091758.23@risc.demon.co.uk> > Rupert Thompson wrote: > > > On Fri 06 Feb, Brian Adam wrote: > > > The save box offers DDL format. How useful is this? > > > What other applications can read it? > > > > If you wanted to write a program to convert OP documents into, say, Word > > or TeX, > [snip] > > Speaking of which, has anyone gone anyway into an OP->TeX translator? I didn't choose either of those examples randomly ;-) -- Rupert Thompson Queens' College, Cambridge, CB3 9ET, UK Research Fellow http://rjet1.quns.cam.ac.uk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 13 13:57:12 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57247 for opro ; Fri, 13 Feb 98 13:57:10 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887363598:15:15526:81; Fri, 13 Feb 98 09:53:18 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0626441; 13 Feb 98 9:52 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id au2014771; 13 Feb 98 9:50 GMT From: Chris Chorley Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 09:32:58 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Selecting areas To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980213.093258.86@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 12:12:51 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c >Is it possible to get OvationPro to select an area on a page which is not >whole lines. For example if a document is in two columns, tabs or space >separated, can OP be made to select the right hand column only? > >I'd like to do this to get out lists of names when they are typed onto a >page. Not many text editors provide this, let alone wordprocessors or dtp apps. The best implementation is the Brief text editor for programmers (os/2, dos etc). Brief calls it column marking. There is a reason why this is only found in text editors though - they use a monospaced font, and vertically marking a block of characters is easy. For proportionally spaced fonts (and dtp work) you will be wanting the block to mark to the nearest space/tab etc, and you will get ragged edges. It's high on my wish list, but I'd never bothered asking as I thought it to be a text editing thing, not DTP. If I had this then there's not much reason to use any other program. I would like to be able to export the marked area as text though... (that ellipsis again). Chris. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 13 13:57:17 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57249 for opro ; Fri, 13 Feb 98 13:57:16 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887363603:05:13967:81; Fri, 13 Feb 98 09:53:23 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ah0627865; 13 Feb 98 9:53 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id av2014771; 13 Feb 98 9:51 GMT From: Ariancylch Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 09:33:22 +0000 Organization: Lylmik Supervisory body Subject: Re: Where to upgrade Ovation Pro? To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980213.093322.04@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 04:37:40 +1200 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c In message <19980212.091524.25@risc.demon.co.uk> Nico ter Haar wrote: > In on Tue 10 Feb, Stefan Bellon wrote: > > On 04 Feb, David Pilling wrote: > > > > [snip a lot] > > > > > From the web logs, it seems about 33% of OPro users may have > > > upgraded. > > > > Sorry, I subscribed just a few days ago and therefore I don't know > > anything about a new version. But I see you all writing about > > version 2.48! I own version 2.46. Where is that web site where I can > > download the upgrade from? TIA. > > > I think it's time for a FAQ and maybe Hints&Tips list. The first of which should be mailed to people when they subscribe as their welcome message. Or at least a pointer to it. If The Powers That Be want to farm that work out I'd be more than happy to maintain them... -- I won't use words again | Faith | May god stand between you they don't mean what I meant |manages| and harm in all the empty they don't say what I said | - JMS | places where you must walk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 13 13:57:24 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57251 for opro ; Fri, 13 Feb 98 13:57:21 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887363661:12:13806:80; Fri, 13 Feb 98 09:54:21 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ac0627931; 13 Feb 98 9:53 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aw2014771; 13 Feb 98 9:52 GMT From: "Sveinung W. Tengelsen" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 09:35:15 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Selecting areas To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980213.093515.19@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 15:11:52 +0000 (GMT+1) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Thu 12 Feb, Ray Dawson wrote: > On 10 Feb, Peter Blenkinsop wrote: > > Is it possible to get OvationPro to select an area on a page which is not > > whole lines. For example if a document is in two columns, tabs or space > > separated, can OP be made to select the right hand column only? > > > I'd like to do this to get out lists of names when they are typed onto a > > page. > > No, but I have heard that the latest StrongEd can do it. If so, export the > text and work on it. That's correct - just hold down ALT and select-drag to select vertical blocks of text. It's massively useful under some circumstances. Of course, this raises the issue on wether it's possible and desirable to enable throwback of text from Ovation Pro to external editors. David? :) -- Regards, Sveinung W. Tengelsen ----------------------------------------------------------------------- mailto:pixeleye@sn.no | I have one illusion; http://www.sn.no/~pixeleye/Index.htm | I have no illusions. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 13 13:57:30 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57253 for opro ; Fri, 13 Feb 98 13:57:28 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887363693:15:16074:81; Fri, 13 Feb 98 09:54:53 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ac0627401; 13 Feb 98 9:54 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ax2014771; 13 Feb 98 9:52 GMT From: Ariancylch Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 09:35:59 +0000 Organization: Lylmik Supervisory body Subject: Re: Selecting areas To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980213.093559.44@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 04:34:21 +1200 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c In message <19980212.091353.21@risc.demon.co.uk> MattLB wrote: > Peter Blenkinsop wrote: > > Is it possible to get OvationPro to select an area on a page which > > is not whole lines. For example if a document is in two columns, > > tabs or space separated, can OP be made to select the right hand > > column only? > > Despite being generally inferior to OP, one feature of MSWord that I > do like is being able to Alt-Drag to select any rectangular area of > text, in just the way you describe. AFAIK you can't do this in OP, but > it's definitely one for the wishlist. Words implementation of this (and not just this) needs tidying, slightly, though. I've had some very weird behaviour when trying to apply styles to blocks selected in this way. Word had a habit of inserting a space or something equally odd and wrong. -- I won't use words again | Faith | May god stand between you they don't mean what I meant |manages| and harm in all the empty they don't say what I said | - JMS | places where you must walk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 13 13:57:41 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57255 for opro ; Fri, 13 Feb 98 13:57:37 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887363779:05:14979:80; Fri, 13 Feb 98 09:56:19 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0626786; 13 Feb 98 9:56 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ba2014771; 13 Feb 98 9:53 GMT From: 4qd Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 09:34:07 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Selecting areas To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980213.093407.81@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 98 (13:08:38 +0000) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Thu 12 Feb 98 (09:11:43 +0000), john@thirteen.demon.co.uk wrote: > On 10 Feb, Peter Blenkinsop wrote: > > Is it possible to get OvationPro to select an area on a page which > > is not whole lines. For example if a document is in two columns, tabs > > or space separated, can OP be made to select the right hand column only? > > I'd like to do this to get out lists of names when they are typed > > onto a page. > I don't know about OP but StrongEd can do this sort of thing. StrongEd complements OPro very well. But I'd like to see a variation on colums (probably called tables...) where text flow followed acrows colums - not down them. We have a Price list: it may need editing, or changing into a different currency which involves working on a column. So I've got it set up as separate objects (one per column) so I can work on one object. It's a pain keeping rows aligned, tabs may have been easier. One suggestion I made to DP a while ago was a function similar to PipeDream's LLCR align.... in this /Left/Centre/Right/ gets aligned as 3 parts, using / (or the first character) as a separator. I would be happy not to see the actual features in OPro expanded too much, but support better exchange with other programs: there are somethings OPro does best, some StrongEd does best and some where PipeDream is best. -- /| 4 Q D / | 4qd@4qd.co.uk / | http://www.4QD.co.uk / | | / /| | We manufacture / / | | MOSFET controllers for battery operated motors /_/__| |____ /_____ ____\ Site also contains FAQ sheet on motors & controllers / _ \| | _ \ and a selection of interesting circuit diagrams | | | | | | | | | |_| | | |_| | 4QD are proud to use British technology: \__\_\ |____/ Acorn StrongARM RISC-PC 32 bit computer. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 13 13:57:51 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57257 for opro ; Fri, 13 Feb 98 13:57:48 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887363795:05:15062:81; Fri, 13 Feb 98 09:56:35 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0627332; 13 Feb 98 9:56 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ay2014771; 13 Feb 98 9:52 GMT From: Brian D Sherwood Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 09:37:08 +0000 Organization: Subject: OP v2.46 - General problems on first full use To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980213.093708.54@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 23:34:00 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I have a SA-RPC-200 and I've just used OP for the first time to update my CV from my previous version in Impression Publisher. Generally I like the flexibility of OP but have come across the following very annoying problems: 1. OP fails to redraw the entire screen as text moves about in justification or when selecting (instead of complete black areas there is a thin white space between text lines) so black dots, lines and parts of letters get left on the screen, especially at the left or right margins; 2. I've stopped using enhanced justification as this can expand a line beyond the right margin! 3. Even normal full justification prevents tabbed indents from lining up vertically (my CV starts with a heading on the left then I left-tab across to the main detail. Returns are then indented up to the same left tab point; 4. Whenever I adjust the left/right frame border positions, either with the mouse or on the page on the master page it seems to change the top/bottom borders and vice versa so I end up having to set everything in one go via the page -- 40 Hobart Road,Cambridge,CB1 3PU,UK/Tel:+44-(0)1223-350800(day),-573342(eve) To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 13 13:57:58 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57259 for opro ; Fri, 13 Feb 98 13:57:56 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887363863:05:15450:80; Fri, 13 Feb 98 09:57:43 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ac0626441; 13 Feb 98 9:57 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id bc2014771; 13 Feb 98 9:53 GMT From: Brian D Sherwood Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 09:36:45 +0000 Organization: Subject: OP v2.46 - General problems on first full use To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980213.093645.15@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 00:28:47 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I have a SA-RPC-200 and I've just used OP for the first time to update my CV from my previous version in Impression Publisher. Generally I like the flexibility of OP but have come across the following very annoying problems: 1. OP fails to redraw the entire screen as text moves about in justification or when selecting (instead of complete black areas there is a thin white space between text lines) so black dots, lines and parts of letters get left on the screen, especially at the left or right margins or between lines; 2. I've stopped using enhanced justification as this can expand a line beyond the right margin! 3. Even normal full justification prevents tabbed indents from lining up vertically. My CV starts with a heading on the left then I left-tab across to the main detail. Returns are then indented up to the same left tab point. This worked as expected with Impression and, in any case, it seems crazy to adjust the width of tabs along with spaces (which they are not) when their whole purpose is to align text vertically; 4. Why can't the right margin/return ruler-mark act like a right-tab by default as in many other word-processors, instead of having to add a further right-tab ruler-mark if you want the last text on the line to line up right? 5. Whenever I adjust the left/right frame edge positions (either with the mouse or on the master page-guidelines dialog) it seems to change the top/bottom edges and vice versa, so I end up having to set everything in one go via the page-guidelines dialog (provided I have noticed the change!); 6. Also when moving the top/right master page frame edge beyond the print border edge it suddenly jumps to the far right of the window by itself and is very hard to drag back so I resort again to the page-guidelines dialog; 7. Could we also have a status bar (like Wordz) or tool-tips (like Word) or maybe use the info palette to display a description for when I forget what the myriad of tools do which I keep at the top of the OP window? 8. There are few aspects of Word/Windows that I like but one is definitely the ability to copy any screen text (even from a writable icon) with Ctrl+C and then paste it anywhere else with Ctrl+V (something RiscOS lacks) and, related to this, the convention that the next keypress after selection replaces the highlighted text without the need to delete it first. I would like this feature in OP. I don't know if v2.48 has solved some of the above but I have seen all the correspondence about problems upgrading from v2.46 so am loathe to do this until the 2.48 bugs are sorted out. -- 40 Hobart Road,Cambridge,CB1 3PU,UK/Tel:+44-(0)1223-350800(day),-573342(eve) To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 13 13:58:06 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57261 for opro ; Fri, 13 Feb 98 13:58:04 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887363950:15:17314:80; Fri, 13 Feb 98 09:59:10 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0600070; 13 Feb 98 9:58 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id be2014771; 13 Feb 98 9:54 GMT From: David Pilling Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 09:37:30 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980213.093730.57@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 98 01:35:11 GMT X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c From: Alf Chamings >After a troubled start with 2.48 which I thought I had seen the back of after >I re-upgraded using a fresh 2.46 and then replaced !Version as advised, I now >find I cannot load OPro at all. >I get: 'No stack for trap handler. Internal error branch through zero at >&03813AE8, pc=00000000:registers at 00119494' I'd be tempted to switch off the ColSupp applet or maybe all applets, and then enable them one at a time. I'd also want to know what changed between the previous time when it worked (apart from saving) and now. From: Frank Lester >Is there any way to access the total number of pages in a document? The >information is there in the info box, I would like to access that to use as >an insert in a document. There are functions; >A document has n chapters, indexed 0..(n-1). A chapter has m pages, indexed >0..(m-1). >int documentchapters(int file); // total chapters >int chapterpages(int chapter,int file); // total pages So you can soon concoct a bit of script code that tells you how many pages there are in a document. You then can asign it to a key press. The other obvious idea is to use it as a mail merge field definition. Done that way, the number of pages will be inserted automatically. But you'll have to remember to use the mail merge print window. From: Michael Ben-Gershon >Ovation Pro (along with Impression and ArtWorks) ignores >the right-to-left text bit in Draw Files. This prevents >it from importing DrawFiles with right-to-left text > from EasiWriter/TechWriter, which is a shame. Send me an example and I'll fix it. From: Alan Muscat >If I created a simple file in OPro, and then saved out as DDL, would >Word be able to load it and keep some the formatting of the original >document. No. But I'm sure MS would be interested in adding this functionality to their little program 8-) From: Norman Thomas >I upgraded to 2.48 some time ago and all has been working well. Yesterday I >had spare time and decided to copy in various additional applets etc, some >of them updates. Again all seemed to go well until the end. I also ran, for >the first time, Applets Manager 1.00. I am not absolutely sure that it was >only after that that, as with Philip and Alan, Applets disappeared off the >main menu list. So far as I know, I have been careful to re-install Rupert >Thompson's Applets and not simply copy across. I'd bet that one of the applets you added upset things. In fact I guess that a rogue applet might be the cause of Alans problems. Rogue may mean an old applet i.e. one from OPro from before 2.45. >In response to Alan, David Pilling wondered whether the two lines in >OPro/Run (to abbreviate: OPro$Applets and OProApplets$Path) were present. >They are. The Applets Manager Help file refers an ApplStore directory in >!Applets. I cannot find that. I asked about the *value* of these variables - where they pointed on disc. It was a far fetched idea because you'd have to have edited the !Run file. Second you obviously need to create that directory inside !Applets. It is there by default. (unarchiver problems perhaps? (groan)) Does ArcBM really incorporate FTL technology? you're asking, since this reply appeared before the message... David Pilling To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 17 13:53:58 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57455 for opro ; Tue, 17 Feb 98 13:53:57 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887708782:15:24517:80; Tue, 17 Feb 98 09:46:22 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ac0627967; 17 Feb 98 9:45 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ai1002795; 17 Feb 98 9:44 GMT From: Alan Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 10:06:07 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re2.48 and Applets To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980216.100607.01@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 11:53:30 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Hello OVPro users, Thanks to all those (especially David) who replied to my problem with non recognition of Appletes. It is now working fully but please don't ask how! Alan Esplen Graphic Design Alan Esplen Great Waltham, Essex, England. Check out Anne & Alans Home Page and Meccano page http://www.btinternet.com/~a.esplen email: a.esplen@btinternet.com To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 17 13:54:04 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57457 for opro ; Tue, 17 Feb 98 13:54:01 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887708784:12:28007:80; Tue, 17 Feb 98 09:46:24 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0627997; 17 Feb 98 9:46 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ah1002795; 17 Feb 98 9:44 GMT From: Roger King Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 10:05:22 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Applets To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980216.100522.67@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 11:12:55 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Could all applets for Ovation Pro be made available for download at one web site? Several of my bookmarks for applets now seem to have moved to different locations. Having them all at one web site would be a real boon! -- __ __ __ __ __ ___ _____________________________________________ |__||__)/ __/ \|\ ||_ | / | || \\__/\__/| \||__ | /..Internet provider for all Acorn RISC machines ___________________________/ rmking@argonet.co.uk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 17 13:54:09 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57459 for opro ; Tue, 17 Feb 98 13:54:08 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887708927:05:07907:80; Tue, 17 Feb 98 09:48:47 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0628934; 17 Feb 98 9:48 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aa1004971; 17 Feb 98 9:46 GMT From: Ray Dawson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 10:07:37 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: DDL - how useful is it? To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980216.100737.14@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 12:47:43 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On 13 Feb, Rupert Thompson wrote: > > Speaking of which, has anyone gone anyway into an OP->TeX translator? > I didn't choose either of those examples randomly ;-) You don't by any chance use Word or RTF as well do you Rupert? :-) Ray D -- ===================================. | M a g R a y Document Services | Ray Dawson Tel: 0181 864 7208 | the print and braille specialists | rayd@argonet.co.uk '===================================' http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/rayd To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 17 13:54:14 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57461 for opro ; Tue, 17 Feb 98 13:54:13 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887708936:15:25848:80; Tue, 17 Feb 98 09:48:56 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ac0629252; 17 Feb 98 9:48 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ac1004971; 17 Feb 98 9:47 GMT From: Rob Sinclair Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 10:10:24 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Printing Possibility To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980216.101024.72@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 13:58:09 +0100 (BST) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Fri 13 Feb, Paul Hutton wrote: > A suggestion... > > How about a printing option "print current page" > and > being able to type in page numbers in a dialogue box, to print a > non-chronological selection of pages? > > Just an idea... > > Yes! Can somone please do an applet for this? It's the only feature of WordPerfect (apart from its calendar templates) which I miss. -- Rob Sinclair Sherwood Solutions - Large Format Digital Graphics rsinclair@xtra.co.nz To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 17 13:54:19 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57463 for opro ; Tue, 17 Feb 98 13:54:18 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887708962:05:08268:80; Tue, 17 Feb 98 09:49:22 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0629035; 17 Feb 98 9:49 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ab1004971; 17 Feb 98 9:47 GMT From: Tim King Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 10:10:01 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: DDL - how useful is it? To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980216.101001.78@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 16:19:49 +1200 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Fri 13 Feb, Rupert Thompson wrote: > On Thu 12 Feb, Ariancylch wrote: > > In message <19980210.091758.23@risc.demon.co.uk> > > Rupert Thompson wrote: > > > > > > If you wanted to write a program to convert OP documents into, say, > > > Word or TeX, > > [snip] > > > > Speaking of which, has anyone gone anyway into an OP->TeX translator? > > I didn't choose either of those examples randomly ;-) > Tease! When do we start bating the breath? tim -- d e - S i g . ph +64 9 478.3114 To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 17 13:54:25 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57465 for opro ; Tue, 17 Feb 98 13:54:24 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887709226:15:28481:80; Tue, 17 Feb 98 09:53:46 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0601340; 17 Feb 98 9:53 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ab1008174; 17 Feb 98 9:52 GMT From: Peter Blenkinsop Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 10:08:24 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Selecting areas To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980216.100824.54@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 19:53:24 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On 12 Feb, John Hollier wrote: > On 10 Feb, Peter Blenkinsop wrote: > > Is it possible to get OvationPro to select an area on a page which > is not > > whole lines. For example if a document is in two columns, tabs or > space > > separated, can OP be made to select the right hand column only? > > I'd like to do this to get out lists of names when they are typed > onto a > > page. > Peter > I don't know about OP but StrongEd can do this sort of thing. > Any good? > John Hollier May be. I'd rather have OP do it though. -- This is my signature using Pluto Contained in the last character of this line is the secret of the universe. Rats!! I've run out of space for the last character. Peter Blenkinsop To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 17 13:54:30 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57467 for opro ; Tue, 17 Feb 98 13:54:28 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887709270:12:02598:80; Tue, 17 Feb 98 09:54:30 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0601795; 17 Feb 98 9:54 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aj1008174; 17 Feb 98 9:53 GMT From: "waddell@which.net" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 10:05:44 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980216.100544.15@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 23:56:12 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Thu 12 Feb, Ariancylch wrote: > In message <19980210.091842.51@risc.demon.co.uk> > David Pilling wrote: > > > From: Rob Hemmings > > > > > I definitely like this feature but is there any chance the > > > underlines could be made a little thinner? I feel they look a bit > > > ugly at the current width. > > > > Spelling mistakes always look ugly. I could put a big red S through > > each word if you want. It does have to be eye catching. > > If you're going to change it, put a small 'sp' in red ink in the left > hand margin, and gently underline the offending word. > Could we not have a 'musical' sign that spelling is faulty ..... Perhaps a few bars of 'Hold your hand out, naughty boy.' For full justification, you could have a sound byte from one of Hitler's speeches! -- John Waddell, Langbank, Renfrewshire waddell@which.net To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 17 13:54:39 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57469 for opro ; Tue, 17 Feb 98 13:54:38 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887709309:15:29325:80; Tue, 17 Feb 98 09:55:09 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0601858; 17 Feb 98 9:54 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ak1008174; 17 Feb 98 9:53 GMT From: Ray Dawson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 10:07:15 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: OEFPro version 1.20 To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980216.100715.40@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 12:49:40 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On 13 Feb, David H Wild wrote: > On 12 Feb, Rupert Thompson wrote: > > > Is there a version that works with Looksystems Font Directory Pro? > > No, but provided Font Directory Pro provides a similar interface to > > other programs to be able to turn fonts on and off, it shouldn't be too > > hard to modify !OEFPro. > Font Directory Pro does this for you. Just drag the file to the FontDir > icon on the iconbar, and the necessary fonts will be loaded - presuming > that you still have them, obviously it won't do anything about fonts in a > file from another source which might have used fonts that you don't have. I don't have Font Directory Pro, but I have FontDir2 which loads the fonts if you Alt-click on an OP document. Perhaps FD Pro does the same? Ray D -- ===================================. | M a g R a y Document Services | Ray Dawson Tel: 0181 864 7208 | the print and braille specialists | rayd@argonet.co.uk '===================================' http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/rayd To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 17 13:54:46 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57471 for opro ; Tue, 17 Feb 98 13:54:44 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887709327:12:03232:80; Tue, 17 Feb 98 09:55:27 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ac0601994; 17 Feb 98 9:55 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id al1008174; 17 Feb 98 9:53 GMT From: Peter Blenkinsop Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 10:08:47 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Selecting areas To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980216.100847.67@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 19:54:15 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On 12 Feb, MattLB wrote: > Peter Blenkinsop wrote: > > > > Is it possible to get OvationPro to select an area on a page which is not > > whole lines. For example if a document is in two columns, tabs or space > > separated, can OP be made to select the right hand column only? > Despite being generally inferior to OP, one feature of MSWord that I do > like is being able to Alt-Drag to select any rectangular area of text, > in just the way you describe. AFAIK you can't do this in OP, but it's > definitely one for the wishlist. Yes. It has been in Word for a while and that is where I first used the facility. > MattLB > To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk > with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l > To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l -- This is my signature using Pluto Contained in the last character of this line is the secret of the universe. Rats!! I've run out of space for the last character. Peter Blenkinsop To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 17 13:54:51 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57473 for opro ; Tue, 17 Feb 98 13:54:49 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887709389:12:03624:82; Tue, 17 Feb 98 09:56:29 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0602213; 17 Feb 98 9:55 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id an1008174; 17 Feb 98 9:54 GMT From: Tim King Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 10:09:36 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Selecting areas To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980216.100936.83@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 16:15:06 +1200 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Fri 13 Feb, Chris Chorley wrote: > >Is it possible to get OvationPro to select an area on a page which is not > >whole lines. For example if a document is in two columns, tabs or space > >separated, can OP be made to select the right hand column only? > > > >I'd like to do this to get out lists of names when they are typed onto a > >page. > > > It's high on my wish list, but I'd never bothered asking as I thought it to > be a text editing thing, not DTP. If I had this then there's not much > reason to use any other program. I would like to be able to export the > marked area as text though... (that ellipsis again). > Would be nice. Nearly all of my documents that I want to do this in have to do with the 'business' side of the business rather than the publishing or creative side, so I just use a spreadsheet with good text handling (Fireworkz Pro). Most of that sort of doc also has numbers, so I don't feel too bad about leaving OP on the shelf. tim -- d e - S i g . ph +64 9 478.3114 To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 17 13:54:58 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57475 for opro ; Tue, 17 Feb 98 13:54:56 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887709400:05:12582:80; Tue, 17 Feb 98 09:56:40 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0601795; 17 Feb 98 9:56 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id am1008174; 17 Feb 98 9:54 GMT From: Nick Kaijaks Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 10:09:13 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980216.100913.13@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 14:39:31 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c David Pilling wrote: > For some situations embeded pictures as large characters is OK. > Other packages have the concept of pictures which are associated > with bits of text or maintain their positions relative to some point > in the text. I suppose that as long as you don' want text flow > around these frames then it would not be too hard. > > The other thing which is doable is the embedded frame which text > flows around the bottom of. Like an embedded frame appearing in > place of a drop cap. Both of these would be very useful features - the latter in particular would make conversion between HTML and DDL easier, as this is the default way IMG tags work... if you've time (!), I'd have said it was worth looking at this. > From: tony van der Hoff >> However, what you've just said (and, I'm sure, you didn't mean) >> displays a penny-pinching attitude worthy of the BillyGates >> himself! > > For some companies in the Acorn world at the moment, saving time > and money is vital. An ominous choice of words... TTFN, Nick -- nick kaijaks; proprietor, pinxit design - putting the solution together http://come.to/kaijaks mailto:Nick.Kaijaks@warwick.ac.uk Disclaimer: caveat internettor To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 17 13:55:03 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57477 for opro ; Tue, 17 Feb 98 13:55:02 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887709417:15:00236:80; Tue, 17 Feb 98 09:56:57 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0603052; 17 Feb 98 9:56 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aq1008174; 17 Feb 98 9:54 GMT From: "Howe , Chris" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 10:04:57 +0000 Organization: Subject: HTML import To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980216.100457.79@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: 13 Feb 98 09:23:00 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c All, I'm drafting a lerrer to Archive magazine about getting HTML into Ovation. See what you think! It is useful to have the ability to import 'formatted' HTML text into Ovation Pro. HTML text may be imported indirectly into Ovation using the ability of Impression, with the Impression HTML tools from Ben Summers (shareware), to import HTML as styled text, then saving these results as DDF. The DDF subsequently imports into to Ovation via TransDDF (provided with Ovation as a 'filter'). However, since I prefer not to run up Impression, I have been using !HTML>Impression from Philip Mellor (Acorn User cover disc, December 1997). Really, I am using this as an 'HTML to DDF' convertor, the DDF being that documented by Computer Concepts, and understood not only by Impression but also by Ovation. The utility converts the HTML to a DDF (ASCII) file, which can be filtered into Ovation with more than adequate results. Special styles appear relating to the HTML attributes. No need to own Impression. !HTML>Imp is programmed in easy-to follow Basic, so could be amended if required. In-memory transfer from the output of Philip's filter direct into Ovation looks like it could work, given a little more programming. Meanwhile I had to save to an intermediate DDF file, which was then dropped onto Ovation. I deleted the blue 'link' style in the finished document, though it really did no harm. Consequently I can, for example do a Web search related to my son's homework topic and paste 'formatted' extracts into essays, etc. This is also particularly useful for stylistically complex things like bibliographies. Chris Howe, Bath To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 17 13:55:16 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57479 for opro ; Tue, 17 Feb 98 13:55:11 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887709422:12:04093:81; Tue, 17 Feb 98 09:57:02 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ac0602785; 17 Feb 98 9:56 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ar1008174; 17 Feb 98 9:55 GMT From: Rupert Thompson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 10:06:28 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: OEFPro version 1.20 To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980216.100628.94@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 12:22:17 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Fri 13 Feb, David H Wild wrote: > On 12 Feb, Rupert Thompson wrote: > > > Is there a version that works with Looksystems Font Directory Pro? > > > No, but provided Font Directory Pro provides a similar interface to > > other programs to be able to turn fonts on and off, it shouldn't be too > > hard to modify !OEFPro. > > Font Directory Pro does this for you. Just drag the file to the FontDir > icon on the iconbar, and the necessary fonts will be loaded - presuming > that you still have them, obviously it won't do anything about fonts in a > file from another source which might have used fonts that you don't have. Yes, EFPro can do that, too. The point is that the !OEFPro applet makes this happen *invisibly*. You just load your document in the normal way (double-click, or drag to OP). OP scans the document, reports to EFPro what fonts are missing, and EFPro switches them on. You can effectively forget that EFPro is running. I think I'll be in a position to release a version of !OEFPro which will work with Font Directory Pro this weekend, because David Pilling rather kindly sent me details of the equivalent interface. Watch this space. -- Rupert Thompson Queens' College, Cambridge, CB3 9ET, UK Research Fellow http://rjet1.quns.cam.ac.uk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 17 13:55:22 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57481 for opro ; Tue, 17 Feb 98 13:55:20 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887709443:15:00236:189; Tue, 17 Feb 98 09:57:23 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ad0603236; 17 Feb 98 9:57 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id at1008174; 17 Feb 98 9:55 GMT From: "dick.parsons@roche.com" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 10:06:53 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re[2]: Selecting areas To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980216.100653.25@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 12:32 +0100 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Being an Acorn user and enthusiast at home and Wintel/MS user at work, I couldn't agree more with this last sentiment. I firmly believe that the only way forwards for the Acorn world is co-operation and integration rather than competition (and as a consequence, bloatware as in the PC world). The market is too small to survive/profit any other way. It is in all (Acorn) developers' interests, and the users to ensure their software package effectively integrates by OLE with all the (appropriate) leading applications as a feature. It is also in Acorns interest to encourage this in their operating system. Just a thought....... Richard ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: Selecting areas Author: 4qd@4qd.co.uk at PMDF Date: 13/02/98 10:34 AM On Thu 12 Feb 98 (09:11:43 +0000), john@thirteen.demon.co.uk wrote: > On 10 Feb, Peter Blenkinsop wrote: > > Is it possible to get OvationPro to select an area on a page which > > is not whole lines. For example if a document is in two columns, tabs > > or space separated, can OP be made to select the right hand column only? > > I'd like to do this to get out lists of names when they are typed > > onto a page. > I don't know about OP but StrongEd can do this sort of thing. StrongEd complements OPro very well. But I'd like to see a variation on colums (probably called tables...) where text flow followed acrows colums - not down them. We have a Price list: it may need editing, or changing into a different currency which involves working on a column. So I've got it set up as separate objects (one per column) so I can work on one object. It's a pain keeping rows aligned, tabs may have been easier. One suggestion I made to DP a while ago was a function similar to PipeDream's LLCR align.... in this /Left/Centre/Right/ gets aligned as 3 parts, using / (or the first character) as a separator. I would be happy not to see the actual features in OPro expanded too much, but support better exchange with other programs: there are somethings OPro does best, some StrongEd does best and some where PipeDream is best. -- /| 4 Q D / | 4qd@4qd.co.uk / | http://www.4QD.co.uk / | | / /| | We manufacture / / | | MOSFET controllers for battery operated motors /_/__| |____ /_____ ____\ Site also contains FAQ sheet on motors & controllers / _ \| | _ \ and a selection of interesting circuit diagrams | | | | | | | | | |_| | | |_| | 4QD are proud to use British technology: \__\_\ |____/ Acorn StrongARM RISC-PC 32 bit computer. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 17 13:55:32 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57483 for opro ; Tue, 17 Feb 98 13:55:27 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887709630:15:02101:80; Tue, 17 Feb 98 10:00:30 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0603236; 17 Feb 98 10:00 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ad1011943; 17 Feb 98 9:57 GMT From: David Pilling Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 10:07:59 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980216.100759.21@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 98 17:34:59 GMT X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c From: Peter Howard >Where do I find the !Version applet, please? www.beebug.com, Ovation Pro home page, Upgrades... From: Paul Hutton >How about a printing option "print current page" and being able to type in >page numbers in a dialogue box, to print a non-chronological selection of >pages? It's on the todo list. Not too hard but, might mean redesigning the print window. From: Alf Chamings >was just a daft mistake with downloaded applets still in archive form. It is >certainly loading ok at the moment. It's perhaps worth emphasising that *anything* you put in the applets directory will get run. This is a feature, it allows you to boot up software that you want to use at the same time as OPro. However it means you can't leave things lying around in there... From: Richard Cassidy >So, of course OvationPRo now won't run unless I reinstall it. First the >installer won't accept the 2.48 because it says its the wrong version, now >the program disc 1 comes up with a pile of errors and installer won't run >at all. In this situation you go back to your master discs and reinstall 2.46. You then upgrade it to 2.48. In fact just follow the instructions for creating 2.48 (which are to do a minimal installation from the 2.46 original discs). >I'm at the end of a project with a *very* tight deadline - what can I do - >I'm begging :( In cases of dire need contact Beebug direct. From: Ariancylch >> I think it's time for a FAQ and maybe Hints&Tips list. >If The Powers That Be want to farm that work out I'd be more than happy >to maintain them... I thought you were busy on something else 8-) Seriously if someone wants to do this work, I'd be very happy. I don't think there have been a great number of FAQ's. And more hints and tips would be good. From: "Sveinung W. Tengelsen" >blocks of text. It's massively useful under some circumstances. Of >course, this raises the issue on wether it's possible and desirable to >enable throwback of text from Ovation Pro to external editors. David? :) No question block select is a good feature. As to external editors, depends what you're going to export and how you're goint to get it back into OPro. It's easy to save stories as DDL and then reload them, but quite if those columns will line up in your editor... maybe a Zap mode is needed for DDL files. (actually OPro does do 'throwback' in the sense that programmers understand it). From: Brian D Sherwood >2. I've stopped using enhanced justification as this can expand a line >beyond the right margin! Sounds like a bug, which I would like to know how to reproduce, but I half feel it may be fixed in 2.48. >3. Even normal full justification prevents tabbed indents from lining up >vertically... > ...it seems crazy to adjust the width of tabs along with spaces (which >they are not) when their whole purpose is to align text vertically; This is an old saga. What on earth is the meaning of tabs in fully justified text? As it stands tabs are shifts of position, justification does not expand their width, the problem is that the spaces which do expand move the tab shifts along. >5. Whenever I adjust the left/right frame edge positions (either with the >mouse or on the master page-guidelines dialog) it seems to change the >top/bottom edges and vice versa, so I end up having to set everything in one >go via the page-guidelines dialog (provided I have noticed the change!); A big change or just some sort of rounding error, or snapping to something like the grid/guidelines? >6. Also when moving the top/right master page frame edge beyond the print >border edge it suddenly jumps to the far right of the window by itself and >is very hard to drag back so I resort again to the page-guidelines dialog; Doesn't do it for me. The 'print border' is not likely to have any effect, the edge of the pasteboard might. More info please... >7. Could we also have a status bar (like Wordz) or tool-tips (like Word) or >maybe use the info palette to display a description for when I forget what >the myriad of tools do which I keep at the top of the OP window? For buttons, use Bubble Help, for tools the description is on the info palette. >8. There are few aspects of Word/Windows that I like but one is definitely >the ability to copy any screen text (even from a writable icon) with Ctrl+C >and then paste it anywhere else with Ctrl+V (something RiscOS lacks) and, Yes, I'm 100% with you here. I think the next thing I'll do to OPro is add the ability to copy/paste text to/from icons within the program. There is a PD program called something like 'clipboard' which attempts to provide this functionality globally. >related to this, the convention that the next keypress after selection >replaces the highlighted text without the need to delete it first. I would >like this feature in OP. OPro has this feature already. Choices->Text->Overtype. >I don't know if v2.48 has solved some of the above but I have seen all the >correspondence about problems upgrading from v2.46 so am loathe to do this >until the 2.48 bugs are sorted out. I have no plans to change the OPro 2.48 upgrade kit. As far as I know the *few* problems that have arisen, have been due to not following the instructions. A "bug fixed" 2.48 won't appear. (sorry for the smug complacency evident here). David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 17 13:56:00 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57489 for opro ; Tue, 17 Feb 98 13:55:59 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887712267:05:10813:81; Tue, 17 Feb 98 10:44:27 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0624541; 17 Feb 98 10:43 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ae2021224; 17 Feb 98 10:42 GMT From: Ian Goulbourne Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 10:36:47 +0000 Organization: Subject: merge tags To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980217.103647.94@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 22:36:16 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Hi, A question for DP I've a small problem with the merge tags in OP It relates to printing labels. If I make up a label with merge tags and have a large font selected for the tags, I cannot fit all the tags on the label. What I want to do is print out on several lines: [merge 1] [Merge 2] [Merge 3] [Merge 4] [Merge 5] what happens, is that for example, [merge 5] gets pushed out of the frame, so I cannot view it. It is obviously still there, as the merge command works, but I can't edit it. Why the fuss? Usually, a merge tag will contain a word or words, so that if the phrase fits on the line then [Merge 1] fits on the line. What I would like to do is to put in numbers etc which take less space than [Merge x] ie an abbreviation for the merge tag! Could the merge label be truncated in any way eg [M 1]? So a label containing tags might read: [M 1] [M 2] [M 3] [M 4] [M 5] so I could see the formatting of the label Thanks Ian -- Ian Goulbourne |__| |__| |__| Tynemouth | |__| |__| | Acorn RiscPC StrongARM Northumberland | | "Life's a beach in Tynemouth" |______________| *Remove NO.SPAM to reply* To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 17 13:56:08 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57491 for opro ; Tue, 17 Feb 98 13:56:06 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887712268:05:10848:81; Tue, 17 Feb 98 10:44:28 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0624484; 17 Feb 98 10:44 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ab2021224; 17 Feb 98 10:42 GMT From: Frank Lester Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 10:36:24 +0000 Organization: Subject: Error message on printing To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980217.103624.61@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 09:57:19 +0100 (BST) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I have just been trying to print a single page document which includes a rotated frame with an Artworks file containing text in an explosion bubble with drop shadow. I get an error message "overflow while transforming point". This occurs with both V2.48 & V2.46. Also happens if I place an equivalent Drawfile in the frame. If I rotate the graphic in Artworks and then load into a normal unrotated frame in OVPro it works OK. Can you shed some light, thanks. -- Frank Lester "Omahanui" Waitangi Falls Road RD1 Waiuku,New Zealand To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 18 13:50:57 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57568 for opro ; Wed, 18 Feb 98 13:50:56 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887796722:15:23016:81; Wed, 18 Feb 98 10:12:02 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0607855; 18 Feb 98 10:11 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ag1009714; 18 Feb 98 10:09 GMT From: "Dr. D. M. Lewis" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 09:50:36 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Smart Quotes To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980218.095036.65@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 10:25:02 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Is there a problem with automatic Smart Quotes in 2.48? (I had these working before upgrading) Don Lewis Dr. D. M. Lewis, Phone +44 117 9287813 Department of Physiology, Secretaries' Office +44 117 9288105 Medical School, Fax +44 117 9288923 Unversity Walk, Bristol, BS8 1TD, mailto:Don.Lewis@bristol.ac.uk England. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 18 13:51:04 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57570 for opro ; Wed, 18 Feb 98 13:51:02 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887796757:05:22862:83; Wed, 18 Feb 98 10:12:37 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ad0608295; 18 Feb 98 10:12 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ah1009714; 18 Feb 98 10:10 GMT From: "Roger Darlington" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 09:53:38 +0000 Organization: University of Salford Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980218.095338.19@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 12:01:07 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c > >Where do I find the !Version applet, please? > > www.beebug.com, Ovation Pro home page, Upgrades... But nothing called 'Version' has been on the beebug applet site for weeks. Is it called something else? Roger Roger Darlington 1 fells Grove Worsley Manchester M28 7JN Home Tel - (0161) 799 9845 R.W.DARLINGTON@acoustics.salford.ac.uk Work Tel - (0161) 295 3399 It's all done by mirrors To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 18 13:51:08 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57572 for opro ; Wed, 18 Feb 98 13:51:07 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887796890:12:09390:81; Wed, 18 Feb 98 10:14:50 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0609055; 18 Feb 98 10:14 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ao1009714; 18 Feb 98 10:13 GMT From: Ray Dawson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 09:52:55 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980218.095255.00@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 17:25:13 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On 16 Feb, David Pilling wrote: > It's perhaps worth emphasising that *anything* you put in the applets > directory will get run. This is a feature, it allows you to boot up > software that you want to use at the same time as OPro. However it means > you can't leave things lying around in there... Is it safe to put filters in the Applets directory? At the moment I have them in a separate Filters directory that has to be filer_booted (as per the original instructions that came with OP). Being able to put them in with the Applets means one less thing to think about boot-wise. Ray D -- ===================================. | M a g R a y Document Services | Ray Dawson Tel: 0181 864 7208 | the print and braille specialists | rayd@argonet.co.uk '===================================' http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/rayd To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 18 13:51:13 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57574 for opro ; Wed, 18 Feb 98 13:51:12 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887796908:12:09467:81; Wed, 18 Feb 98 10:15:08 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id am0609280; 18 Feb 98 10:14 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id an1009714; 18 Feb 98 10:12 GMT From: "Gus Gem" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 09:51:24 +0000 Organization: University of Salford Subject: Re: Applets directory To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980218.095124.52@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 12:48:51 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c David, Alf Chamings said: > >was just a daft mistake with downloaded applets still in archive form. It is > >certainly loading ok at the moment. You replied: > It's perhaps worth emphasising that *anything* you put in the applets directory > will get run. This is a feature, it allows you to boot up software that > you want to use at the same time as OPro. However it means you can't leave > things lying around in there... Does this recurse - ie can I leave directories "lying around in there" without horrible side effects? (it is a convenient place for applet documentation that even my aging brain can remember) Gus Gem Tel: Home 0161 881 9199 Work 0161 295 2214 e-mail M.A.G.Gem@podiatry.salford.ac.uk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 18 13:51:17 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57576 for opro ; Wed, 18 Feb 98 13:51:16 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887796930:05:24473:81; Wed, 18 Feb 98 10:15:30 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0608295; 18 Feb 98 10:15 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ap1009714; 18 Feb 98 10:13 GMT From: "Roger Darlington" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 09:54:00 +0000 Organization: University of Salford Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980218.095400.69@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 15:07:39 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c We are told officially not to use the new features in ovation pro 2.48 'as it is liable to change', so obviously version 2.48 is not an official version. So when can we expect the next 'official version' where we can use all the new features willy nilly, at will, of our own free choice, without fear of retribution or of contracting the dreaded lurgy? > Roger Darlington 1 fells Grove Worsley Manchester M28 7JN Home Tel - (0161) 799 9845 R.W.DARLINGTON@acoustics.salford.ac.uk Work Tel - (0161) 295 3399 It's all done by mirrors To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 18 13:51:24 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57578 for opro ; Wed, 18 Feb 98 13:51:23 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887796988:15:25466:81; Wed, 18 Feb 98 10:16:28 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ai0609813; 18 Feb 98 10:15 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aq1009714; 18 Feb 98 10:14 GMT From: Colin Thompson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 09:54:21 +0000 Organization: Subject: RTF - Word - or whatever To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980218.095421.32@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 08:38:56 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I'm going to be buying a laptop shortly - Not an ancient museum piece old A4 but one with a lovely active full colour screen, decent battery life and light weight etc. Unfortunatly it will also be running Windows95 (though I suppose I could get a Mac). The point is, I know it's been mentioned before, how will I be able to get stuff between Word and Ovation Pro with a=A0bit more formatting than you can get on a straigt text file? Surely OvPro should have RTF in and out. it seems far more essential that DDL or any fancy applets. Surely there must be quite a lot of Ov Pro users who also use PCs? -- Colin Thompson Mail to - colinet@atlantis.aust.com Web site - http://www.atlantis.aust.com/~colinet To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 18 13:51:31 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57581 for opro ; Wed, 18 Feb 98 13:51:30 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887797000:05:25313:81; Wed, 18 Feb 98 10:16:40 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0609971; 18 Feb 98 10:16 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ar1009714; 18 Feb 98 10:14 GMT From: Carl Cepurneek Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 09:54:45 +0000 Organization: Subject: Loading fonts for document To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980218.095445.80@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 09:06:42 +0900 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c >> Font Directory Pro does this for you. Just drag the file to the FontDir >> icon on the iconbar, and the necessary fonts will be loaded - presuming >> that you still have them, obviously it won't do anything about fonts in a >> file from another source which might have used fonts that you don't have. > >I don't have Font Directory Pro, but I have FontDir2 which loads the fonts >if you Alt-click on an OP document. Perhaps FD Pro does the same? Dave McCormac's 'Atlanta' shareware font manager does similar. I don't think the latest version list's OPro as officially suported but it made sence of any file I'd offered it. Check http://www.atlantic.oaktree.co.uk/products Regards, cpc To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 18 13:51:40 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57585 for opro ; Wed, 18 Feb 98 13:51:38 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887797057:15:26183:81; Wed, 18 Feb 98 10:17:37 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0610393; 18 Feb 98 10:17 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ax1009714; 18 Feb 98 10:15 GMT From: "andy.ling@quantel.com" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 09:51:00 +0000 Organization: Quantel Ltd. Subject: Re: OEFPro version 1.20 To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980218.095100.54@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 10:47:04 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c > On 13 Feb, David H Wild wrote: > > On 12 Feb, Rupert Thompson wrote: > > > > Is there a version that works with Looksystems Font Directory Pro? > > > No, but provided Font Directory Pro provides a similar interface to > > > other programs to be able to turn fonts on and off, it shouldn't be too > > > hard to modify !OEFPro. > > Font Directory Pro does this for you. Just drag the file to the FontDir > > icon on the iconbar, and the necessary fonts will be loaded - presuming > > that you still have them, obviously it won't do anything about fonts in a > > file from another source which might have used fonts that you don't have. > I don't have Font Directory Pro, but I have FontDir2 which loads the fonts > if you Alt-click on an OP document. Perhaps FD Pro does the same? It does. I just have to remember to do it. I just thought if it all happened automagically it might mke life easier. Maybe when I've got a spare moment I'll investigate further. Andy Ling To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 18 13:51:47 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57589 for opro ; Wed, 18 Feb 98 13:51:45 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887797072:12:11108:86; Wed, 18 Feb 98 10:17:52 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0610572; 18 Feb 98 10:17 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ay1009714; 18 Feb 98 10:15 GMT From: Ian Lowry Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 09:51:47 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Re[2]: Selecting areas To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980218.095147.08@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 13:05:12 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On 16 Feb, dick.parsons@roche.com wrote: > > We have a Price list: it may need editing, or changing into a different > currency which involves working on a column. So I've got it set up as > separate > objects (one per column) so I can work on one object. It's a pain keeping > rows > aligned, tabs may have been easier. > > One suggestion I made to DP a while ago was a function similar to > PipeDream's LLCR align.... in this /Left/Centre/Right/ gets aligned as 3 > parts, using / (or the first character) as a separator. > > I would be happy not to see the actual features in OPro expanded too > much, but support better exchange with other programs: there are > somethings OPro does best, some StrongEd does best and some where > PipeDream is best. Can I make a suggestion here. If you use tables which need to be altered perhaps you should consider buying TableMate Designer which supports OLE editing within OvPro and makes tables a doddle. It seems to be almost infinitely flexible and actually makes tables fun! Ian -- Cardiff - Soon to be home to the Welsh Assembly Iechyd da i bob Cymro.......... To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 18 13:51:58 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57591 for opro ; Wed, 18 Feb 98 13:51:55 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887797104:05:26308:83; Wed, 18 Feb 98 10:18:24 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ac0611005; 18 Feb 98 10:18 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id bc1009714; 18 Feb 98 10:17 GMT From: Alan Muscat Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 09:52:33 +0000 Organization: Grapevine Digital Arts Subject: Follow-up to Colour production in Ovation Pro To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980218.095233.91@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 18:08:23 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I've discovered that I need to play with Colour Choices from the Icon bar icon. Yes I had 'use inks' selected. This, if I understand correctly, is supposed to give a better representation on screen of the colours you get when printed. With 1) 100% cyan and 100% magenta (0% all else) use inks use correction table Typeset SWOP on coated stock I get near black (tiny hint of purple) on screen and in print out. 2) With 100% cyan and 100% magenta (0% all else) use inks use correction table Typeset *SWOP(table)* I get something a little more like dark purple on screen but something close to black, but with a slightly stronger hint of purple on print out. 3) With 100% cyan and 100% magenta (0% all else) *use inks NOT selected* use correction table Typeset SWOP on coated stock I get a bright blue on screen (as expected) and a good purple on print out. 4) With 100% cyan and 100% magenta (0% all else) *use inks NOT selected* use correction table Typeset *SWOP(table)* I get a bright blue on screen (as expected) and a good purple on print out. These print outs from my desktop Epson 500 For professional print out I know I need to use cmyk values, which is what I have been doing, and I intend to print on coated stock. On screen and on my printer with coated stock and 'use inks' selected, I am getting colours miles away from what the cmyk swatches show. Am I doing something wrong? What are the best settings to use? Would I be better using the Tony Tolver curves? Does anyone have a comparison between Tony's curves and the standard Typeset ones supplied? thanks for any help. -- Alan Muscat *************** Grapevine Digital Arts *********************** ************** http://www.gvine.demon.co.uk ********************* For the correct email address make demo read demon. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 18 13:52:03 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57593 for opro ; Wed, 18 Feb 98 13:52:02 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887797123:05:26489:81; Wed, 18 Feb 98 10:18:43 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ad0610543; 18 Feb 98 10:18 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id az1009714; 18 Feb 98 10:16 GMT From: Alan Muscat Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 09:52:09 +0000 Organization: Grapevine Digital Arts Subject: Colour Supplement Problems To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980218.095209.73@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 16:52:47 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I am having problems with colour production in Ovation Pro. I have version 1.02 of the Supplement and it is switched on. I am using a RPC 700. The problem is, when I choose a cmyk colour the colour on the screen and on print out is very wrong. For example I want a purple. I choose 100% cyan and 100% magenta and zero for the rest. This gives me black both on screen and print out. Switching to RGB shows a purple/blue hue, as does !Paint with the same values in cmyk. I noticed much earlier that the cyan and magenta in the default colour pallette looked strange, but it is only now that I have needed to use the colour supplement for serious work. So am I doing something wrong? Or does the problem lie else where. A quick response to my problem would be appreciated since I need to print this job very soon. Thanks -- Alan Muscat *************** Grapevine Digital Arts *********************** ************** http://www.gvine.demon.co.uk ********************* ** Warning: bad work file ** To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 18 13:52:08 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57595 for opro ; Wed, 18 Feb 98 13:52:06 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887797154:15:26816:81; Wed, 18 Feb 98 10:19:14 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ac0611044; 18 Feb 98 10:18 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id bd1009714; 18 Feb 98 10:17 GMT From: David Pilling Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 09:53:16 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980218.095316.75@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 98 18:40:47 GMT X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c From: Roger King >Could all applets for Ovation Pro be made available for download at one >web site? Given the permission of the various authors, this would be a good idea. The snag is changing the copy on the Beebug site when the original changes. We do have some copies now, and I guess they are well out of date. From: Ian Goulbourne > What I would like to do is to put in numbers etc which take less space > than [Merge x] ie an abbreviation for the merge tag! > Could the merge label be truncated in any way eg [M 1]? So a label > containing tags might read: I sympathise. I've seen the sort of problem you face. It's obvious that one of the things that will happen one day is that field names will appear in the document instead of [Merge X]. However for now you've just got to do your best with the tools available. I'm sure it must be possible to set up the tags and styles and then perhaps change the size of the frame they are in. From: Frank Lester >I have just been trying to print a single page document which includes a >rotated frame with an Artworks file containing text in an explosion bubble >with drop shadow. I get an error message "overflow while transforming >point". This occurs with both V2.48 & V2.46. Also happens if I place an equivalent >Drawfile in the frame. If I rotate the graphic in Artworks and then load >into a normal unrotated frame in OVPro it works OK. Can you shed some light, >thanks. Well far be it from me to cast stones, but this sounds like the classic Computer Concepts printer driver error message when faced with a sprite which is too big i.e. contains too many pixels. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Feb 19 17:24:55 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57678 for opro ; Thu, 19 Feb 98 17:24:54 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887907838:15:14093:74; Thu, 19 Feb 98 17:03:58 GMT Received: from post-21.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.28]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0506179; 19 Feb 98 17:03 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk [158.152.18.44] by post.mail.demon.net with smtp id 0y5Tj2-000729-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 11:01:09 +0000 From:(Nigel Parker) Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 10:57:29 +0000 Organization: Subject: Central applet site (Was: Various) To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980219.105729.29@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 14:36:42 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Wed, 18 Feb 1998, David Pilling wrote: : From: Roger King : : >Could all applets for Ovation Pro be made available for download at one : >web site? : : Given the permission of the various authors, this would be a good idea. : The snag is changing the copy on the Beebug site when the original changes. : We do have some copies now, and I guess they are well out of date. Why not just have links to authors own pages? Nigel -- Girton College, Cambridge, England, CB3 0JG. Tel: 0411 384803 To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Feb 19 19:58:21 1998 Received: from relay-9.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57685 for opro ; Thu, 19 Feb 98 19:57:58 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887910251:09:23275:74; Thu, 19 Feb 98 17:44:11 GMT Received: from post-21.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.28]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1026764; 19 Feb 98 17:43 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk [158.152.18.44] by post.mail.demon.net with smtp id 0y5Tln-000729-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 11:04:00 +0000 From:(David Pilling) Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 10:58:11 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980219.105811.59@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 98 18:19:10 GMT X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c From: "Dr. D. M. Lewis" >Is there a problem with automatic Smart Quotes in 2.48? >(I had these working before upgrading) Not as far as I know. One obvious suggestion, did you reinstall the quotes applet in 2.48? From: "Roger Darlington" >But nothing called 'Version' has been on the beebug applet site for >weeks. Is it called something else? The archive is called ver/zip. But I stick by what I said, it is available from the 2.48 upgrade index. As it says; >>Version applet (1.01) - document version control It should only be used with 2.48 which I why I have not stuck it up with the other applets. From: Ray Dawson >Is it safe to put filters in the Applets directory? At the moment I have >them in a separate Filters directory that has to be filer_booted (as per >the original instructions that came with OP). This is OK. It does mean they will get run, which is not necessary. You only want them booted. (if you double click on a transloader and watch the task display you'll see they start up a task and immediately quit it). From: "Gus Gem" >> It's perhaps worth emphasising that *anything* you put in the applets directory >> will get run. >Does this recurse - ie can I leave directories "lying around in >there" without horrible side effects? (it is a convenient place for >applet documentation that even my aging brain can remember) No it does not recurse. Directories should be OK. If you want to keep knives in your sock drawer, thats your business. From: Colin Thompson >The point is, I know it's been mentioned before, how will I be able to get >stuff between Word and Ovation Pro with a=A0bit more formatting than you can >get on a straigt text file? Surely OvPro should have RTF in and out. it >seems far more essential that DDL or any fancy applets. Surely there must >be quite a lot of Ov Pro users who also use PCs? Well RTF into OPro does exist. As to export... I believe someone is working on an RTF loader. I'd not hold your breath though, because getting anyone to do such work is difficult (we do pay too). And as has been said, DDL is the foundation of import/export, so quite how not doing that would have helped you I do not know. From: Alan Muscat >I've discovered that I need to play with Colour Choices from the Icon bar >icon. Yes I had 'use inks' selected. This, if I understand correctly, is >supposed to give a better representation on screen of the colours you get >when printed. >For professional print out I know I need to use cmyk values, which is what I have >been doing, and I intend to print on coated stock. On screen and on my printer >with coated stock and 'use inks' selected, I am getting colours miles away from >what the cmyk swatches show. >Am I doing something wrong? What are the best settings to use? Would I be >better using the Tony Tolver curves? It's perhaps worth outlining a few basic points. The Acorn printer driver system works with RGB colours. The only ways you will get true CMYK output are by (a) doing separations i.e. printing the CMYK plates as grey scale print jobs and then subsequently combining them, or (b) using Computer Concepts Turbo drivers. 'Curves' e.g. Tony Tolvers enhanced curves or the 'typeset' one supplied, are a way of converting RGB colours to CMYK. So spot the consequence, curves are only of relevance when you are doing CMYK output i.e. separations or using a CC driver. 'Inks' are currently only used for converting CMYK colours to RGB. There's an obvious comparison with Photodesk, and the OPro implementation is not quite as good. In PD the inks can also be used for RGB to CMYK conversion, but this is not implemented at all in OPro. Now a difficult question is what should happen if you print something defined using CMYK colours to the standard RGB printer system? We could use the ink model to convert to RGB, or just do a naive conversion. I think my decision was to use the naive way of converting to RGB, on the grounds that the printer drivers will then use the same rules to convert back to CMYK. So your CMYK values have some validity. A quick check on a printer reveals that twiddling the use inks button changes the results on paper. So it looks like I have some work to do. However it's not a big problem because if you switch off 'use inks' you will always get the correct result for printing. David Pilling To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Feb 19 19:58:42 1998 Received: from relay-9.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57687 for opro ; Thu, 19 Feb 98 19:58:40 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887912733:10:12577:74; Thu, 19 Feb 98 18:25:33 GMT Received: from post-21.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.28]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1420923; 19 Feb 98 18:24 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk [158.152.18.44] by post.mail.demon.net with smtp id 0y5Til-000729-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 11:00:52 +0000 From:(Chris Chorley) Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 10:23:25 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: merge tags To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980219.102325.85@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 11:05:56 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Ian Goulbourne wrote: >I've a small problem with the merge tags in OP .... > What I would like to do is to put in numbers etc which take less space > than [Merge x] ie an abbreviation for the merge tag! > Could the merge label be truncated in any way eg [M 1]? So a label > containing tags might read: > >[M 1] [M 2] >[M 3] [M 4] [M 5] > >so I could see the formatting of the label I agree, *Merge 1* can take up too much space when all you are printing is a series of numbers 1..100 Chris. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 20 01:10:31 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57704 for opro ; Fri, 20 Feb 98 01:10:29 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887933461:15:00422:74; Fri, 20 Feb 98 00:11:01 GMT Received: from post-21.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.28]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa1500387; 20 Feb 98 0:10 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk [158.152.18.44] by post.mail.demon.net with smtp id 0y5Tl8-000729-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 11:03:18 +0000 From:(Simon Jones) Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 10:58:35 +0000 Organization: Subject: Index of OP professionals To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980219.105835.21@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 10:18:17 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Apologies if this is a little off-topic, but it seems the most relevant place to post. >From time to time I need facilities or services that most people (myself included) don't have. I can create documents, and proof them on a colour inkjet, but occasionally I want a few colour laser copies, a high quality black & white original for my local printer or a set of films for a CD duplicator. I know that there are Ovation/Acorn based businesses that can help, but I don't know who or where they all are. I'd like to propose compiling a web site of any professionals working with acorn software - we all know the stories of us occaional users trying to take postscript to local bureaux - and I for one would like to be able to talk someone who understands the software I'm using. I'd also like to know if there is someone just down the road from me (and I guess many others would too). This idea has been on my mind for a while, and I would happily compile and update a web site of people and companies that provide suitable services. What do others think? Would such a site fiind favour with users and providers? Any limitations (I'd be reluctant to include 'web designers' without some method of sifting the experieced pro from the likes of myself! though a graphic design co that also works on web publishing would be no problem) - its an issue of credentials. Agoin, apologies for being off-topic, but I guess that most providers of print-related services from acorn machinery will be on this list. Cheers Simon ps, this message has not got lost in the post, I put it on hold til after a busy period of work. -- Simon Jones - capelin@argonet.co.uk - Clitheroe, Lancs Freelance Sound Recordist | http://www.argonet.co.uk/capelin/ To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 20 13:34:41 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57715 for opro ; Fri, 20 Feb 98 13:34:40 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887966172:12:03027:81; Fri, 20 Feb 98 09:16:12 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ac0615198; 20 Feb 98 9:15 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aa1028003; 20 Feb 98 9:14 GMT From: Ariancylch Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 09:09:03 +0000 Organization: Lylmik Supervisory body Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980220.090904.00@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 05:59:41 +1200 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c In message <19980218.095316.75@risc.demon.co.uk> David Pilling wrote: > From: Roger King > > >Could all applets for Ovation Pro be made available for download at one > >web site? > > Given the permission of the various authors, this would be a good > idea. The snag is changing the copy on the Beebug site when the > original changes. That should be (reasonably) easy to get around, if beebug ran a script to check the modification time of the applets on the authors site. (Since Ian mentioned linux earlier I presume someone knows about cron :) -- I won't use words again | Faith | May god stand between you they don't mean what I meant |manages| and harm in all the empty they don't say what I said | - JMS | places where you must walk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 20 13:34:46 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57717 for opro ; Fri, 20 Feb 98 13:34:44 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887966328:12:04406:82; Fri, 20 Feb 98 09:18:48 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ad0615840; 20 Feb 98 9:18 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ab1028003; 20 Feb 98 9:15 GMT From: "Dr. D. M. Lewis" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 09:09:26 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: RTF - Word - or whatever To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980220.090926.41@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 17:23:57 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Wed 18 Feb, Colin Thompson wrote: > The point is, I know it's been mentioned before, how will I be able to get > stuff between Word and Ovation Pro with a=A0bit more formatting than you can > get on a straigt text file? Surely OvPro should have RTF in and out. it > seems far more essential that DDL or any fancy applets. Surely there must > be quite a lot of Ov Pro users who also use PCs? I agree, easy two-way transfer would be very welcome. Also desirable is translation of non-ASCI characters back and forwards. I use a Keystroke sequence, but an integrated solution would be nice. (As in the second line above!) To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 20 13:34:51 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57719 for opro ; Fri, 20 Feb 98 13:34:50 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887966344:15:08952:81; Fri, 20 Feb 98 09:19:04 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0615198; 20 Feb 98 9:18 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ac1028003; 20 Feb 98 9:16 GMT From: Mr J Clark Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 09:09:48 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Central applet site (Was: Various) To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980220.090948.38@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 98 20:00:32 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Thu 19 Feb 98 (10:57:29 +0000), 95ncp@eng.cam.ac.uk wrote: >On Wed, 18 Feb 1998, David Pilling wrote: > >: From: Roger King >: >: >Could all applets for Ovation Pro be made available for download at >one >: >web site? >: >: Given the permission of the various authors, this would be a good >idea. > >Why not just have links to authors own pages? One reason is that there is one source of interesting looking Applets (RJE Thompson's) that is only available during the working day so that if, like me, you can only connect at night or weekends you can not get them. John -- _________ | | jdclark@argonet.co.uk | | _/ \_ To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 20 18:18:55 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57741 for opro ; Fri, 20 Feb 98 18:18:53 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887985379:05:14325:81; Fri, 20 Feb 98 14:36:19 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0606665; 20 Feb 98 14:35 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aa2000244; 20 Feb 98 14:33 GMT From: Mr Breakwell Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 09:10:10 +0000 Organization: Subject: Indexing Tool for OP To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980220.091010.38@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 98 21:04:39 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I am nearing completition of an indexing Applet for OP. This already has al= l of the following features and I was wondering if anyome has any other req= uests before I unlease the application. I seem to recall alot of discussion= on the list about such a Tool but have been unable to locate the thread.* Support Entries and Sub entries ie: Locomotives 1-2 Evening Star 1 = Mallard 2* All = entries are independant of the document text and do not rely on 'style= s' in the base document as Impression and other OP tools do* Suppor= ts 'see' entries such as Trains See Locomotives<= nl>* Allows for page ranges as well as individual page numbers*= Allows full Page/Chapter references ie 1.1 for Chapter 1, Page 1= * Allows independant styles for both Text and page entries* Automat= ically manages duplicate index entries on the same page * Saves all= index information with document* Applet code only (no BASIC code o= r similar)* Seems to perform quite quickly...Many thanks fo= r your help (in advance)David BreakwellPS: If anyone wants = to act as a Beta tester then please contact me direct -- --. --. --. --. : : --- --- .--------------------------------------------= -. |_| |_| | _ | | | | |_ | |Internet provider for all Acorn RISC ma= chines| | | |\ | | | | |\| | | '----------------------------------= -----------' | | | \ |_| |_| | | |__ | davidb@argonet.co.uk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 20 18:19:00 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57743 for opro ; Fri, 20 Feb 98 18:18:58 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 887985435:15:21094:81; Fri, 20 Feb 98 14:37:15 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0606650; 20 Feb 98 14:36 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ab2000244; 20 Feb 98 14:33 GMT From: David Pilling Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 09:10:32 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980220.091032.39@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 98 22:12:43 GMT X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c From: "Roger Darlington" >We are told officially not to use the new features in ovation pro 2.48 'as >it is liable to change', so obviously version 2.48 is not an official >version. The new features are connected with mail merge, fields and the new merge control buttons. They are here to stay. So feel free to use them. I don't recall ever saying that these features would change. All that comes to mind is auto paragraph numbering/bulleting, that certainly will change and you should not use it in anything you intend keeping. From:(Nigel Parker) >>Given the permission of the various authors, this would be a good idea. >>The snag is changing the copy on the Beebug site when the original changes. >Why not just have links to authors own pages? I agree, and thats what we've got, but... Problem is that some of those machines are not available at all times. You've also got people changing ISP, leaving Uni etc. if they lose their web pages we don't want to lose their programs forever. I have my web pages on two sites, same pages on both. This is because you can't trust one site to always be easily accesible. Some sort of automatic mirroring would be ideal. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 20 20:44:52 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57758 for opro ; Fri, 20 Feb 98 20:44:51 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888002353:12:13353:74; Fri, 20 Feb 98 19:19:13 GMT Received: from post-2.eng.demon.net ([194.217.242.23]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0600785; 20 Feb 98 19:18 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk [158.152.18.44] by post.mail.demon.net with smtp id 0y5Tkd-000729-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 11:02:47 +0000 From:("A.F. Taylor") Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 10:57:50 +0000 Organization: Subject: Problems with Sejin wireless keyboard To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980219.105750.37@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 15:56:22 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c The Sejin wireless keyboard is a compact, convenient peice of kit with a built-in tracker ball. It appealed to me as it seemed it might lessen the risk of RSI from stretching to operate my ancient Marconi RB2 t.b. (or a mouse). However, a major snag cropped up when I tried to use it with OP. The Sejin doesn't have a 'physical' numeric pad, instead one is mapped over some of the right-hand keys when Fn and Num keys are pressed. So, what's the problem, you ask. The disaster is that OP forces the numlock on (the same as pressing the afore-mentioned keys) whenever the caret is active in a frame, thus rendering the keyboard quite useless as 8 of the normal letter keys return numbers instead of their letters! It's not possible to force it off while frames are active, the numock light (on the IR receiver unit) just blinks at you and stays resolutely on. I've tried removing the complete applets directory just in case it was a rouge applet, but no luck. So far, no other apps cause this problem, (including Impression!) so if anybody (well, David P. anyway) has any ideas about overcoming this, I'd be very grateful - otherwise I guess I've got a surplus Sejin keyboard (or I could go back to using IP?) regards, -- Arthur Taylor, Parkstone, Poole. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 20 20:49:44 1998 Received: from relay-9.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57763 for opro ; Fri, 20 Feb 98 20:49:41 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888003175:10:04601:74; Fri, 20 Feb 98 19:32:55 GMT Received: from post-2.eng.demon.net ([194.217.242.23]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1424840; 20 Feb 98 19:32 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk [158.152.18.44] by post.mail.demon.net with smtp id 0y5TjW-000729-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 11:01:38 +0000 From:(Alf Chamings) Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 10:57:05 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Smart Quotes To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980219.105705.77@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 12:36:15 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Wed 18 Feb, Dr. D. M. Lewis wrote: > Is there a problem with automatic Smart Quotes in 2.48? > (I had these working before upgrading) > Don Lewis > Sounds like you just need to set and save the relevant text option in your choices window from the icon bar. They seem fairly smart here, except they go the wrong way round at the beginning of a truncated word, of course, eg '98 for 1998. Alf -- mailto:AlfChamings@ed.ac.uk Health and Safety for the Royal Infirmary of Edinburgh tel +44 131 536 3251 fax +44 131 536 3283 http://www.med.ed.ac.uk/hew/ for occupational and environmental health To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 20 20:49:53 1998 Received: from relay-9.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57766 for opro ; Fri, 20 Feb 98 20:49:52 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888004764:09:14350:74; Fri, 20 Feb 98 19:59:24 GMT Received: from post-2.eng.demon.net ([194.217.242.23]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1404933; 20 Feb 98 19:58 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk [158.152.18.44] by post.mail.demon.net with smtp id 0y5TlP-000729-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 11:03:35 +0000 From:(Roger Penniceard) Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 10:58:59 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: merge and Impact To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980219.105859.32@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 01:07:30 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Now that I can use Impact to merge my data into OvationPro I am trying to move all my office files from Impression into OvationPro. I am having some difficulty with the merge command. If I drag the instruction from Impact sometimes it inserts the proper merge command but often it just puts in the sort of instruction one would see in Impression. It appears that to get the correct insertion I have to run OvationPro twice. I have made the recommended corrections in !TransDDF and have tried placing it in the directory which contains OvationPro or in the OvationPro Applets file. It seems better in the latter but I still have to run OvationPro twice to get the merge commmands from Impact to appear correctly.. Having got the correct commands in, the merge is correct first time, but if I clear and then remerge I get extraneous leters appearing at the end of each command. This does not happen with Impression. I have the latest copy of Impact Professional 1.47 and of course the latest upgrade of OvationPro 2.48. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l -- ||||| ||| ||| ||||| Roger Penniceard || || || || Specialist Psychological Services ||||| |||| ||||| 8 Loxley Road, London SW18 3LJ || || || Tel. +44 (0) 181 874 1569 ||||| |||| ||||| sps@pennic.demon.co.uk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Feb 20 20:51:08 1998 Received: from relay-9.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57768 for opro ; Fri, 20 Feb 98 20:51:07 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888007879:10:07485:76; Fri, 20 Feb 98 20:51:19 GMT Received: from post-2.eng.demon.net ([194.217.242.23]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1424723; 20 Feb 98 20:50 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk [158.152.18.44] by post.mail.demon.net with smtp id 0y5Tk6-000729-00; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 11:02:14 +0000 From:(Colin Thompson) Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 10:59:20 +0000 Organization: Subject: unabbreviating?? To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980219.105920.63@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 08:37:57 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Is it possible to alter the abbreviation applet? If you have an abbreviation, sa expanding to said for example, and follow the abbreviation with a comma or a full stop then it expands fine. But if you put and apostrophe aftet it it doesn't. I'd like to be able to able to type sometihng like "pe" to expand to "Peter" (which is fine) but sometimes type "pe'" to expand to "Peter'" to which I then add "s" (or "d") I realise I could set up a separate abbreviation but that seems a fiddly way of doing it. -- Colin Thompson Mail to - colinet@atlantis.aust.com Web site - http://www.atlantis.aust.com/~colinet To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Feb 23 19:32:00 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57856 for opro ; Mon, 23 Feb 98 19:31:59 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888235939:12:10242:83; Mon, 23 Feb 98 12:12:19 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0612234; 23 Feb 98 12:11 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aa1018097; 23 Feb 98 12:10 GMT From: Ian MacDougall Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 11:59:10 +0000 Organization: Beebug Ltd Subject: Spam To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980223.115910.92@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 11:50:18 +0100 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I'm getting UCE sent to the list inadvertently. I've deleted the stuff and will continue to do so, but I apologise in advance if any gets through and would like to assure you that your email addresses are not used for any other purpose than running this list. -- Ian MacDougall Beebug Ltd To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Feb 23 19:32:05 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57860 for opro ; Mon, 23 Feb 98 19:32:04 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888236165:05:01142:80; Mon, 23 Feb 98 12:16:05 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ad0614171; 23 Feb 98 12:15 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aa1019834; 23 Feb 98 12:14 GMT From: Ian Hunter Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 11:53:43 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: general To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980223.115343.58@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 09:56:54 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Thank you for your assistance re the printing. I was unable to reply earlier as I had a slight ? problem with the Inetrnet suite. Nothing wanted to work. About the printing - I went for an A4 print of both pages and enlarged on a photocopier. The results were far better than I was expecting. Thank you again -- Ian Hunter, Rocque Balan, Vale, Guernsey, Channel Islands To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Feb 23 19:32:09 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57862 for opro ; Mon, 23 Feb 98 19:32:09 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888236285:12:13712:80; Mon, 23 Feb 98 12:18:05 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0614163; 23 Feb 98 12:17 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ab1019834; 23 Feb 98 12:14 GMT From: Tim King Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 11:55:16 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Smart Quotes To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980223.115516.66@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 11:22:41 +1200 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Thu 19 Feb, Alf Chamings wrote: > Sounds like you just need to set and save the relevant text option in your > choices window from the icon bar. They seem fairly smart here, except they > go the wrong way round at the beginning of a truncated word, of course, eg > '98 for 1998. You do use the hot keys (Shft-Ctrl 1,2,3) to get 'round this, don't you? Apologies if I'm stating the obvious. tim -- d e - S i g . ph +64 9 478.3114 To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Feb 23 19:32:15 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57864 for opro ; Mon, 23 Feb 98 19:32:13 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888236294:15:17894:80; Mon, 23 Feb 98 12:18:14 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ac0614567; 23 Feb 98 12:17 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ac1019834; 23 Feb 98 12:15 GMT From: Dave Hawkins Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 11:56:50 +0000 Organization: Subject: Lists and footnotes To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980223.115650.53@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 17:17:43 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Lists: Is there an automated way to create numbered/lettered/bullet point lists? Or do I have to go through the rigamarole of setting up hanging indents and then manually entering the numbers/letters/bullets? Footnotes: Again can this be done automatically or am I going to have to mess about with adding extra frames for them? Dave To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Feb 23 19:32:19 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57866 for opro ; Mon, 23 Feb 98 19:32:18 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888236323:15:18046:80; Mon, 23 Feb 98 12:18:43 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0615133; 23 Feb 98 12:18 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ad1019834; 23 Feb 98 12:15 GMT From: Frank Lester Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 11:57:36 +0000 Organization: Subject: Mail merge V2.48 To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980223.115736.62@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 14:43:20 +0100 (BST) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I seem to remember in one of the original versions of OVPro enquiring about the function "/n" for new lines in CSV files from some data bases e.g. Datapower. I think this was corrected then, however it seem to have returned in the latest version. What I'm after is if one field is an address consisting of several lines, then each line is a new line in the merge. -- Frank Lester "Omahanui" Waitangi Falls Road RD1 Waiuku,New Zealand To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 24 13:49:28 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57943 for opro ; Tue, 24 Feb 98 13:49:27 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888317781:15:15910:81; Tue, 24 Feb 98 10:56:21 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0615577; 24 Feb 98 10:55 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aa2021542; 24 Feb 98 10:54 GMT From: "W,H, Stenfert Kroese" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 09:09:55 +0000 Organization: Subject: Upgrade To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980224.090955.58@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 09:47:30 +0100 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Apologies if I've missed something. But having upgraded to .48 OP only gives the error message: "Template Fields not found". What did I do wrong? Kroese. -- W.H. Stenfert Kroese, Dr. Schaepmanlaan 11,3972 ET Driebergen, The Netherlands. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Feb 24 13:49:37 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA57946 for opro ; Tue, 24 Feb 98 13:49:34 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888318168:12:27473:79; Tue, 24 Feb 98 11:02:48 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ac0618689; 24 Feb 98 11:02 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aa2023448; 24 Feb 98 10:58 GMT From: "Peter Daniel" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 09:11:31 +0000 Organization: University of Salford Subject: Help needed with macro To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980224.091131.87@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 13:20:53 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Can anyone tell me if it is possible, and if so how, to write a macro that will open the filer window from the directory in which the current document is saved. I have managed to do it with a specified directory using OSCLIS but don't know how to get the path of the open document. Thanks, Peter. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Visit my web site: http://rampage.ml.org/users/~peter/ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 13:44:24 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58024 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 13:44:21 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888396387:12:20076:80; Wed, 25 Feb 98 08:46:27 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0609879; 25 Feb 98 8:46 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aa2012271; 25 Feb 98 8:45 GMT From: Mr G Dance Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 11:54:08 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Index of OP professionals To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980223.115408.02@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 98 09:36:36 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Thu 19 Feb 98 (10:58:35 +0000), capelin@argonet.co.uk wrote: > I'd like to propose compiling a web site of any professionals working > with acorn software - we all know the stories of us occaional users > trying to take postscript to local bureaux - and I for one would like > to be able to talk someone who understands the software I'm using. I'd > also like to know if there is someone just down the road from me (and I > guess many others would too). Sounds like a great idea Simon, I hope you get the backing you're looking for. Regards Garth -- __ __ __ __ __ ___ _____________________________________________ |__||__)/ __/ \|\ ||_ | / | || \\__/\__/| \||__ | /...Internet access for all Acorn RISC machines ___________________________/ gdance@argonet.co.uk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 13:44:41 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58028 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 13:44:40 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888396387:15:29448:80; Wed, 25 Feb 98 08:46:27 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0609934; 25 Feb 98 8:46 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ab2012271; 25 Feb 98 8:45 GMT From: Roger Penniceard Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 11:55:41 +0000 Organization: Subject: Impact and OvationPro To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980223.115541.84@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 11:15:59 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c It appears that !TransDDF has to have been booted before OvationPro otherwise the Impact (version 1.47) merge commands are not translated from Impression format. However having got the correct commands in, the merge is correct first time, but produces extraneous letters appearing at the end of each command when the merge is cleared and a new merge done. I have told Circle Software. It appears this problem was present earlier in the development and was thought to be solved. Circle are looking into the problem. Roger -- ||||| ||| ||| ||||| Roger and Sandy Penniceard || || || || Specialist Psychological Services ||||| |||| ||||| 8 Loxley Road, London SW18 3LJ || || || Tel. +44 (0) 181 874 1569 ||||| |||| ||||| roger@pennic.demon.co.uk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 13:44:49 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58030 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 13:44:47 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888396430:15:29636:80; Wed, 25 Feb 98 08:47:10 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ac0609934; 25 Feb 98 8:47 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ad2012271; 25 Feb 98 8:46 GMT From: Chris Manning Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 11:57:59 +0000 Organization: Organisation? Er, no... Subject: Re: Central applet site (Was: Various) To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980223.115759.95@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 20:08:41 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c In message <19980220.090948.38@risc.demon.co.uk> Mr J Clark wrote: >>>> Could all applets for Ovation Pro be made available for download at >>>> one web site? >> Why not just have links to authors own pages? > One reason is that there is one source of interesting looking Applets > (RJE Thompson's) that is only available during the working day so that > if, like me, you can only connect at night or weekends you can not get > them. And if they're only on available on a web site they'll be inaccessible to those who can use only email and news. Chris To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 13:44:55 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58032 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 13:44:53 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888396445:05:27423:81; Wed, 25 Feb 98 08:47:25 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0610298; 25 Feb 98 8:47 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ae2012271; 25 Feb 98 8:46 GMT From: Richard Torrens Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 11:58:23 +0000 Organization: Subject: Pamphlet printing To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980223.115823.52@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 98 (10:31:09 +0000) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I have a problem.. American paper sizer are different: their size near A4 is 279 x 216mm (A4 is 297 x 210 So if I aim for a 279 x 210mm, I will be able to print on A4 or American size. So it should be simply Page.Edit master page Page.Page guidelines.Page:other and enter the new size. But this doesn't work for a pamphlet... I get a shorter screen and it prints out with the pamphlet dimension of 210 reduced. Not the page length reduced! So I need to alter the scaling factor - or do I? Should not page size automatically alter the scaling factor? Or am I missing something? Damn yankees! -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Richard Torrens 4QD manufacture speed controllers for battery electric motors. www site http://www.4QD.co.uk ---------- We use an Acorn RISC-PC 32 bit RISC computer ---------------- To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 13:45:00 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58034 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 13:44:59 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888396463:05:27508:81; Wed, 25 Feb 98 08:47:43 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0610291; 25 Feb 98 8:47 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ac2012271; 25 Feb 98 8:46 GMT From: Martin Tillman Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 11:57:13 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Central applet site (Was: Various) To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980223.115713.43@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 12:00:38 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c In message <19980220.090948.38@risc.demon.co.uk> Mr J Clark wrote: [snip] > > Why not just have links to authors own pages? > One reason is that there is one source of interesting looking Applets > (RJE Thompson's) that is only available during the working day so that > if, like me, you can only connect at night or weekends you can not get > them. You haven't been trying hard enough. Sometimes Rupert is so eager to get down the boozer he forgets to turn his machine off :-) (Only joking, Rupert ;-) ) -- m. PGP key available To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 16:22:42 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58060 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:22:41 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888420459:05:21102:79; Wed, 25 Feb 98 15:27:39 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0611081; 25 Feb 98 15:27 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aa2017250; 25 Feb 98 15:24 GMT From: Rupert Thompson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 09:10:17 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Smart Quotes To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980224.091017.94@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 12:42:05 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Mon 23 Feb, Tim King wrote: > On Thu 19 Feb, Alf Chamings wrote: > > Sounds like you just need to set and save the relevant text option in your > > choices window from the icon bar. They seem fairly smart here, except they > > go the wrong way round at the beginning of a truncated word, of course, eg > > '98 for 1998. > > You do use the hot keys (Shft-Ctrl 1,2,3) to get 'round this, don't you? > > Apologies if I'm stating the obvious. SC_1 only gives a sexless single quote. I have a key macro set up for SC_' which gives a single close quote / apostrophe. -- Rupert Thompson Queens' College, Cambridge, CB3 9ET, UK http://rjet1.quns.cam.ac.uk/ (when my computer's on!) To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 16:22:47 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58062 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:22:46 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888420490:12:02215:79; Wed, 25 Feb 98 15:28:10 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0611682; 25 Feb 98 15:27 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ad2017250; 25 Feb 98 15:25 GMT From: Rupert Thompson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 09:12:18 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Lists and footnotes To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980224.091218.51@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 13:48:48 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Mon 23 Feb, Dave Hawkins wrote: > Footnotes: > Again can this be done automatically or am I going to have to mess about > with adding extra frames for them? Footnotes, no. You'll have to faff around with frames by hand. If you can settle for end notes, there's an applet which handles them with automatic renumbering etc. available from my website. (There's a *much* earlier version on the Beebug website, but this lacks an awful lot of functionality). -- Rupert Thompson Queens' College, Cambridge, CB3 9ET, UK http://rjet1.quns.cam.ac.uk/ (when my computer's on!) To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 16:22:51 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58064 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:22:50 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888420496:15:11513:81; Wed, 25 Feb 98 15:28:16 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0610947; 25 Feb 98 15:28 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ab2017250; 25 Feb 98 15:24 GMT From: Alf Chamings Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 09:10:43 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Smart Quotes To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980224.091043.47@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 12:53:59 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Mon 23 Feb, Tim King wrote: > On Thu 19 Feb, Alf Chamings wrote: >> Sounds like you just need to set and save the relevant text option in your >> choices window from the icon bar. They seem fairly smart here, except they >> go the wrong way round at the beginning of a truncated word, of course, eg >> '98 for 1998. > > You do use the hot keys (Shft-Ctrl 1,2,3) to get 'round this, don't you? > > Apologies if I'm stating the obvious. > I may be obvious but that did not prevent me forgetting it. Thanks. Alf -- mailto:AlfChamings@ed.ac.uk Health and Safety for the Royal Infirmary of Edinburgh tel +44 131 536 3251 fax +44 131 536 3283 http://www.med.ed.ac.uk/hew/ for occupational and environmental health To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 16:22:57 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58066 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:22:55 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888420589:12:02722:80; Wed, 25 Feb 98 15:29:49 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0611166; 25 Feb 98 15:28 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ac2017250; 25 Feb 98 15:25 GMT From: Paul Sprangers Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 09:11:06 +0000 Organization: Subject: Knocking out grahics To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980224.091106.28@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 16:41:55 +0100 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c After downloading OvationPro 1.48 I am glad to see that 'overprint' for text now works perfectly. However, OPro still doesn't knock out graphics. As an example: a vector file, containing a lot of white, placed upon a spotcoloured background, will loose its white and gain the spotcolour instead in the eventual print. I hate to say it, but Publisher perfectly - and automatically - knocks out all graphics on the spotcolour plate, no matter how irregular these graphics are. And because I often have to produce these kinds of prints, I have to stick with Publisher - and thus missing all the extra features of Ovation. Is there any chance that this will change in the near future? Kind regards, Paul Sprangers To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 16:23:01 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58068 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:23:00 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888420895:05:24291:81; Wed, 25 Feb 98 15:34:55 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0613434; 25 Feb 98 15:34 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aa2019438; 25 Feb 98 15:30 GMT From: Rupert Thompson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 11:54:29 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Central applet site (Was: Various) To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980223.115429.37@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 11:38:04 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Fri 20 Feb, Mr J Clark wrote: > On Thu 19 Feb 98 (10:57:29 +0000), 95ncp@eng.cam.ac.uk wrote: > >On Wed, 18 Feb 1998, David Pilling wrote: > > > >: From: Roger King > >: > >: >Could all applets for Ovation Pro be made available for download at > >one > >: >web site? > >: > >: Given the permission of the various authors, this would be a good > >idea. > > > >Why not just have links to authors own pages? > > One reason is that there is one source of interesting looking Applets (RJE > Thompson's) that is only available during the working day so that if, like me, > you can only connect at night or weekends you can not get them. I'd be quite happy for my applets to be available from the Beebug website, or any other one for that matter. The reason that mine is only available during the day, is because it's located on my RISC PC. It's normally switched on most of the daytime and evening, weekends too. It's just that my ethernet socket is rather conveniently in my bedroom, and the fan makes a noise! One of these days I'll work out how to upload them to HENSA, I s'pose. -- Rupert Thompson Queens' College, Cambridge, CB3 9ET, UK http://rjet1.quns.cam.ac.uk/ (when my computer's on!) To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 16:23:07 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58070 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:23:06 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888420909:05:24543:80; Wed, 25 Feb 98 15:35:09 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0614736; 25 Feb 98 15:34 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ac2019438; 25 Feb 98 15:31 GMT From: David Scott Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 11:58:47 +0000 Organization: Subject: Colour matching To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980223.115847.48@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 98 17:27:54 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I have a simple approach to colour matching which may be of interest. I have produced an Ovation file which consists of two A4 pages of colour samples. These consist of small areas of solid colour each about 20x5mm in size covering all the combinations of Cyan, Magenta and Yellow from 0 to 100% in 20% steps, a total of 216 samples. When needing to match a colour for a specific printer setting, I print out these test pages on that printer and then choose the colour that is nearest to the desired colour, or make suitable adjustments when the colour is between two of the samples. Note that it is essential for the tests to be done with the same settings of printer resolution, dithering, paper quality, etc. as the actual work, since the reproduction of colours varies considerably with all these factors. -- __ __ __ __ __ ___ _____________________________________________ |__||__)/ __/ \|\ ||_ | / | || \\__/\__/| \||__ | /...Internet access for all Acorn RISC machines ___________________________/ David Scott - email: djscott@argonet.co.uk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 16:23:12 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58072 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:23:11 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888420976:12:05535:80; Wed, 25 Feb 98 15:36:16 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ai0612354; 25 Feb 98 15:35 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ab2019438; 25 Feb 98 15:31 GMT From: Chris Johnson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 11:56:27 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980223.115627.10@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 17:41:12 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On 20 Feb, David Pilling wrote: > From:(Nigel Parker) > >>Given the permission of the various authors, this would be a good > >>idea. The snag is changing the copy on the Beebug site when the > >>original changes. > >Why not just have links to authors own pages? > I agree, and thats what we've got, but... > Problem is that some of those machines are not available at all times. > You've also got people changing ISP, leaving Uni etc. if they lose their > web pages we don't want to lose their programs forever. I have my web > pages on two sites, same pages on both. This is because you can't trust > one site to always be easily accesible. Some sort of automatic mirroring > would be ideal. > David Pilling I am sure you will get many replies - however I would be willing to set up some sort of mirror of available applets on one of my machines. There would be no time or other restrictions on access. Chris -- Chris Johnson mailto: C.A.Johnson@hw.ac.uk Department of Chemistry phone: 0131 449 5111 x 4116 Heriot-Watt University Edinburgh EH14 4AS To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 16:23:17 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58074 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:23:15 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888421120:05:26002:79; Wed, 25 Feb 98 15:38:40 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0616313; 25 Feb 98 15:38 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aa2020677; 25 Feb 98 15:33 GMT From: Matthew Gotts Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 09:08:44 +0000 Organization: Subject: Colour Printing! To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980224.090844.25@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 21:48:26 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c This is probably a really stupid question, but I've tried various things, been reading the various articles on the mailing list, and possibly slightly understand what's going on, but I still can't get something to work... What I want to do is basically this: I have a printer (Canon BJC250) which uses separate heads for colour and black. Some years ago at school, I got a picture printed (the one of the MG Midget), by printing first the colour, then overlaying the black on the top by sending it through the second time. I've been trying this with the colour separations thing, and after a lot of puzzling have come to the conclusion that the repeated grey outputs, even with just magenta selected, are all I'm going to get, and are what's usual (ie that's what part of the paper the magenta is printed on etc). So, can I somehow do the thing of printing first the colours, then the black. Of course, I can print out in full colour using the colour print head, but black is just a dark brown, so not great. Any suggestions, clues or even page numbers in the manual (which I have tried to use) will be most appreciated. This is quite amusing if you knew what my job is.... Many thanks Matt -- Matt Gotts (magnox@zetnet.co.uk) http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/magnox/ To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 16:23:22 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58076 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:23:21 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888421200:05:26410:84; Wed, 25 Feb 98 15:40:00 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0616705; 25 Feb 98 15:38 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ac2020677; 25 Feb 98 15:34 GMT From: Alan Muscat Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 09:13:31 +0000 Organization: Grapevine Digital Arts Subject: Re: Typography To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980224.091331.01@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 23:51:57 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c In message <19980206.094833.46@risc.demon.co.uk> you wrote: > > One thing I would like to be able to see and easily change without going through > menus, is the leading which is being used at the cursor point in the text. > Could this be part of the the Info Palette? When setting up display panels, as > opposed to normal text, I find it very useful to be able to change the leading > to get the vertical spacing just as I want it. Multiple line spacing is too > course an adjustment much of the time. What I don't understand is why leading is not in the modify text dialogue, it seems such a logical place to include it. I need easy access to leading alteration. David P could you re-post the short cut you said you had given out. Ta -- Alan Muscat *************** Grapevine Digital Arts *********************** ************** http://www.gvine.demon.co.uk ********************* To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 16:23:27 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58078 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:23:26 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888421231:12:07056:82; Wed, 25 Feb 98 15:40:31 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0613434; 25 Feb 98 15:40 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ab2020677; 25 Feb 98 15:34 GMT From: Chris Manning Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 09:09:08 +0000 Organization: Organisation? Er, no... Subject: Re: unabbreviating?? To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980224.090908.30@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 11:05:52 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c In message <19980219.105920.63@risc.demon.co.uk> colinet@ozemail.com.au (Colin Thompson) wrote: > Is it possible to alter the abbreviation applet? Assuming that you have access to a text editor it would seem to be quite straightforward. > If you have an abbreviation, sa expanding to said for example, and follow > the abbreviation with a comma or a full stop then it expands fine. > But if you put and apostrophe aftet it it doesn't. I'd like to be able to > able to type sometihng like "pe" to expand to "Peter" (which is fine) but > sometimes type "pe'" to expand to "Peter'" to which I then add "s" (or "d") Beebug go to the trouble of providing us with a scripting language, they write most of the applets in that scripting language so that we can adapt them to our own needs, they even include copious comments in those scripts. // check if key is 'space', 'new para', 'tab', 'new line', 'new page', 'full stop' or 'comma' if (key == ' ' || key == 13 || key == 394 || key == 2061 || key == 6669 || key == '.' || key == ',') You may find that adding || key == '\'' to that line helps. Chris To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 16:23:32 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58080 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:23:31 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888421283:05:27396:83; Wed, 25 Feb 98 15:41:23 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ae0610927; 25 Feb 98 15:41 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aa2022282; 25 Feb 98 15:38 GMT From: Rupert Thompson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 11:56:04 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: unabbreviating?? To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980223.115604.42@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 12:27:30 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Thu 19 Feb, Colin Thompson wrote: > Is it possible to alter the abbreviation applet? > > If you have an abbreviation, sa expanding to said for example, and follow > the abbreviation with a comma or a full stop then it expands fine. > > But if you put and apostrophe aftet it it doesn't. I'd like to be able to > able to type sometihng like "pe" to expand to "Peter" (which is fine) but > sometimes type "pe'" to expand to "Peter'" to which I then add "s" (or "d") > > I realise I could set up a separate abbreviation but that seems a fiddly > way of doing it. Easy to do. You need to make the following changes to file !OvnPro.Applets.!Abbrev.Library.Abbrev. (Make a copy of this file into another directory first, in case things go wrong. It *must* be in another directory, or OP will try to load it and complain.) (1) Find the lines in function abbrev_fix() which read: // check if key is 'space', 'new para', 'tab', 'new line' or 'new page' if (key == 32 || key == 13 || key == 394 || key == 2061 || key == 6669) and change the lower line to read: if (key == 32 || key == 13 || key == 394 || key == 2061 || key == 6669 || abbrev_ispunct(key)) (2) Then add the following lines near the top of the file, after the line which starts 'string abbrev_path=' and before the definition of function abbrev_readdata(): int abbrev_ispunct(int c) { return "!'?.,:;/\""/chars(c)+1; } (in case the stuff in the quotes has got mangled, it consists of a list of punctuation marks which you want to be able to trigger abbreviation expansion. If you want the plain double quotes to be included, you need to prefix it with a backward slash). -- Rupert Thompson Queens' College, Cambridge, CB3 9ET, UK http://rjet1.quns.cam.ac.uk/ (when my computer's on!) To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 16:23:37 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58082 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:23:36 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888421413:12:08250:79; Wed, 25 Feb 98 15:43:33 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0619934; 25 Feb 98 15:42 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ab2022859; 25 Feb 98 15:41 GMT From: Kevin Pearcey Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 09:09:32 +0000 Organization: Subject: User Interface To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980224.090932.40@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 23:21:53 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I'm slowly trying to use ovation more than Publisher but I keep getting stuck by the same thing. No one designed a sensible user interface to the thing. Could I please have somebody explain why they thought that all these writable menu entries and fixed size scrolling lists were a good thing to copy from windows? At least you have kept to a pop-up menu for the font list, and not put this is a 6 line scrolling window, so why force so many lists where it would be far quicker to select an item if you could see the choice (the borders window must be the worst for this). In my opinion this is a very bad bit of thinking and holds back what is otherwise a very good programming effort. These windows just make Ovation Pro, look like Ovation Amateur. What will happen once we get Risc PC II, with the even bigger screen modes, with these small 35mm high scrolling lists. The other complaint is with all these writable menus. Why not just have the display field editable, and also allow for the pop up menu list for selection. This means I can click and edit straight away rather than having to open up a menu, position the mouse over the correct field, move to the keyboard making sure the mouse does not move and enter a value. For a simple example look at the text size field in Publishers toolbar - Simple and easy. I could go on, but I'll leave it there for now. There is so much good software that is crippled by bad interface design. Sort out Ovation before it joins up with all the others. -- Kevin Pearcey To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 16:23:42 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58084 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:23:41 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888421414:15:14213:81; Wed, 25 Feb 98 15:43:34 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0619611; 25 Feb 98 15:43 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aa2022859; 25 Feb 98 15:40 GMT From: Andy Clements Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 09:08:18 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Colour Supplement Problems To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980224.090818.79@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 00:06:34 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c This is a MIME encapsulated message. --481c1f8f51DnlTMv6zzJ+nOHgx0JKMa0 Content-Type: text/plain On 18 Feb, Alan Muscat wrote: > I am having problems with colour production in Ovation Pro. > I have version 1.02 of the Supplement and it is switched > on. I am using a RPC 700. > The problem is, when I choose a cmyk colour the colour > on the screen and on print out is very wrong. For example > I want a purple. I choose 100% cyan and 100% magenta > and zero for the rest. This gives me black both on screen > and print out. Switching to RGB shows a purple/blue hue, as > does !Paint with the same values in cmyk. I noticed much > earlier that the cyan and magenta in the default colour > pallette looked strange, but it is only now that I > have needed to use the colour supplement for serious > work. > So am I doing something wrong? Or does the problem lie else > where. A quick response to my problem would be appreciated > since I need to print this job very soon. > Thanks Your system is looking at the wrong version. Have a look in Artworks viewer or Artworks or in the !CCShared folder for another more up-to-date version; or use the one sent. Regards Andy [ This is Ian here... Hello! I've snipped the binary posting, I don't know if this was meant to be a private email or not but please don't post binaries through the list, ta - Ian] -- Regards, Andy To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 16:23:48 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58086 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:23:45 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888421503:05:29022:79; Wed, 25 Feb 98 15:45:03 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0619635; 25 Feb 98 15:44 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ac2022859; 25 Feb 98 15:41 GMT From: Jeff Wright Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 09:11:55 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Editing Master Pages To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980224.091155.02@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 19:45:38 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c In on Tue 03 Feb, Chris Chorley wrote: > I tried editing the master pages for an OPro document which was originally > created under 2.46, and worked perfectly up to now in 2.48. All I did was > try to add a footer by changing the value from 0 to 10. Click ok and the > whole machine locks with no message. The document is only four A4 pages, > with the default master page. I'll get round it by creating a new document, > but I'm glad I saved it *before* trying to add a footer. > > RPC/SA 20Mb RAM OPro 2.48 > > Chris. Are you sure the machine hangs? The reason I say this is that I once had a similar problem were I decided to edit the master page of a document that already contained some pages. On attempting to close the master page the machine appeared to hang, so I reset the machine and tried again. Just as I closed the master page on my second attempt I was called away from the computer. A few minutes later on my return the master page had closed and OvPro was running as normal. After further investigation, it appears that if some pages have been created and the master page of these pages is then edited and then closed it can, on occasions, take a while for OvPro to sort itself out. So although it appears to crash it in fact does not. Perhaps Mr Pilling could make a comment on this problem. -- Jeff Wright To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 16:23:52 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58088 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:23:51 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888421618:05:00050:83; Wed, 25 Feb 98 15:46:58 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ad0621051; 25 Feb 98 15:46 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ad2022859; 25 Feb 98 15:42 GMT From: Alan Muscat Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 09:12:42 +0000 Organization: Grapevine Digital Arts Subject: Postscript printing with Ovation To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980224.091242.52@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 23:46:29 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Are there any Acorn users out there who fairly regularly generate colour postscript files, from single pages to multi-page documents, for professional quality printing?(using Ovation Pro of course) What is your success rate? Is it fairly safe? I know that I can send files to TJ Repro and have Tony create postscript files which are then sent to the imagesetter, or I could use Alternative Publishing who convert to postscript but have film and print done externally. But I'd like to do it myself so that I can go to local imagesetter/printers or other printers of my choice, or to a digital printer (a company called CMYK in Croydon being the best Indigo users I have found). But is it a very hit and miss affair as some have suggested? I have output to postscript before, but only in black and white, and there were some problems, although the cause of them was not established. Can I be confident converting to postscript? A local printer has said he would be delighted if I did provide him with postscript files because it would save him a lot of hassle. And should I still stick to Postscript level one? -- Alan Muscat *************** Grapevine Digital Arts *********************** ************** http://www.gvine.demon.co.uk ********************* To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 16:24:00 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58090 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:23:58 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888421656:15:14905:82; Wed, 25 Feb 98 15:47:36 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0621551; 25 Feb 98 15:47 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ab2024116; 25 Feb 98 15:44 GMT From: David Pilling Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 09:14:17 +0000 Organization: Subject: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980224.091417.03@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 98 01:51:04 GMT X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c From: Dave Hawkins >Is there an automated way to create numbered/lettered/bullet point lists? >Or do I have to go through the rigamarole of setting up hanging indents >and then manually entering the numbers/letters/bullets? >Again can this be done automatically or am I going to have to mess about >with adding extra frames for them? Sorry, but for now, you'll have to do it the hard way. As I've commented before the program does have a load of bullet/para numbering stuff in it now, but it is not enabled and will change before it is officially supported. Footnotes are a good one. I'd like to do those, but rather nasty when (unlike word processors) you don't have a constant flow width. From: Frank Lester >I seem to remember in one of the original versions of OVPro enquiring >about the function "/n" for new lines in CSV files from some data bases >e.g. Datapower. I think this was corrected then, however it seem to have >returned in the latest version. My total recollection is that Mr. Singleton asked about this just before Christmas, and I fixed it. So it will appear in 2.49. From:(private mail) >I also find I can't select, or apply effects to, text which has flowed out of >a frame. I need to be able to select everything after a chosen point in the >text and reduce its size, font or leading etc. There a several work-arounds >but they are very tedious when compared with the ability to select everything >and simply apply a smaller type size. >I'm dearly hoping you're going to say "RTFM. To select all the text after a >chosen point simply...", here, 'cos this is one of those small seemingly >insignificant things that are INCREDIBLY irritating. This is a solution. Define a key macro and for the body have this; {int b;b=bmcreate(\"k1\");setbmtocaret(b);bmmove(b,1,4);setzonetobm(b);bmdelete(b);} That will give you a key press which selects to the end of the current story. David Pilling To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 16:24:06 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58092 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:24:03 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888421722:12:10526:79; Wed, 25 Feb 98 15:48:42 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0622057; 25 Feb 98 15:48 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aa2024116; 25 Feb 98 15:44 GMT From: Alan Muscat Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 09:13:07 +0000 Organization: Grapevine Digital Arts Subject: Re: Index of OP professionals To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980224.091307.13@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 23:30:17 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c In message <19980219.105835.21@risc.demon.co.uk> you wrote: > Apologies if this is a little off-topic, but it seems the most relevant > place to post. > > >From time to time I need facilities or services that most people (myself > included) don't have. I can create documents, and proof them on a colour > inkjet, but occasionally I want a few colour laser copies, a high quality > black & white original for my local printer or a set of films for a CD > duplicator. > > I know that there are Ovation/Acorn based businesses that can help, but I > don't know who or where they all are. > > I'd like to propose compiling a web site of any professionals working with > acorn software - we all know the stories of us occaional users trying to > take postscript to local bureaux - and I for one would like to be able to > talk someone who understands the software I'm using. I'd also like to > know if there is someone just down the road from me (and I guess many > others would too). > > This idea has been on my mind for a while, and I would happily compile and > update a web site of people and companies that provide suitable services. > > What do others think? Would such a site fiind favour with users and > providers? Any limitations (I'd be reluctant to include 'web designers' > without some method of sifting the experieced pro from the likes of > myself! though a graphic design co that also works on web publishing would > be no problem) - its an issue of credentials. > > Agoin, apologies for being off-topic, but I guess that most providers of > print-related services from acorn machinery will be on this list. > > Cheers > Simon > > ps, this message has not got lost in the post, I put it on hold til after > a busy period of work. > I was about to send a very similar post. I am particularly interested in the services of illustrators using Acorn kit. I also want the services of large format printers(inkjet etc.) -- Alan Muscat *************** Grapevine Digital Arts *********************** ************** http://www.gvine.demon.co.uk ********************* For the correct email address make demo read demon. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 16:24:12 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58094 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:24:09 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888421795:05:01418:80; Wed, 25 Feb 98 15:49:55 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0622394; 25 Feb 98 15:49 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aa2025088; 25 Feb 98 15:46 GMT From: David Pilling Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 09:13:53 +0000 Organization: Subject: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980224.091353.69@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 98 01:51:00 GMT X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c From:("A.F. Taylor") >The disaster is that OP forces the numlock on (the same as pressing the >afore-mentioned keys) whenever the caret is active in a frame, thus >rendering the keyboard quite useless Hmm. todays entry in the 'I never knew there was so much in it' stakes. I quoth... >Num Lock > >void keyboardmode(int mode); >#define KEYNUMLOCKKEY 0x1 - Num lock >#define KEYBREAKKEY 0x2 - Break generates codes >#define KEYAUTORATE 0x4 - !Auto repeat >#define KEYACTIONKEY 0x8 - Action key != Control key >#define KEYSCROLLLOCKKEY 0x10 - Scroll lock >Default - (KEYNUMLOCKKEY|KEYSCROLLLOCKKEY) So you stick a keyboardmode(0x10); In your !OvnPro.AutoRun.!Custom file, and it stops messing about with Numlock. From:(Alf Chamings) >Sounds like you just need to set and save the relevant text option in your >choices window from the icon bar. They seem fairly smart here, except they go >the wrong way round at the beginning of a truncated word, of course, eg '98 Don't confuse 'smart quotes' in choices which is to do with text file import with 'smart quotes' when you type which requires the presence of the smart quotes applet. From:(Roger Penniceard) >I am having some difficulty with the merge command. If I drag the >instruction from Impact sometimes it inserts the proper merge command but >often it just puts in the sort of instruction one would see in Impression. >It appears that to get the correct insertion I have to run OvationPro twice. There's the following fact. The !Custom file in OPro sets up OPro's text loading based on the presence of a system variable which is set by the TransDDF !Boot file. (we hope you modified !Boot as well as !Run). Anyway this means that TransDDF must be booted *before* you run OPro. I don't think sticking it in the applets directory will fulfil that requirement. >Having got the correct commands in, the merge is correct first time, but >if I clear and then remerge I get extraneous letters appearing at the end >of each command. Hmm. I wonder if that's a common problem? I didn't notice it when I was testing. From:(Colin Thompson) >Is it possible to alter the abbreviation applet? >But if you put and apostrophe after it it doesn't. I'd like to be able to >able to type something like "pe" to expand to "Peter" (which is fine) but >sometimes type "pe'" to expand to "Peter'" to which I then add "s" (or "d") Yep, find this bit in the !Abbrev.Library.Abbrev file; // check if key is 'space', 'new para', 'tab', 'new line', 'new page','full stop' or 'comma' if (key == ' ' || key == 13 || key == 394 || key == 2061 || key == 6669 || key == '.' || key == ',') { And add your own clause on to the chain of || (== or)'s - i.e. || key=='\'' From: Norman Thomas >We have corresponded in recent days about the item Applets> that went >missing from the end of my main OvPro menu, so making it impossible to get >at the Applets menu. >I have now found that I can repeat and correct the condition. >I have, in my OvPro/upgrade material a directory called Extras.Scripts. It >contains Calculator, FancyDate, Fraction, JoinLines, Unique. They are not >!Applet files. The Readme in the directory tells me that 'the example >scripts in this directory should be copied into !OvnPro.Library and then >Ovation Pro re-run. A new menu called Script will appear at the bottom of >the main menu giving access...' >I have not tried every one of the 'scripts', just Calculator and Fancy Date. >If either is put into .Library, then the Applet> item goes missing. There is >no additional item such as Script>. >I presume that these are old and discontinued predecessors of Applets. Yes those are 'applet scripts' from an ancient version of OPro. They've all been superseded by new improved versions. In technical terms we changed the way applets add themselves to the main menu. Anyone else who has lost their applet menu please take note... David Pilling To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 16:24:18 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58096 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:24:16 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888421837:05:01723:82; Wed, 25 Feb 98 15:50:37 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0623328; 25 Feb 98 15:50 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aa2025590; 25 Feb 98 15:48 GMT From: David Pilling Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 11:54:52 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980223.115452.80@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 98 22:09:14 GMT X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c From:("A.F. Taylor") >The disaster is that OP forces the numlock on (the same as pressing the >afore-mentioned keys) whenever the caret is active in a frame, thus >rendering the keyboard quite useless Hmm. todays entry in the 'I never knew there was so much in it' stakes. I quoth... >Num Lock > >void keyboardmode(int mode); >#define KEYNUMLOCKKEY 0x1 - Num lock >#define KEYBREAKKEY 0x2 - Break generates codes >#define KEYAUTORATE 0x4 - !Auto repeat >#define KEYACTIONKEY 0x8 - Action key != Control key >#define KEYSCROLLLOCKKEY 0x10 - Scroll lock >Default - (KEYNUMLOCKKEY|KEYSCROLLLOCKKEY) So you stick a keyboardmode(0x10); In your !OvnPro.AutoRun.!Custom file, and it stops messing about with Numlock. From:(Alf Chamings) >Sounds like you just need to set and save the relevant text option in your >choices window from the icon bar. They seem fairly smart here, except they go >the wrong way round at the beginning of a truncated word, of course, eg '98 Don't confuse 'smart quotes' in choices which is to do with text file import with 'smart quotes' when you type which requires the presence of the smart quotes applet. From:(Roger Penniceard) >I am having some difficulty with the merge command. If I drag the >instruction from Impact sometimes it inserts the proper merge command but >often it just puts in the sort of instruction one would see in Impression. >It appears that to get the correct insertion I have to run OvationPro twice. There's the following fact. The !Custom file in OPro sets up OPro's text loading based on the presence of a system variable which is set by the TransDDF !Boot file. (I hope you modified !Boot as well as !Run). Anyway this means that TransDDF must be booted *before* you run OPro. I don't think sticking it in the applets directory will fulfil that requirement. >Having got the correct commands in, the merge is correct first time, but >if I clear and then remerge I get extraneous letters appearing at the end >of each command. Hmm. I wonder if that's a common problem? I didn't notice it when I was testing. From:(Colin Thompson) >Is it possible to alter the abbreviation applet? >But if you put and apostrophe after it it doesn't. I'd like to be able to >able to type something like "pe" to expand to "Peter" (which is fine) but >sometimes type "pe'" to expand to "Peter'" to which I then add "s" (or "d") Yep, find this bit in the !Abbrev.Library.Abbrev file; // check if key is 'space', 'new para', 'tab', 'new line', 'new page','full stop' or 'comma' if (key == ' ' || key == 13 || key == 394 || key == 2061 || key == 6669 || key == '.' || key == ',') { And add your own clause on to the chain of || (== or)'s - i.e. || key=='\'' From: Norman Thomas (private email) >We have corresponded in recent days about the item Applets> that went >missing from the end of my main OvPro menu, so making it impossible to get >at the Applets menu. >I have now found that I can repeat and correct the condition. >I have, in my OvPro/upgrade material a directory called Extras.Scripts. It >contains Calculator, FancyDate, Fraction, JoinLines, Unique. They are not >!Applet files. The Readme in the directory tells me that 'the example >scripts in this directory shold be copied into !OvnPro.Library and then >Ovation Pro re-run. A new menu called Script will appear at the bottom of >the main menu giving access...' >I have not tried every one of the 'scripts', just Calculator and Fancy Date. >If either is put into .Library, then the Applet> item goes missing. There is >no additional item such as Script>. >I presume that these are old and discontinued predecessors of Applets. Yes those are 'applet scripts' from an ancient version of OPro. They've all been superseded by new improved versions. In technical terms we changed the way applets add themselves to the main menu. Anyone else who has lost their applet menu please take note... David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 16:24:27 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58099 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:24:26 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888422987:05:10386:81; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:09:47 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0603039; 25 Feb 98 16:09 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ae1007478; 25 Feb 98 16:06 GMT From: Rob Hemmings Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 15:54:37 +0000 Organization: Subject: Spelling errors To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980225.155437.47@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 98 (18:59:01 +0000) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Has anyone else noticed that when you switch on the highlighting of spelling errors a word including a drop capital is not treated correctly. E.g. Lots is shown as a spelling error if the L is a drop capital. Despite this if you then do a spelling check of the document Ovation reports no spelling errors - but still keeps the red underline. (I'm using Ovation 2.48.) -- ------------------------------------------------------------- Rob Hemmings Southport Tel: +44 (0)1704 573210 robh@argonet.co.uk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 16:24:31 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58101 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:24:30 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888423105:15:19401:89; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:11:45 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0604652; 25 Feb 98 16:11 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ag1007478; 25 Feb 98 16:07 GMT From: "W,H, Stenfert Kroese" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 15:56:00 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Lists and footnotes To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980225.155600.87@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 13:47:17 +0100 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Mon 23 Feb, Dave Hawkins wrote: > > Footnotes: > Again can this be done automatically or am I going to have to mess about > with adding extra frames for them? Yes. No. Rupert Thomson's excellent applet !Endnotes is the answer. http://rjet1.quns.cam.ac.uk/ Kroese > > To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk > with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l > To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l > > > -- W.H. Stenfert Kroese, Dr. Schaepmanlaan 11,3972 ET Driebergen, The Netherlands. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 16:24:35 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58103 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:24:34 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888423176:15:19612:80; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:12:56 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0605603; 25 Feb 98 16:12 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ai1007478; 25 Feb 98 16:09 GMT From: Rupert Thompson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 15:57:46 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Central applet site (Was: Various) To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980225.155746.45@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 10:49:12 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Mon 23 Feb, Martin Tillman wrote: > In message <19980220.090948.38@risc.demon.co.uk> > Mr J Clark wrote: > > [snip] > > > Why not just have links to authors own pages? > > > One reason is that there is one source of interesting looking Applets > > (RJE Thompson's) that is only available during the working day so that > > if, like me, you can only connect at night or weekends you can not get > > them. > > You haven't been trying hard enough. > > Sometimes Rupert is so eager to get down the boozer he forgets to turn his > machine off :-) > > (Only joking, Rupert ;-) ) Ah, you've clearly been spying on me ;-) -- Rupert Thompson Queens' College, Cambridge, CB3 9ET, UK http://rjet1.quns.cam.ac.uk/ (when my computer's on!) To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 16:24:51 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58105 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:24:48 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888423200:05:12106:79; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:13:20 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ad0604563; 25 Feb 98 16:12 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ak1007478; 25 Feb 98 16:10 GMT From: "Dr. D. M. Lewis" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 15:58:27 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: smart quotes To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980225.155827.08@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 12:23:46 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Thu 19 Feb, David Pilling wrote: > > > From: "Dr. D. M. Lewis" > > >Is there a problem with automatic Smart Quotes in 2.48? > >(I had these working before upgrading) > > Not as far as I know. One obvious suggestion, did you reinstall > the quotes applet in 2.48? Thanks, but I meant the option to transform to quotes on importing a document under control of the option in Application Choices (Text). Incidentally I have just noticed thar the Smart Quotes applet will transform quotes typed in or entered via Alt-numerical keypad but not by clicking on the Charcters box. Don't change that it is useful when wishing to switch between quotes types! Don Lewis To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 16:24:55 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58107 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:24:54 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888423213:12:21158:83; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:13:33 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0600292; 25 Feb 98 16:12 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aj1007478; 25 Feb 98 16:09 GMT From: Rupert Thompson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 15:58:05 +0000 Organization: Subject: The return of THe dreaded ellipsis ... To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980225.155805.64@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 10:57:46 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c A wee while ago I released version 1.72 of the !THe applet, which adds extra support for ligature and ellipsis substitution. I carelessly didn't bother announcing it, though. Both have lists of 'exception fonts' - for fi/fl ligatures these just specify that ligatures are not to be used for that font family - useful for symbol fonts, or Corpus, say. For ellipsis substitution you can either specify that ellipses should not be used for a font family, or that the ellipsis character is in a non-standard place in that family, which is useful if you're using EFF fonts. -- Rupert Thompson Queens' College, Cambridge, CB3 9ET, UK http://rjet1.quns.cam.ac.uk/ (when my computer's on!) To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 16:25:01 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58109 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:25:00 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888423222:12:21232:81; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:13:42 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ae0604496; 25 Feb 98 16:13 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id af1007478; 25 Feb 98 16:07 GMT From: "andy.ling@quantel.com" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 15:55:19 +0000 Organization: Quantel Ltd. Subject: Re: Help needed with macro To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980225.155519.82@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 12:27:41 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c > Can anyone tell me if it is possible, and if so how, to write a macro > that will open the filer window from the directory in which the > current document is saved. I have managed to do it with a specified > directory using OSCLIS but don't know how to get the path of the > open document. It may sound a bit obvious, but if all you want to do is open the filer window why not just right click on the close icon with the shift key held down. Of course if you want something more complex then over to someone else. Andy Ling To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 16:25:05 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58111 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:25:04 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888423438:12:22532:79; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:17:18 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ai0604652; 25 Feb 98 16:16 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ab1009706; 25 Feb 98 16:13 GMT From: Stephen Brown Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 15:53:10 +0000 Organization: Subject: Fatal error with Artworks file To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980225.155310.06@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 11:39:42 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Hello, Currently I am using OP 2.48 to write my thesis but I have come across a fatal error when trying to import an artworks file. The problem isn't so much the importing, the file apparently loads in fine, as it appears on the page, BUT when I try to center the digram I get the following fatal error: Internal error, no stack for trap handler. Data abort, pc=33A17990 reg at 00119494. I have repeated the same action several times and I get the same error on each occasion. The Artworks file in question does not use any facility not available in Artworks as sold by CC and is only 131K in size. If I convert the file to Draw format, then I can use it without any problem in OP 2.48. Any ideas? Steve -- ______ _ / \ | | http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/stephen.brown \ ___/ | |_ ___ __ __ ___ \__ \ | _| / _ \ \ \/ / / _ \ / \ | |___ | __/ \ / | __/ \______/ |_____| \___| \/ \___| To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 16:25:10 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58113 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:25:09 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888423466:05:13775:79; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:17:46 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0608173; 25 Feb 98 16:16 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aa1009706; 25 Feb 98 16:13 GMT From: "Jamie Lawrence" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 15:52:45 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Lists and footnotes To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980225.155245.03@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 16:54:26 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c > Lists: > Is there an automated way to create numbered/lettered/bullet point lists? > Or do I have to go through the rigamarole of setting up hanging indents > and then manually entering the numbers/letters/bullets? I've written an applet which does bulleted lists, but I'm afraid I won't be releasing it until it's been tested and I have the time available to make it work consistantly - final year projects have priority at the moment. If it gets used in my dissertation it will probably be of release quality. > > Footnotes: > Again can this be done automatically or am I going to have to mess about > with adding extra frames for them? I'd love an applet to do these, but maybe we're trying to make OP into something its not, i.e. a Word processor. I'm certainly guilty of this. I like some time-saving features of word processors, but couldn't live without the flexibility of a DTP program. I've come to the conclusion that I couldn't write a footnotes applet personally, but maybe there are individuals who can. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 16:25:15 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58115 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:25:13 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888423483:05:13697:89; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:18:03 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id am0609007; 25 Feb 98 16:17 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ac1009706; 25 Feb 98 16:14 GMT From: Elliot Grosvenor Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 15:57:26 +0000 Organization: The Western Commercial Arts Co. Subject: Re: Knocking out grahics To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980225.155726.38@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 15:34:55 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c In message <19980224.091106.28@risc.demon.co.uk> you wrote: > However, OPro still doesn't knock out graphics. > As an example: a vector file, containing a lot of white, placed upon a > spotcoloured background, will loose its white and gain the spotcolour > instead in the eventual print. Your'e right! White isnt treated properly. It seems to be being treated as transparent and isnt knocked out of the background. Even if its made into a spot colour in OPro and in ArtWorks (a bit folly anyway as doing this causes other problems). If we're right this is a serious problem (and not immediately obvious until expensive film has been produced) and will also force me to use Impression for jobs where this occurs. I'm pleased I found out now. I have difficulty using spot colours that have been used in ArtWorks at all. I know I have to define the exact same colour with the same name in OPro but it doesn't seem to work. Have I forgoten something? -- Kevin Simpson BA(Hons) The Western Commercial Arts Co. http://www.wcartsco.demon.co.uk graphic design - typeface design - typography - illustration - printing To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 16:25:21 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58117 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:25:18 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888423483:15:20425:81; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:18:03 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0608818; 25 Feb 98 16:17 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ad1009706; 25 Feb 98 16:14 GMT From: David Pilling Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 15:56:22 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Help needed with macro To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980225.155622.80@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 98 01:37:31 GMT X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c From: "W,H, Stenfert Kroese" >Apologies if I've missed something. But having upgraded to .48 >OP only gives the error message: "Template Fields not found". The problem is that your new copy of OPro is accessing the resources of the old copy, templates in particular. OPro has a mechanism for remembering where it first got its resources from. (This is all in aid of those running from floppy discs). Anyway what you have to do, is open the new copy (shift+select double click), and then double click on the !OvnResDir icon inside. Or just reset the machine or powercycle it. From: "Peter Daniel" >Can anyone tell me if it is possible, and if so how, to write a macro >that will open the filer window from the directory in which the >current document is saved. The clue here is to look at the Document applet. Anyway this is what you do, define a macro { string s; int i; int j; fileinfo(currentfile(),s); for(i=slen(s)-1,j=0;i>0;i--,j++) { if(mids(s,i,1)==".") { s="Filer_OpenDir "+(s>>(j+1)); osclis(s); break; } } } There's a craftier way of doing this; { string s; fileinfo(currentfile(),s); s="Filer_OpenDir "+s+".^"; osclis(s); } But it leaves a messy filer window title. You can probably improve on these macros by checking if the file has ever been saved, using the return value from fileinfo(). David Pilling To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 16:25:26 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58119 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:25:25 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888423527:12:23270:79; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:18:47 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0604496; 25 Feb 98 16:18 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ah1007478; 25 Feb 98 16:08 GMT From: "Dr. P.N. Young" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 15:56:42 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Help needed with macro To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980225.155642.87@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 98 17:49:25 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Tue 24 Feb 98 (09:11:31 +0000), p.j.daniel@eee.salford.ac.uk wrote: >Can anyone tell me if it is possible, and if so how, to write a macro >that will open the filer window from the directory in which the >current document is saved. I have managed to do it with a specified >directory using OSCLIS but don't know how to get the path of the open >document. > >Thanks, >Peter. Don't need a macro; don't you just click shift-adjust on the close icon of the document? Best wishes, Another Peter. -- Peter \ / \ 112,Linden Ave., Prestbury, Cheltenham, Anne \ / __ __ \ Glos. GL52 3DS, England. Cecilia / / \ | | |\ | / _ \ +44 (0)1242-520459 James / \__/ \_/ | \| \__/ \_____________ pnyoung@argonet.co.uk. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 16:25:33 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58121 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:25:31 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888423567:05:14641:83; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:19:27 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0609106; 25 Feb 98 16:18 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id af1009706; 25 Feb 98 16:15 GMT From: "andy.ling@quantel.com" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 15:57:04 +0000 Organization: Quantel Ltd. Subject: Accessing the web via email (was Re: Central applet site (Was: To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980225.155704.28@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 09:32:22 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c >>>> Could all applets for Ovation Pro be made available for download at >>>> one web site? >> Why not just have links to authors own pages? > One reason is that there is one source of interesting looking Applets > (RJE Thompson's) that is only available during the working day so that > if, like me, you can only connect at night or weekends you can not get > them. >And if they're only on available on a web site they'll be inaccessible to >those who can use only email and news. Completely off topic I know, but I have recently been discussing this and you may find it useful. It is not strictly true that you cannot access the web if you only have mail access. There are a number of mail servers that you can send requests to for a particular web page/file. This will then be mailed back to you. The following describes how to find out more * Accessing The Internet By E-Mail Doctor Bob's Guide to Offline Internet Access 7th Edition - October 1997 available at demonstrates that everyone who can send and receive email has a form of web access. Finding the Latest Version -------------------------- This document is now available from several automated mail servers. To get the latest edition, send e-mail to one of the addresses below. To: mail-server@rtfm.mit.edu (for US, Canada & South America) Enter only this line in the BODY of the note: send usenet/news.answers/internet-services/access-via-email To: mailbase@mailbase.ac.uk (for Europe, Asia, etc.) Enter only this line in the BODY of the note: send lis-iis e-access-inet.txt You can also get the file by anonymous FTP at one of these sites: Site: rtfm.mit.edu get pub/usenet/news.answers/internet-services/access-via-email Site: ftp.mailbase.ac.uk get pub/lists/lis-iis/files/e-access-inet.txt Or on the Web in HTML format at: http://www.cis.ohio-state.edu/hypertext/faq/usenet/internet-services/\ access-via-email/faq.html Now back to matters OvPro Andy Ling To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 16:25:39 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58123 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:25:37 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888423633:12:24147:79; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:20:33 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ae0600979; 25 Feb 98 16:20 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ai1009706; 25 Feb 98 16:16 GMT From: David Pilling Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 15:54:58 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980225.155458.05@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 98 01:37:25 GMT X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c From:("A.F. Taylor") >The disaster is that OP forces the numlock on (the same as pressing the >afore-mentioned keys) whenever the caret is active in a frame, thus >rendering the keyboard quite useless Hmm. todays entry in the 'I never knew there was so much in it' stakes. I quoth... >Num Lock > >void keyboardmode(int mode); >#define KEYNUMLOCKKEY 0x1 - Num lock >#define KEYBREAKKEY 0x2 - Break generates codes >#define KEYAUTORATE 0x4 - !Auto repeat >#define KEYACTIONKEY 0x8 - Action key != Control key >#define KEYSCROLLLOCKKEY 0x10 - Scroll lock >Default - (KEYNUMLOCKKEY|KEYSCROLLLOCKKEY) So you stick a keyboardmode(0x10); In your !OvnPro.AutoRun.!Custom file, and it stops messing about with Numlock. From:(Alf Chamings) >Sounds like you just need to set and save the relevant text option in your >choices window from the icon bar. They seem fairly smart here, except they go >the wrong way round at the beginning of a truncated word, of course, eg '98 Don't confuse 'smart quotes' in choices which is to do with text file import with 'smart quotes' when you type which requires the presence of the smart quotes applet. From:(Roger Penniceard) >I am having some difficulty with the merge command. If I drag the >instruction from Impact sometimes it inserts the proper merge command but >often it just puts in the sort of instruction one would see in Impression. >It appears that to get the correct insertion I have to run OvationPro twice. There's the following fact. The !Custom file in OPro sets up OPro's text loading based on the presence of a system variable which is set by the TransDDF !Boot file. (we hope you modified !Boot as well as !Run). Anyway this means that TransDDF must be booted *before* you run OPro. I don't think sticking it in the applets directory will fulfil that requirement. >Having got the correct commands in, the merge is correct first time, but >if I clear and then remerge I get extraneous letters appearing at the end >of each command. Hmm. I wonder if that's a common problem? I didn't notice it when I was testing. From:(Colin Thompson) >Is it possible to alter the abbreviation applet? >But if you put and apostrophe after it it doesn't. I'd like to be able to >able to type something like "pe" to expand to "Peter" (which is fine) but >sometimes type "pe'" to expand to "Peter'" to which I then add "s" (or "d") Yep, find this bit in the !Abbrev.Library.Abbrev file; // check if key is 'space', 'new para', 'tab', 'new line', 'new page','full stop' or 'comma' if (key == ' ' || key == 13 || key == 394 || key == 2061 || key == 6669 || key == '.' || key == ',') { And add your own clause on to the chain of || (== or)'s - i.e. || key=='\'' From: Norman Thomas >We have corresponded in recent days about the item Applets> that went >missing from the end of my main OvPro menu, so making it impossible to get >at the Applets menu. >I have now found that I can repeat and correct the condition. >I have, in my OvPro/upgrade material a directory called Extras.Scripts. It >contains Calculator, FancyDate, Fraction, JoinLines, Unique. They are not >!Applet files. The Readme in the directory tells me that 'the example >scripts in this directory should be copied into !OvnPro.Library and then >Ovation Pro re-run. A new menu called Script will appear at the bottom of >the main menu giving access...' >I have not tried every one of the 'scripts', just Calculator and Fancy Date. >If either is put into .Library, then the Applet> item goes missing. There is >no additional item such as Script>. >I presume that these are old and discontinued predecessors of Applets. Yes those are 'applet scripts' from an ancient version of OPro. They've all been superseded by new improved versions. In technical terms we changed the way applets add themselves to the main menu. Anyone else who has lost their applet menu please take note... David Pilling To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Feb 25 16:25:44 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58125 for opro ; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:25:42 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888423639:12:24166:79; Wed, 25 Feb 98 16:20:39 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0609177; 25 Feb 98 16:20 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ae1009706; 25 Feb 98 16:15 GMT From: David Pilling Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 15:55:40 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980225.155540.47@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 98 01:37:28 GMT X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c From: Dave Hawkins >Is there an automated way to create numbered/lettered/bullet point lists? >Or do I have to go through the rigamarole of setting up hanging indents >and then manually entering the numbers/letters/bullets? >Again can this be done automatically or am I going to have to mess about >with adding extra frames for them? Sorry, but for now, you'll have to do it the hard way. As I've commented before the program does have a load of bullet/para numbering stuff in it now, but it is not enabled and will change before it is officially supported. Footnotes are a good one. I'd like to do those, but rather nasty when (unlike word processors) you don't have a constant flow width. From: Frank Lester >I seem to remember in one of the original versions of OVPro enquiring >about the function "/n" for new lines in CSV files from some data bases >e.g. Datapower. I think this was corrected then, however it seem to have >returned in the latest version. My total recollection is that Mr. Singleton asked about this just before Christmas, and I fixed it. So it will appear in 2.49. From:(private mail) >I also find I can't select, or apply effects to, text which has flowed out of >a frame. I need to be able to select everything after a chosen point in the >text and reduce its size, font or leading etc. There a several work-arounds >but they are very tedious when compared with the ability to select everything >and simply apply a smaller type size. >I'm dearly hoping you're going to say "RTFM. To select all the text after a >chosen point simply...", here, 'cos this is one of those small seemingly >insignificant things that are INCREDIBLY irritating. I had thought that 'select all' probably didn't select to the end of the story. But it does, and you're not saying that it doesn't. Because to use that you'd have to 'select all' and then unselect to the caret. So I can see what you mean, but then I thought, well what DTP programs do have a select to the end feature? Does Impression? Anyway, this is a solution. Define a key macro and for the body have this; {int b;b=bmcreate(\"k1\");setbmtocaret(b);bmmove(b,1,4);setzonetobm(b);bmdelete(b);} That will give you a key press which selects to the end of the current story. David Pilling To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Feb 26 13:53:29 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58173 for opro ; Thu, 26 Feb 98 13:53:28 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888483793:12:02258:80; Thu, 26 Feb 98 09:03:13 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0611497; 26 Feb 98 9:02 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ac1028451; 26 Feb 98 9:00 GMT From: Rob Hemmings Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 08:55:07 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Colour matching To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980226.085507.04@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 98 (19:05:29 +0000) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Mon 23 Feb 98 (11:58:47 +0000), djscott@argonet.co.uk wrote: >I have a simple approach to colour matching which may be of interest. I >have produced an Ovation file which consists of two A4 pages of colour >samples. These consist of small areas of solid colour each about 20x5mm >in size covering all the combinations of Cyan, Magenta and Yellow from >0 to 100% in 20% steps, a total of 216 samples. This sounds like a good idea - any chance of a copy to save the effort of recreating it? Perhaps Beebug should put it on the OvationPro web site? -- ------------------------------------------------------------- Rob Hemmings Southport Tel: +44 (0)1704 573210 robh@argonet.co.uk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Feb 26 13:53:36 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58176 for opro ; Thu, 26 Feb 98 13:53:34 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888483799:05:04810:90; Thu, 26 Feb 98 09:03:19 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0611834; 26 Feb 98 9:03 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id af1028451; 26 Feb 98 9:01 GMT From: Keith Hopper Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 08:55:26 +0000 Organization: Subject: Postscript printing with Ovation To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980226.085526.22@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 15:41:43 +1300 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On 24 Feb, Alan Muscat wrote: > Are there any Acorn users out there who fairly regularly generate > colour postscript files, from single pages to multi-page documents, > for professional quality printing?(using Ovation Pro of course) > What is your success rate? Is it fairly safe? I know that I can send > files to TJ Repro and have Tony create postscript files which are > then sent to the imagesetter, or I could use Alternative Publishing > who convert to postscript but have film and print done externally. I do this sort of thing very regularly and, barring initial trauma on the part of the imagesetter people about 'What's an Acorn?' have only had difficulties caused by their error - like the brand new imagesetter which wasn't able (because of software problem) to handle files with the width of the film (like 450mm film and 330 mm max width for a file. All I have had to do was ask which way they wanted the postscript and which level they could handle and then produce megabytes of file for them. I have found that all of the people round here use postscript version 2 except one and one even claims to accept postscript 3!!!!!!! kh To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Feb 26 13:53:45 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58179 for opro ; Thu, 26 Feb 98 13:53:42 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888483877:05:05253:82; Thu, 26 Feb 98 09:04:37 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0612411; 26 Feb 98 9:04 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ah1028451; 26 Feb 98 9:01 GMT From: David Pilling Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 08:55:45 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980226.085545.95@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 98 03:13:35 GMT X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c From: Mr G Dance >> I'd like to propose compiling a web site of any professionals working >> with acorn software - we all know the stories of us occasional users Good idea, and I'd be happy to put any such list on the web site. I did propose this once before, but I only got one reply. From: Richard Torrens >American paper sizes are different: their size near A4 is 279 x 216mm (A4 is >297 x 210 >So if I aim for a 279 x 210mm, I will be able to print on A4 or American size. >But this doesn't work for a pamphlet... I get a shorter screen and it prints >out with the pamphlet dimension of 210 reduced. Not the page length reduced! So >I need to alter the scaling factor - or do I? Should not page size >automatically alter the scaling factor? Probably the key observation is that when you set pamphlet mode, the program works out the necessary scaling, it does this on the usual 'A' size paper idea of 2 x A5 == A4. That won't apply to other paper formats. But you can read the scale being used from the extended print window, click 'fit' off and then adjust the scale manually to what is needed. From: Paul Sprangers >However, OPro still doesn't knock out graphics. >As an example: a vector file, containing a lot of white, placed upon a >spotcoloured background, will loose its white and gain the spotcolour >instead in the eventual print. >Is there any chance that this will change in the near future? To be honest, the only problem here is working out if the correct way of doing things is the way it works now, or the way you're proposing. If it *is* wrong then I will certainly fix it now. At the same time I've got an idea for handling Draw files, there's been a lot of trouble regarding using Draw files for spots. My idea is that if you define a colour in OPro called DXRRGGBB where RR is a Draw RGB value 0..255 then when the Draw file is printed, any colour with exactly those amounts of RGB will map to the OPro colour. So that gets you spots and so on from Draw files. From: Elliot Grosvenor >> However, OPro still doesn't knock out graphics. >Your'e right! White isn't treated properly. It seems to be being treated as >transparent and isn't knocked out of the background. Even if its made into a >spot colour in OPro and in ArtWorks (a bit folly anyway as doing this As it stands Draw files are totally transparent on spot plates. >I have difficulty using spot colours that have been used in ArtWorks at all. >I know I have to define the exact same colour with the same name in OPro but >it doesn't seem to work. Have I forgotten something? Tick 'use spots' on the image processing window? From: Matthew Gotts >So, can I somehow do the thing of printing first the colours, then the >black. Of course, I can print out in full colour using the colour print >head, but black is just a dark brown, so not great. First idea is to use the image processing facilities on the picture. If you're using Turbo drivers then you might be able to produce 'curves' which allow you to print with no black output. Of course ideally one would like control over the RGB output from OPro. From: Alan Muscat >What I don't understand is why leading is not in the modify text dialogue, >it seems such a logical place to include it. I need easy access to leading >alteration. David P could you re-post the short cut you said you had given out. Because leading is a paragraph attribute. So it lives with all the other things which apply to whole paragraphs in the 'format' window. This is a bit debatable because you could say these things apply at the line level rather than paragraphs. As it stands the only foolproof way of applying them to single lines is as styles with a scope of 'selection' rather than effects. Someone reposted the leading tip last week. From: Kevin Pearcey >Could I please have somebody explain why they thought that all these >writable menu entries and fixed size scrolling lists were a good >thing to copy from windows? If I told you the person who did the design is now working on PC's in Milton Keynes would that explain everything? When 2.46 came out, a lot of the windows had added toggle buttons e.g. macros, which expand the dinky windows to full screen size. Other than that its fair comment, major changes to the interface are unlikely for a long time to come. From: Jeff Wright >After further investigation, it appears that if some pages have been created >and the master page of these pages is then edited and then closed it can, on >occasions, take a while for OvPro to sort itself out. So although it appears >to crash it in fact does not. Perhaps Mr Pilling could make a comment on >this problem. As I said a week or so back, I believe the problem is a bug, and I've fixed it. From: Rob Hemmings >Has anyone else noticed that when you switch on the highlighting of spelling >errors a word including a drop capital is not treated correctly. E.g. Lots is >shown as a spelling error if the L is a drop capital. Hmm. It also erroneously flags words which split over lines. From: Stephen Brown >when I try to center the diagram I get the following fatal error: >The Artworks file in question does not use any facility not available in >Artworks as sold by CC and is only 131K in size. Maybe the dimensions of the file. Maybe something which appears in view when it is centred. Etc. Etc. ========= Finally, my apologies for the multiple postings of my replies. As you may gather from the bumper number of postings yesterday, we have been having problems with our ISP. I also spammed you with a slight bug. In, {int b;b=bmcreate(\"k1\");setbmtocaret(b);bmmove(b,1,4);setzonetobm(b);bmdelete(b);} The \" 's should just be plain double quotes. No C style escape. Unless you're going to patch it direct into your !Macros file, which is by far the quickest way... David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Feb 26 13:53:51 1998 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA58181 for opro ; Thu, 26 Feb 98 13:53:49 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 888483987:12:03398:79; Thu, 26 Feb 98 09:06:27 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ac0612547; 26 Feb 98 9:06 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ag1028451; 26 Feb 98 9:01 GMT From: Nick Kaijaks Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 08:54:45 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Index of OP professionals To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19980226.085445.72@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 16:21:10 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Thu, 19 Feb 1998, you wrote: > I'd like to propose compiling a web site of any professionals working with > acorn software - we all know the stories of us occaional users trying to [stuff deleted] > What do others think? Would such a site fiind favour with users and > providers? Any limitations (I'd be reluctant to include 'web designers' > without some method of sifting the experieced pro from the likes of > myself! though a graphic design co that also works on web publishing would > be no problem) - its an issue of credentials. Well, as a 'provider' in the sense you describe, it would seem like a good idea - its free advertising, after all ;-) I think you're right that 'credentials' or 'professionalism' is a more difficult problem. My instinct is that the best form of credentials are client references and portfolio. Nothing else will tell you what a designer can do. One question I see is how you would categorise designers. Once you have a significant number, do you categorise by speciality? location? experience? design style? software used? Do you give, say, space for 150 words to each designer? Would they have space to show off some portfolio, or just names and addresses? I guess that's my 2p anyway. I hope you do go ahead, and produce what I'd think would be a very useful resource to the Acorn community (as a community it definitely is). I'd be interested to hear how my comments/ questions fit in with your thoughts and other feedback you've had so far. Cheers, Nick -- nick kaijaks >> proprietor >> pinxit design >> putting the solution together the budget sensitive graphic design consultancy for internet and print media http://www.warwick.ac.uk/Nick.Kaijaks/ mailto:Nick.Kaijaks@warwick.ac.uk Disclaimer: caveat internettor To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l