From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Dec 1 18:46:11 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA51870 for opro ; Mon, 01 Dec 97 18:46:09 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 880967794:12:12671:32; Mon, 01 Dec 97 09:16:34 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0600252; 1 Dec 97 9:15 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ac1009161; 1 Dec 97 9:14 GMT From: michael turner Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 01 Dec 1997 09:10:30 +0000 Organization: Subject: OvPro supporters club To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971201.091030.70@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 28 Nov 1997 17:39:03 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Sounds good to me - count me in when it happens. Mike. -- Michael Turner To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Dec 1 18:46:16 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA51872 for opro ; Mon, 01 Dec 97 18:46:14 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 880967796:05:25495:81; Mon, 01 Dec 97 09:16:36 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0600430; 1 Dec 97 9:15 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ae1009161; 1 Dec 97 9:15 GMT From: michael turner Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 01 Dec 1997 09:10:11 +0000 Organization: Subject: OvPro supporters club To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971201.091011.08@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 28 Nov 1997 17:43:14 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c It sounds like a good idea to me at about =A320 per annum. So long as I was assured that work was ongoing then updates need not be regular - but please lets have them via the net if possible, its so much more civilised! Mike. --=20 Michael Turner To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Dec 1 18:46:25 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA51875 for opro ; Mon, 01 Dec 97 18:46:22 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 880967802:05:25553:77; Mon, 01 Dec 97 09:16:42 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0600879; 1 Dec 97 9:16 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ah1009161; 1 Dec 97 9:15 GMT From: Dr A G Gray Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 01 Dec 1997 09:11:11 +0000 Organization: Subject: Auto-hyphenation To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971201.091111.39@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Sat, 29 Nov 97 17:11:56 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Have I missed something, or is there a problem with hyphenation of words at the end of a line when there is a forward slash / in a 'compound' word. Try as a might, I cannot get orchestral/instrumental or such like to split at the end of a line. Any comments? -- Alan.Gray@argonet.co.uk Dr A.G.Gray. Great Warley, Essex. UK http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/alan.gray N 51 33'58" E 00 17'35" G3XQU (DXCC=323/328) Acorn RiscPC S/A 202MHz To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Dec 1 18:46:30 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA51877 for opro ; Mon, 01 Dec 97 18:46:29 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 880967862:05:26046:24; Mon, 01 Dec 97 09:17:42 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0601181; 1 Dec 97 9:16 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ai1009161; 1 Dec 97 9:16 GMT From: Hank van der Wijngaart Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 01 Dec 1997 09:11:31 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Supporters Group To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971201.091131.75@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Sun, 30 Nov 1997 14:13:31 +1000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c At 09:40 28/11/97 +0000, you wrote: > This would get my support. > > My support too...... dont want to loose a good thing... wow i been > using Ovation since its first release... Likewise Regards, Hank ================================================================ Using a RiscPC! Powered by a 200MHz StongARM processor. A fast and powerful 32 bit RISC machine. and now running Win95 with Office 97 inside the RiscOS desktop! ================================================================ To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Dec 1 18:46:37 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA51879 for opro ; Mon, 01 Dec 97 18:46:34 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 880967876:12:13146:81; Mon, 01 Dec 97 09:17:56 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ae0601623; 1 Dec 97 9:17 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aq1009161; 1 Dec 97 9:17 GMT From: Impe Antonius Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 01 Dec 1997 09:12:14 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Future releases To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971201.091214.50@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Sat, 29 Nov 1997 02:47:26 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Mon 24 Nov, Rob Hemmings wrote: > I've been thinking, following the various comments made in this mailing list > about version 2.47 and beyond. It would be a great shame if future sales were > not sufficient to allow Beebug/David Pilling to keep developing OvationPro and > it ended up like Impression. I'm sure all subscribers to this mailing list > would agree! > > However, to keep development going it must be funded from somewhere. The size > of the Acorn market may mean that new sales will not be enough. > > What about introducing a kind of "supporters club" with an annual fee set at a > realistic level. (I would imagine the 5ukp fee per upgrade suggested by Ian > recently would barely cover the admin. costs of the upgrade let alone any > development work.) This fee would need to be sufficient to guarantee Beebug > enough money to continue to fund development. In return the "supporters" would > receive updates at regular intervals (perhaps 3-4 times per year?). Perhaps as > a further carrot the supporters would be allowed to vote on the priority of the > various items on the "wish list". Indeed a reasonable idea, but for some people a bit more costly then for others. I've been working with Acorn machines since they came onto the market. With the old A310 in the time that AT (Ancient Technolog Because I live in Belgium upgrades and magazine subscriptions are more expensive then in England. Now we could get our upgrades system could be devised whereby we could only get the upgrade if we are recognised as a subscriber via the internet. Surely it access to the upgrade directory if you are recognised by the server. So If you pay your upgrade fee or are a subscriber, anywhere in the world it would cost you the same. ____ / __ \_________ _________ / /_/ / ___/ __ \/ ___/ __ \ / __ / /__/ /_/ / / / / / / /_/ /_/\___/\____/_/ /_/ /_/ computers are the best check out [ http:/www.acorn.com ] To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Dec 1 18:46:41 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA51881 for opro ; Mon, 01 Dec 97 18:46:40 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 880967888:05:26167:78; Mon, 01 Dec 97 09:18:08 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0601537; 1 Dec 97 9:17 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ak1009161; 1 Dec 97 9:16 GMT From: allan harris Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 01 Dec 1997 09:10:52 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: funding of upgrades To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971201.091052.33@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Sat, 29 Nov 1997 11:53:02 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c > I would be quite happy to accept that releases might not arrive at precise > intervals. So long as we were assured that the work was going on I would be > prepared to trust that releases would be made available as soon as sensible. I > think the trust factor is one major plus of the Acorn world and I'm prepared to > put my money where my trust is! > > -- > ------------------------------------------------------------- > Rob Hemmings Southport > I think that the idea of a subscription for upgrades would be entirely reasonable and the suggested 20 sounds very reasonable. Z-Line the Fireworkz support group now do a 35 Gold CD which you send back for upgrades; gives you the newsletters and lots of other stuff. -- Allan Harris, GP, Haxby, York YO3 3PH tel 01904-768666 work 01904-760125, fax 750168 To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Dec 1 18:46:48 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA51883 for opro ; Mon, 01 Dec 97 18:46:46 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 880967942:12:13559:79; Mon, 01 Dec 97 09:19:02 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0601941; 1 Dec 97 9:18 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ao1009161; 1 Dec 97 9:17 GMT From: "\"James White (Acorns in Spain" MMDF-Warning: Parse error in original version of preceding line at post.mail.demon.net Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 01 Dec 1997 09:11:52 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: OvPro supporters club... To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971201.091152.38@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Sun, 30 Nov 1997 11:29:17 +0100 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Fri 28 Nov, Colin Thompson wrote: > While the supporters club sounds like a great idea, I don't think it's > very practical. I think it has potential problems. > > You pay 20 pounds for a year and in the first year that could mean you've > got a hell of a lot for your money, so much so that David has been working > for tuppence an hour. > > You pay 20 pounds for the second year and you only get one minor upgrade. > People will start complaining (quickly forgetting what they got the year > before) and dropping out. > As I see it OP was first introduced in direct opposition to IP, after years of development. In order to encourage a ready take-up after so much effort had been put in, a price/marketing strategy was adopted, aimed at ensuring a steady income flow and to encourage converts from IP (and Ovation) to what was a largely unknown product. The push-start offer of a low initial price plus the carrot of free upgrades, set in a time frame and clearly laid out as a contract, rewarded the patient among us, both for the long wait in arrival of the product and for putting up with the inevitable early bugs. We have to remember that this strategy relies on a rising price that is set to start immediately after the introductory period. It is meant to cover early development costs as well as fund further development. (The success of the strategy so far is to be seen in the ready willingness of all to pay more in the form of a support club). However, it may be well to consider whether a support club is sufficient guarantee of future funding to take OP up to and beyond the level of Quark, which it is now within striking distance to do so. We have had amazing value with the final free upgrade bringing Separations and Imposition, which definitively stakes OP ahead of IP Plus. The next developments are likely to take OP to a truly professional level, such as Colour Printing, which will cost. > The fairest system to me seems to put minor fixes etc, free on a website > with the applets and charge a fair price for any major improvements and > upgrades. I also think it would be daft to try and put a fixed price on > that as the amount of work involved could vary immensely depending on the > upgrade. Exactly. I also think that maintaining the web site consumes enough time without having to maintain a support line. Clubs require good evangelical souls who unstintingly dedicate their time, leaving little for debugging. I would really like to see DP moving on to the Next Blockbuster, such as an ArtWorks replacement, an NC Offensive, or the Internet Fax Box. JW -- ------------------------------------------- Sibelius en Spain: Mailto:jacorn@ibm.net En Andalucia: Mailto:pmoya@valnet.es Visita a http://www.argonet.co.uk/opus/spain En Castellano! ------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Dec 1 18:46:57 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA51885 for opro ; Mon, 01 Dec 97 18:46:52 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 880967975:06:02726:24; Mon, 01 Dec 97 09:19:35 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0602263; 1 Dec 97 9:19 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id as1009161; 1 Dec 97 9:18 GMT From: Ariancylch Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 01 Dec 1997 09:09:48 +0000 Organization: Lylmik Supervisory body Subject: Re: OvPro supporters club... To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971201.090948.14@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Sat, 29 Nov 1997 00:35:51 +1200 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c In message <19971127.094104.69@risc.demon.co.uk> Andrew Piper wrote: > On Wed 26 Nov 97 (09:24:13 +0000), rhemmings@argonet.co.uk wrote: > > On Tue 25 Nov 97 (09:02:17 +0000), David Pilling wrote: > > > One of my suggestions to Beebug was something like 20 pounds for a > > > subscription, that would get you say 2 upgrades a year, plus > > > whatever bits and bobs are available. It would also include some > > > major new addons, like the fill applet. > > > > > > The problem is of course that offering such a package commits us > > > to providing it. Typically in the software world things don't work > > > out so neatly. So the upgrades and new features may not always pop > > > up every six months. > > > > I would be quite happy to accept that releases might not arrive at > > precise intervals. So long as we were assured that the work was > > going on I would be prepared to trust that releases would be made > > available as soon as sensible. I think the trust factor is one > > major plus of the Acorn world and I'm prepared to put my money where > > my trust is! I'd echo that, and I know that any such scheme would be swiftly joined by work. (Who seem to be actively considering a site licence for OvPro, finally, so we can have it running on more than the one (?) machine we currently do) > Yes Rob, so would I, but you can bet your bottom dollar that someone, > somewhere, would raise a complaint. And that's the problem here! I > think we've been lucky with the releases so far, and the continuing > work. But at some point development *will* slow down, for whatever > reason, and then such a scheme would run into trouble. Tough for them. I've met various software 'support' schemes (that are -far- more expensive than is being proposed here) that claim no more than a fixed period that the support is for, and that any (and all) upgrades made available during that period will be sent for free. In theory it would be possible to have several levels of 'Clan Ovation Pro': Everyone (free) * OvPro Mailing list * Applet www site COP 1 (5 gold per year) * Bug fixes/patches available via web * Bug fixes/patches sent out on disk via post for those that require it, at most once every four months, less if no patches made. (Include updated applets from www site?) COP 2 (10 gold per year) - COP 1, and * Minor upgrades included with patches on www and disk * Disk mailout at three months, or on request COP 3 (20 gold per year) - COP 2, and * Major upgrades included * Disk mailouts as available Where those that can use the web do, and those that can't have the option of obtaining the changes on disk. What a 'gold' translates to in Real Money is another issue, as is whether or not multiple levels are practical and/or useful. The administration involved in maintaining the various groups might well far outweigh the benefits. In Reality it'd be likely that COP 2 and COP 3 are merged to form the 'advanced support' package which made 'new' features available. I think the key point is that an exact 'schedule of upgrades' is unecessary, -provided- people are convinced they are getting something worthwhile out of it. Naturally you can't please everyone, but if we went 18, 12, or even 9 months without seeing -anything-, I think people would rightfully complain. On the otherhand, if, during that time, bugs were fixed (and lets face it, as far as we can see, we report them, they get fixed) and the patches distributed, the general populace would be Very Happy. Notes people (on this list) considering these need to keep in mind: - Don't forget the people -without- 'net access. They do exist. - Don't forget the people -with- 'net access. - Be practical. Free upgrades are cool. 1200ukp upgrades are cool. It all depends on who you are. - To a certain extent we're the converted: What would entice 'new' people to OvPro... J, who'll shut up now. It's OvPro related, but the discussion is slightly getting out of hand in terms of filling up the list, I think... -- I won't use words again May god stand between you they don't mean what I meant and harm in all the empty they don't say what I said places where you must walk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Dec 2 13:44:08 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA51988 for opro ; Tue, 02 Dec 97 13:44:06 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881055887:12:05483:77; Tue, 02 Dec 97 09:44:47 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0608285; 2 Dec 97 9:44 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ad1006766; 2 Dec 97 9:43 GMT From: Colin Thompson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 02 Dec 1997 09:17:33 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: OvPro supporters club... To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971202.091733.91@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 01 Dec 1997 21:00:54 +0100 (BST) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c \James White (Acorns in Spain wrote: > I would really like to see DP moving on to the Next Blockbuster, such as > an ArtWorks replacement, an NC Offensive, or the Internet Fax Box. Absolutely, and maybe in a quick ten minutes before he does that he could please knock up a scanner to printer pseudo photocopier (like laserdirect had I believe), please. -- Colin Thompson Mail to - colinet@atlantis.aust.com Web site - http://www.atlantis.aust.com/~colinet To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Dec 2 13:44:13 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA51991 for opro ; Tue, 02 Dec 97 13:44:12 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881055907:12:05606:25; Tue, 02 Dec 97 09:45:07 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0608596; 2 Dec 97 9:44 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ae1006766; 2 Dec 97 9:44 GMT From: Allan Woods Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 02 Dec 1997 09:17:55 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Ungroup Command To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971202.091755.43@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Sun, 30 Nov 1997 00:03:59 +0100 (BST) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Mon 17 Nov, Roger King wrote: > Has anyone noticed that the key shortcut "Ungroup" > command from the Object menu does not function? > > Has this been fixed in version 2.47? > I am just a new user after years with Impression and have to say that I find a number of the menu shortcuts are different than -- Allan Woods, Greenock To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Dec 2 13:44:18 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA51993 for opro ; Tue, 02 Dec 97 13:44:16 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881055918:12:05595:78; Tue, 02 Dec 97 09:45:18 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0608847; 2 Dec 97 9:44 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ah1006766; 2 Dec 97 9:44 GMT From: Ariancylch Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 02 Dec 1997 09:16:50 +0000 Organization: Lylmik Supervisory body Subject: Re: OvPro supporters club... To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971202.091650.97@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 01 Dec 1997 22:59:55 +1200 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c In message <19971201.091152.38@risc.demon.co.uk> "\"James White (Acorns in Spain" wrote: > Exactly. I also think that maintaining the web site consumes enough > time without having to maintain a support line. Clubs require good > evangelical souls who unstintingly dedicate their time, leaving little > for debugging. There's actually no reason that most of the web site maintenance (in the 'OvPro Supporters Club' line) can't be delegated to a (trusted) club member. Indeed, if people were as keen as they seem to be to keep things moving in the actual development line, taking most of the work out of the support would already be useful. For example, is there a summary, somewhere, of the hints and tips that appear in this list? A Frequently Solved Problems, or Frequently Used Work-arounds. (I should know this, but I've been putting my computer back together over the last week or so ) -- I won't use words again May god stand between you they don't mean what I meant and harm in all the empty they don't say what I said places where you must walk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Dec 2 13:44:23 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA51995 for opro ; Tue, 02 Dec 97 13:44:21 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881055986:05:28648:79; Tue, 02 Dec 97 09:46:26 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0609435; 2 Dec 97 9:46 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aj1006766; 2 Dec 97 9:45 GMT From: "Howe , Chris" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 02 Dec 1997 09:17:13 +0000 Organization: Subject: RE: Future releases To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971202.091713.48@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: 1 Dec 97 12:22:00 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I feel very positive about Beebug, to the extent I should *want* to pay a reasonable amount for successive OvP releases. If the manual is re-printed I should want to buy the update. Perhaps any premium updates could bundle more specialist weights of the EFF fonts? (Regrettably I had to complain to Archive about the Alsystems Parallel Zip Driver S/W I bought from them. I too felt one of Alsystem's products was not of merchantable quality, certainly in all the desktop citizenry areas such as documentation, help, and little niggly errors. It does work but the impression is of a rushed product. I am helping write a comparative review of this, vs Argo's Driver (which has less 'features' but is much better presented).) Even though Ovation Pro is not perfect, you can almost 'see' why any imperfections have arisen, often due to complex tertiary interactions, and it is enjoyable participating with them in getting it better. Keith Parker wrote: > Well, I paid ukp23.50 for technical support from Alystems with one > upgrade, so I guess that a 'membership' fee of, at least, ukp20 plus VAT > for one (or more) upgrades per year would be fine! So did I and all I got was bug fixes in faulty software. In Alsystems case I think the whole thing was a dreadful ripoff. We all bought their SCSI card (which I must admit has given me no trouble at all) and then paid them to do the work they should have done before they released it to bring it up to 'merchantable quality'. Colin Thompson To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Dec 2 13:44:29 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA51997 for opro ; Tue, 02 Dec 97 13:44:27 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881055997:12:06149:80; Tue, 02 Dec 97 09:46:37 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0609423; 2 Dec 97 9:46 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ak1006766; 2 Dec 97 9:45 GMT From: David Pilling Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 02 Dec 1997 09:18:16 +0000 Organization: Subject: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971202.091816.26@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 02 Dec 97 01:47:17 GMT X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c From: Dr A G Gray >Have I missed something, or is there a problem with hyphenation of words at the >end of a line when there is a forward slash / in a 'compound' word. >Try as a might, I cannot get orchestral/instrumental or such like to split at >the end of a line. >Any comments? I think this is a good idea. At the moment the only things it splits on are spaces and '-' hard hyphens. I've often found /'s difficult to format. The question is would this change upset anyone? And are there any other characters which should be split on? From: James White (Acorns in Spain) >I would really like to see DP moving on to the Next Blockbuster, such as >an ArtWorks replacement, an NC Offensive, or the Internet Fax Box. I think I was a consultant on the last one - Netfax? To some extent this is the trouble with the Acorn world, I could easily spend another 5 years tinkering with OPro, and it would then be a very nice program indeed. But who'd like to predict where (if) the Acorn world will be in 5 years time. You'd not expect the Quark programmers to be knocking out scanner drivers as their main occupation... We never perfect anything, the pressure is always to move on to something new. News ---- I just wrought a new applet - Fog. One of those text readability things. Not that good, it's on the web pages... David Pilling To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Dec 3 14:41:29 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52129 for opro ; Wed, 03 Dec 97 14:41:25 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881139993:12:04183:77; Wed, 03 Dec 97 09:06:33 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0603968; 3 Dec 97 9:06 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ad2011125; 3 Dec 97 9:05 GMT From: Carl Cepurneek Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 03 Dec 1997 09:02:52 +0000 Organization: Subject: Hyphanation at / etc To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971203.090252.62@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 3 Dec 1997 08:56:57 +0930 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Hyphenation discussion continues: >>end of a line when there is a forward slash / in a 'compound' word. .... >The question is would this change upset anyone? And are >there any other characters which should be split on? I sometimes use the slash for inline fractions (cycles/second) which I'd not like split, but then they generally appear indented on their own line. What about URLs? To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Dec 3 14:41:35 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52134 for opro ; Wed, 03 Dec 97 14:41:33 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881140019:12:04357:77; Wed, 03 Dec 97 09:06:59 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0603968; 3 Dec 97 9:06 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ag2011125; 3 Dec 97 9:06 GMT From: Peter Bell Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 03 Dec 1997 09:02:07 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971203.090207.26@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 02 Dec 1997 10:26:25 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Tue 02 Dec, David Pilling wrote: > From: Dr A G Gray > > >Have I missed something, or is there a problem with hyphenation of words at the > >end of a line when there is a forward slash / in a 'compound' word. > >Try as a might, I cannot get orchestral/instrumental or such like to split at > >the end of a line. > >Any comments? > > I think this is a good idea. At the moment the only things it > splits on are spaces and '-' hard hyphens. I've often found /'s difficult to format. > > The question is would this change upset anyone? Yes! One of the gripes that I have always had with Impression is the way it splits a line on a forward slash, and there is no obvious way of preventing it. Terms such as TCP/IP and OS/2 must not be split. I have often wasted time trying to reword some text in such a way that such a term does not occur at the end of a line. Would it be possible to ensure that a line is only split after a forward slash when there are more than a certain number of characters following (5?)? -- ------------------------------------------------------------------- Peter Bell - peter@foursqre.demon.co.uk - FourSquare Computing Ltd 5 Drome Path, Winnersh, Wokingham, Berkshire RG41 5HB, UK. Tel. +44 (0) 118 989 0982 Fax. +44 (0) 118 979 4639 To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Dec 3 14:41:41 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52136 for opro ; Wed, 03 Dec 97 14:41:41 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881140029:05:24027:24; Wed, 03 Dec 97 09:07:09 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0604590; 3 Dec 97 9:06 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ae2011125; 3 Dec 97 9:05 GMT From: David Pilling Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 03 Dec 1997 09:03:12 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971203.090312.72@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 03 Dec 97 02:57:06 GMT X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c From:(D.A.Symes) (private email) >Just down loaded the Fog applet and given it a run.... >I assume it's a joke of course. :-) I can see you'll be mimsying among the borrowgroves next. >From:(Carl Cepurneek) (private email) >"See Dave run." is declared to be 'College graduate ' level. Perhaps the >UK education system is different to here? :-) I knew there was something wrong. It's a bug now fixed - 1.01 on the web. David Pilling To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Dec 3 14:41:46 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52138 for opro ; Wed, 03 Dec 97 14:41:45 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881140065:05:24206:79; Wed, 03 Dec 97 09:07:45 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0604590; 3 Dec 97 9:07 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ai2011125; 3 Dec 97 9:07 GMT From: Nick Kaijaks Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 03 Dec 1997 09:02:30 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Auto-hyphenation To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971203.090230.88@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 02 Dec 1997 14:00:48 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c David Pilling wrote: > > From: Dr A G Gray > >Have I missed something, or is there a problem with hyphenation of > I think this is a good idea. At the moment the only things it > splits on are spaces and '-' hard hyphens. I've often found /'s > ^^^^ I thought hard hyphens were non-breaking? Do you mean normal and soft/optional hyphens? > difficult to format. > > The question is would this change upset anyone? And are > there any other characters which should be split on? I can imagine it could cause trouble. For example, you might want to split "orchestral/instrumental", but not necessarily "5/8 inch". OK, so I ought to use a solidus instead of a forward slash, but there must be other such cases. If you want to add other characters, you've got to have some means of excepting them (equivalent to non-breaking hyphens). Perhaps "orchestral/instrumental" and the like could be defined as a hyphentation exception, or the 'splitting' characters could be put somewhere user-definable eg. a file or macro? TTFN, Nick -- nick kaijaks; proprietor, pinxit design - putting the solution together and; research student, physics, university of warwick, coventry cv4 7al http://www.warwick.ac.uk/Nick.Kaijaks/ mailto:Nick.Kaijaks@warwick.ac.uk Disclaimer: caveat internettor To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Dec 4 14:01:52 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52220 for opro ; Thu, 04 Dec 97 14:01:50 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881226473:12:10788:77; Thu, 04 Dec 97 09:07:53 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0628049; 4 Dec 97 9:07 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ad2010686; 4 Dec 97 9:04 GMT From: Kelvin Randall Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 04 Dec 1997 09:01:59 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971204.090200.00@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 3 Dec 97 13:42:02 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Wed 3 Dec 97 (09:03:12 +0000), david@pilling.demon.co.uk wrote: > From:(D.A.Symes) (private email) > >Just down loaded the Fog applet and given it a run.... > >I assume it's a joke of course. :-) > > I can see you'll be mimsying among the borrowgroves next. > I've also just loaded the Fog applet and now every time I open a new OP document I get a message from OvPro box with no message in it. Is it me or is it Fog that's mimsying? Kelvin -- __ __ __ _ ___ __ ____ / //_/__ / / __(_)__ / _ \___ ____ ___/ /__ _/ / / / ,< / -_) / |/ / / _ \ / _, / _ `/ _ \/ _ / _ `/ / / /_/|_|\__/_/|___/_/_//_/ /_/ |_\_,_/_//_/\_,_/\_,_/_/_/ To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Dec 4 14:01:54 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52222 for opro ; Thu, 04 Dec 97 14:01:53 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881226473:12:10802:77; Thu, 04 Dec 97 09:07:53 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ac0628468; 4 Dec 97 9:07 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id an2010686; 4 Dec 97 9:06 GMT From: David Pilling Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 04 Dec 1997 09:02:22 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971204.090222.49@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 03 Dec 97 17:09:48 GMT X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c From: Nick Kaijaks >> I think this is a good idea. At the moment the only things it >> splits on are spaces and '-' hard hyphens. I've often found /'s > >I thought hard hyphens were non-breaking? Do you mean normal and >soft/optional hyphens? Yes, sorry, bad choice of word. At the moment, we've got standard hyphens (minus sign on the keyboard), hard hyphens (non-breaking), and discretionary hyphens. With the added catch that if you stick a discretionary hyphen at the start of a word, no hyphenation at all takes place. Thank you all for pointing out why splitting on /'s is a bad idea. One thing I can offer easily is a character akin to a discretionary hyphen, which allows the specification of a point to split at. Although this is only a small step forward on sticking a space in. Yes, one could have a global switch for splitting on /'s. Or a text style flag etc. etc. but quite if this is a common enough problem for such a heavy duty solution, I don't know. The only other thing this brings to mind is that there is a secret pargraph attribute of 'word wrap', switch that off and you'll get splits at the nearest character. David Pilling To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Dec 4 14:01:59 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52224 for opro ; Thu, 04 Dec 97 14:01:58 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881226505:12:10934:82; Thu, 04 Dec 97 09:08:25 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0628475; 4 Dec 97 9:07 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id al2010686; 4 Dec 97 9:05 GMT From: Steve Ellacott Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 04 Dec 1997 09:01:12 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971204.090112.48@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 02 Dec 1997 13:47:53 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Tue 02 Dec, David Pilling wrote: > > > > From: Dr A G Gray > > >Have I missed something, or is there a problem with hyphenation of words at the > >end of a line when there is a forward slash / in a 'compound' word. > >Try as a might, I cannot get orchestral/instrumental or such like to split at > >the end of a line. > >Any comments? > > I think this is a good idea. At the moment the only things it > splits on are spaces and '-' hard hyphens. I've often found /'s difficult to format. > > The question is would this change upset anyone? And are > there any other characters which should be split on? > IMHO this is a very bad idea. It means that fractions and mathematical expression using division would be split over two lines. -- Steve Ellacott, School of Computing and Mathematical Sciences, University of Brighton, Moulsecoomb, BN2 4GJ, UK Tel: Home (01273) 885845 Office: (01273) 642544 or 642414 Fax: Home (01273) 270183 Office: (01273) 642405 WWW: http://www.it.brighton.ac.uk/staff/swe To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Dec 4 14:02:04 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52226 for opro ; Thu, 04 Dec 97 14:02:02 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881226539:12:11100:77; Thu, 04 Dec 97 09:08:59 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0628548; 4 Dec 97 9:08 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id am2010686; 4 Dec 97 9:06 GMT From: Chris Ford Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 04 Dec 1997 09:01:37 +0000 Organization: Subject: splitting at / To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971204.090137.10@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 03 Dec 1997 10:05:17 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c From: Dr A G Gray >Have I missed something, or is there a problem with hyphenation of words at the >end of a line when there is a forward slash / in a 'compound' word. >Try as a might, I cannot get orchestral/instrumental or such like to split at >the end of a line. >Any comments? I agree with others about the annoyance in Publisher of splitting at a forward slash, as in 1/2 etc. I thought at one stage there was a solution in Publisher, namely to put an optional hyphen just before the /. However, it doesn't seem to work nowadays! There is one other use for an optional hyphen at the end of a word, and that is to stop the word being hyphenated at all (I don't know if this happens in OPro, but it did in Publisher). So I suggest an optional hyphen just AFTER such a splittable character should be taken to mean don't split, whereas putting it just before should mean don't hyphenate the previous word. Chris. -- Dr C.J.B. Ford, cjbf@cam.ac.uk, tel. +44 1223 337486, fax +44 1223 337271 To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Dec 4 14:02:09 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52228 for opro ; Thu, 04 Dec 97 14:02:07 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881226545:05:06186:77; Thu, 04 Dec 97 09:09:05 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0628945; 4 Dec 97 9:08 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ap2010686; 4 Dec 97 9:07 GMT From: Are Leistad Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 04 Dec 1997 09:02:44 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971204.090244.88@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 03 Dec 1997 19:53:06 +0000 (GMT+1) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Wed 03 Des, Peter Bell wrote: > On Tue 02 Dec, David Pilling wrote: > > From: Dr A G Gray > > > > >Have I missed something, or is there a problem with hyphenation of words at the > > >end of a line when there is a forward slash / in a 'compound' word. > > >Try as a might, I cannot get orchestral/instrumental or such like to split at > > >the end of a line. > > >Any comments? > > > > I think this is a good idea. At the moment the only things it > > splits on are spaces and '-' hard hyphens. I've often found /'s difficult to format. > > > > The question is would this change upset anyone? > > Yes! One of the gripes that I have always had with Impression is the > way it splits a line on a forward slash, and there is no obvious way of > preventing it. Terms such as TCP/IP and OS/2 must not be split. I > have often wasted time trying to reword some text in such a way that > such a term does not occur at the end of a line. Would it be possible > to ensure that a line is only split after a forward slash when there > are more than a certain number of characters following (5?)? Wouldn't it be easier to do an exceptins-dictionary of those words/terms which should *not* be split? -- Regards, Sveinung W. Tengelsen ----------------------------------------------------------------------- mailto:pixeleye@sn.no | I have one illusion; http://www.sn.no/~pixeleye/Index.htm | I have no illusions. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Dec 5 13:56:02 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52317 for opro ; Fri, 05 Dec 97 13:56:01 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881318111:12:18644:79; Fri, 05 Dec 97 10:35:11 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ac0619770; 5 Dec 97 10:34 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ac1026311; 5 Dec 97 10:33 GMT From: Julian Wright Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 05 Dec 1997 09:51:52 +0000 Organization: USS Enterprise, NCC 1701a Subject: Non-breaking paragraph To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971205.095152.60@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 4 Dec 1997 23:37:06 +1300 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c All this talk about splitting lines at "/"s has reminded me of something else I have occasionally wished for. Namely, non-breaking paragraphs. That is, I'd like to be able to specify that a paragraph never be split across multiple frames. Julian -- Confucius say: he who run in front of car get tired. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Dec 5 13:56:06 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52319 for opro ; Fri, 05 Dec 97 13:56:05 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881318171:12:18960:84; Fri, 05 Dec 97 10:36:11 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0620292; 5 Dec 97 10:35 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ah1026311; 5 Dec 97 10:34 GMT From: David Pilling Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 05 Dec 1997 10:27:06 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971205.102706.51@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 04 Dec 97 14:42:40 GMT X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c From: Kelvin Randall >I've also just loaded the Fog applet and now every time I open a new OP >document I get a message from OvPro box with no message in it. Is it me or is >it Fog that's mimsying? Hmm. I would not suspect Fog. My feeling is that there is another applet - one of the ones which opens a window for each document that can sometimes go wrong like this. Whilst on the subject. I've met a few people who have said that OPro crashed (trap in trap handler) when "I was just typing". This sort of thing is impossible to track down. However yesterday I saw it happen. It seems to me to correlate with the PagePal applet. So if you've had this problem, remove the PagePal applet and see if it goes away. I am now investigating to see why this is happening. David Pilling To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Dec 5 13:56:10 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52321 for opro ; Fri, 05 Dec 97 13:56:09 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881318181:12:19035:77; Fri, 05 Dec 97 10:36:21 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ac0620445; 5 Dec 97 10:36 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ai1026311; 5 Dec 97 10:35 GMT From: Dr A G Gray Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 05 Dec 1997 10:27:47 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: splitting at / To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971205.102747.05@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 4 Dec 97 16:01:07 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Thu 4 Dec 97 (09:01:37 +0000), cjbf@cam.ac.uk wrote: > > I agree with others about the annoyance in Publisher of splitting at a >forward slash, as in 1/2 etc. But the situation is only going to arise with long 'compound' words. Simple fractions are not going to fall within the hyphenation specification anyway. For example, I set mine at 9 characters minimum, with minimum of 4 chars before and 4 after before hyphenation is contemplated. A related difficulty occurs with a long word which is not hyphenated when immediately followed by closing quotes. (Or is preceded by an opening quote.) The only answer to this is to leave a space. -- Alan.Gray@argonet.co.uk Dr A.G.Gray. Great Warley, Essex. UK http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/alan.gray N 51 33'58" E 00 17'35" G3XQU (DXCC=323/328) Acorn RiscPC S/A 202MHz To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Dec 5 13:56:14 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52323 for opro ; Fri, 05 Dec 97 13:56:13 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881318233:12:19305:24; Fri, 05 Dec 97 10:37:13 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0619956; 5 Dec 97 10:36 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aj1026311; 5 Dec 97 10:35 GMT From: Carl Cepurneek Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 05 Dec 1997 10:28:13 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: hyphenation (NOT Re: Various :-!) To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971205.102813.45@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 5 Dec 1997 09:46:56 +0930 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Sveinung W. Tengelsen adds... >Wouldn't it be easier to do an exceptins-dictionary of those words/terms >which should *not* be split? Fractions are a class of words several writers have mentioned as being non splitters. It is left as an exercise for readers to construct an exception-dictrionary with all possible n1/n2 fractions :-) So far, the idea of a 'no-split' style that can be applied to problem words sounds the most straight forward to implement (?) and use. I'd assume it could work for *any* character which might otherwise be a hyphenation candidate, including spaces. For- now, cpc To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Dec 5 13:56:19 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52325 for opro ; Fri, 05 Dec 97 13:56:18 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881318251:12:19350:85; Fri, 05 Dec 97 10:37:31 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0620292; 5 Dec 97 10:37 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id al1026311; 5 Dec 97 10:36 GMT From: "Dr. D. M. Lewis" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 05 Dec 1997 10:26:44 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971205.102644.81@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 04 Dec 1997 09:48:09 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Thu 04 Dec, Steve Ellacott wrote: > On Tue 02 Dec, David Pilling wrote: > > > > > > > > From: Dr A G Gray > > > > >Have I missed something, or is there a problem with hyphenation of words at the > > >end of a line when there is a forward slash / in a 'compound' word. > > >Try as a might, I cannot get orchestral/instrumental or such like to split at > > >the end of a line. > > IMHO this is a very bad idea. It means that fractions and mathematical expression > using division would be split over two lines. I agree very strongly with the last comment (it is one of the problems with Impression). Would a compromise be to allow the soft hyphen to operate and produce a split at the slash - it could be put either side to increase flexibility. (I can not get this to work but I may be wrong as I am very new to Ovation). Don Lewis Dr. D. M. Lewis, Phone +44 117 9287813 Department of Physiology, Secretaries' Office +44 117 9288105 Medical School, Fax +44 117 9288923 Unversity Walk, Bristol, BS8 1TD, mailto:Don.Lewis@bristol.ac.uk England. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Dec 5 13:56:25 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52327 for opro ; Fri, 05 Dec 97 13:56:23 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881318318:12:19669:49; Fri, 05 Dec 97 10:38:38 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0619956; 5 Dec 97 10:35 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ad1026311; 5 Dec 97 10:34 GMT From: Eddie Lord Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 05 Dec 1997 10:27:26 +0000 Organization: Subject: RE: Future releases & Alsystems To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971205.102726.97@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 4 Dec 1997 13:54:22 -0500 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Regretably, unless one is prepared to pay for upgrades, the quality of Acorn software will suffer, simply because the Acorn market is not big enough. If the upgrade came with an additional user guide (perhaps including many of the techniques found on this site) then it would be worth paying for. As for Alsystems, I upgraded my SCSI2 to SCSI3 at the show, and it has promptly trashed my hard drive. Taken me days to restore my PC partition. So much for merchantable quality!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Eddie Lord. 72046.251@compuserve.com To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Dec 5 13:56:30 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52329 for opro ; Fri, 05 Dec 97 13:56:28 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881318618:06:23889:34; Fri, 05 Dec 97 10:43:38 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0621169; 5 Dec 97 10:37 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id an1026311; 5 Dec 97 10:36 GMT From: Richard Hallas Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 05 Dec 1997 09:51:10 +0000 Organization: KeyNote Music Typesetting Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971205.095110.58@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 04 Dec 1997 09:13:17 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c In message <19971204.090222.49@risc.demon.co.uk> David Pilling wrote: > Thank you all for pointing out why splitting on /'s is a bad idea. > > One thing I can offer easily is a character akin to a discretionary > hyphen, which allows the specification of a point to split at. > Although this is only a small step forward on sticking a space in. That would certainly be useful. > Yes, one could have a global switch for splitting on /'s. Or a text > style flag etc. etc. but quite if this is a common enough problem > for such a heavy duty solution, I don't know. It probably is, actually. One thing that springs to mind is that you could make this splitting on either side of a slash relatively intelligent. For instance, the biggest gripe is that you don't want fractions or common acronyms to be split at the hyphen... so things like TCP/IP and 49/81 don't get split. However, in the cases where words on either side of a slash /can/ get split is where both halves are full words in their own right. So you could have a rule where if both words on either side of the slash are present in the spelling checker's dictionary, you know that it's OK to split at the slash; but if not, don't. On the whole, though, I suspect that it's easier just to stick with the 'manual' splitting - though you could certainly make it know that it should never split in cases where either half is a number. Anyway, something to ponder on... -- Richard -=-=-=- Richard G. Hallas * Author of "Charges" * Editor of RISC User magazine Proprietor of KeyNote: Music Typesetting & General Desktop Publishing E-mail: Richard@hallas.demon.co.uk * Telephone/Facsimile: 01484 460280 To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Dec 8 18:00:53 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52449 for opro ; Mon, 08 Dec 97 18:00:52 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881577370:12:02936:80; Mon, 08 Dec 97 10:36:10 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0628414; 8 Dec 97 10:35 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ae1027950; 8 Dec 97 10:34 GMT From: Sveinung Tengelsen Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 08 Dec 1997 09:08:30 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Non-breaking paragraph To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971208.090830.24@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 05 Dec 1997 12:50:54 +0000 (GMT+1) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Fri 05 Des, Julian Wright wrote: > All this talk about splitting lines at "/"s has reminded me of something else > I have occasionally wished for. Namely, non-breaking paragraphs. That is, I'd > like to be able to specify that a paragraph never be split across multiple > frames. AKA "Widow and Orphan control". S' a good'un - should be a style-parameter. :) -- Regards, Sveinung W. Tengelsen ----------------------------------------------------------------------- mailto:pixeleye@sn.no | I have one illusion; http://www.sn.no/~pixeleye/Index.htm | I have no illusions. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Dec 8 18:00:55 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52450 for opro ; Mon, 08 Dec 97 18:00:54 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881577370:05:29637:81; Mon, 08 Dec 97 10:36:10 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ag0628603; 8 Dec 97 10:35 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id af1027950; 8 Dec 97 10:34 GMT From: Samuel Penn Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 08 Dec 1997 09:10:16 +0000 Organization: Somewhere else in Aldershot Subject: Keep together To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971208.091016.76@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 04 Dec 1997 18:56:01 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Okay then, I've just bought Ovation Pro having been using Impression for countless years, so naturally I'm trying to do in Ovation what I'd do in Impression. AFAICT, there isn't a 'keep together' option for styles. Is this true? If not, is there another way of getting the same effect? By 'keep together' I mean being able to set up a style (such as a heading) as 'keep with next paragraph', or 'keep together with 28.8 pts', so that headings don't appear by themselves at the bottom of a page, but are flushed to the next page if the following lines or paragraphs are over the page. -- Be seeing you, Sam. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Dec 8 18:01:00 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52452 for opro ; Mon, 08 Dec 97 18:00:59 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881577399:05:00056:26; Mon, 08 Dec 97 10:36:39 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ac0628414; 8 Dec 97 10:35 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id am1027950; 8 Dec 97 10:35 GMT From: "Bernard G. Hill" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 08 Dec 1997 09:08:07 +0000 Organization: Subject: Fonts Problem To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971208.090807.75@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Sun, 07 Dec 1997 16:25:07 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I have been having trouble with the Font Family 'Duke' loaded into !Boot Resourses from the Font Foundry CD Rom. When a file is loaded a message states that these fonts are not available but selecting 'subsititute' causes the file to load and then display the fonts it claimed were not available. I suspect that this has caused some printing difficulties I have recently experienced, but that may be just blaming something without evidence. To check if there was anything wrong with the fonts, I re-did the file in Impression Publisher and this file loads without making any complaints, and displays and prints 'Duke' without trouble. Has anyone else had this kind of problem with this same typeface or any other? Bernard Hill -- Bernard G. Hill Tel/Fax: 01633 880197 Zion, Church Road Undy, Newport e-mail bernard.hill@virgin.net Monmouthshire NP6 3EN To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Dec 8 18:01:04 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52454 for opro ; Mon, 08 Dec 97 18:01:03 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881577431:05:00310:78; Mon, 08 Dec 97 10:37:11 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0629312; 8 Dec 97 10:37 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id an1027950; 8 Dec 97 10:35 GMT From: Sveinung Tengelsen Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 08 Dec 1997 09:08:51 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: hyphenation (NOT Re: Various :-!) To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971208.090851.52@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 05 Dec 1997 13:09:18 +0000 (GMT+1) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Fri 05 Des, Carl Cepurneek wrote: > Sveinung W. Tengelsen adds... > > >Wouldn't it be easier to do an exceptins-dictionary of those words/terms > >which should *not* be split? > > Fractions are a class of words several writers have mentioned as being non > splitters. It is left as an exercise for readers to construct an > exception-dictrionary with all possible n1/n2 fractions :-) Uh - "don't split fractions (i.e numbers with a / between)"? 8) > So far, the idea of a 'no-split' style that can be applied to problem words > sounds the most straight forward to implement (?) and use. I'd assume it > could work for *any* character which might otherwise be a hyphenation > candidate, including spaces. Agree. -- Regards, Sveinung W. Tengelsen ----------------------------------------------------------------------- mailto:pixeleye@sn.no | I have one illusion; http://www.sn.no/~pixeleye/Index.htm | I have no illusions. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Dec 8 18:01:09 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52456 for opro ; Mon, 08 Dec 97 18:01:08 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881577440:05:00395:26; Mon, 08 Dec 97 10:37:20 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0629270; 8 Dec 97 10:36 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ao1027950; 8 Dec 97 10:36 GMT From: "D.A.Symes" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 08 Dec 1997 09:09:55 +0000 Organization: Subject: Clipboard To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971208.090955.35@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 21:38:11 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Hi folks.. I was under the impression (sorry) that Ov Pro used the universal clipboard, but it doesn't seem to. Can someone put me right on this... I know we discussed the universal clipboard at some length in the past, but I can't remember now... :-( Cheers Dave PS: I'm aware of the other ways I can drag out of Ov Pro into other WP's, that's not in question. It's just that out of curiosity I did a Ctrl-C in Ov Pro on an email I was writing, then tried Ctrl-V(ing) it in Pluto... nothing happened. Obviously if I'd been using (sorry publisher) it would have worked. Dave -- _________________________________________________________________________ Dave Symes... df.symes@argonet.co.uk Phone/Fax (01202) 432 489 ...Mem...Clan Acorn... ZFC A almost B... Mem...BSFA and others... www.argonet.co.uk/users/df.symes/index.htm News and mail with the help of Pluto V 0.37c To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Dec 8 18:01:15 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52458 for opro ; Mon, 08 Dec 97 18:01:13 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881577455:05:00442:78; Mon, 08 Dec 97 10:37:35 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ac0629658; 8 Dec 97 10:37 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ar1027950; 8 Dec 97 10:36 GMT From: Martin Corley Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 08 Dec 1997 09:09:13 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971208.090913.14@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 05 Dec 1997 13:26:10 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c > On Thu 04 Dec, Steve Ellacott wrote: > > On Tue 02 Dec, David Pilling wrote: > > > From: Dr A G Gray > > > > > > > Have I missed something, or is there a problem with hyphenation > > > > of words at the end of a line when there is a forward slash / in > > > > a 'compound' word. [...] > > IMHO this is a very bad idea. It means that fractions and > > mathematical expression using division would be split over two > > lines. > > I agree very strongly with the last comment [...] It seems that there is not going to be an easy way to implement "/"-breaking to everyone's satisfaction; moreover, I suspect that any solution attempted will have to be general enough to handle other breaking characters that people might request in the future... Can I suggest (a) a user-editable list of "breakable" characters, allowing musicians and mathematicians to get the default behaviour they desire; (b) a "keep together" emphasis (a bit like \mbox{} in LaTeX) which would ensure that no line break ever occurred in any text so emphasised(*); (c) a "soft break" character which acted like soft hyphen but didn't insert any character as the result of a linebreak. That should provide enough configurability for anyone's purposes, surely? (*) ideally, a "line" keep together (as above), and a "paragraph" keep together (as previously requested)... Martin Corley -- Martin Corley ---- Department of Psychology Martin.Corley@ed.ac.uk University of Edinburgh ---- To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Dec 8 18:01:21 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52460 for opro ; Mon, 08 Dec 97 18:01:19 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881577484:05:00625:81; Mon, 08 Dec 97 10:38:04 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0629781; 8 Dec 97 10:37 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id as1027950; 8 Dec 97 10:37 GMT From: Nick Kaijaks Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 08 Dec 1997 09:09:34 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971208.090934.59@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 05 Dec 1997 13:29:41 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Richard Hallas wrote: > However, in the cases where words on either side of a slash /can/ get > split is where both halves are full words in their own right. So you > could have a rule where if both words on either side of the slash are > present in the spelling checker's dictionary, you know that it's OK > to split at the slash; but if not, don't. But then what if you're taking about something like a ratio? You'd again lose the sense of the sentence: eg. number of spatulas/person, porcupines/womble, valence level electrons/bulk atom... Dr. D. M. Lewis wrote: > Would a compromise be to allow the soft hyphen to operate and produce > a split at the slash - it could be put either side to increase > flexibility. (I can not get this to work but I may be wrong as I > am very new to Ovation). This seems like a sensible solution... alternatively, a non-splitting style property would do the job nicely - along with non-breaking paras as mentioned earlier. Dr A G Gray wrote: > But the situation is only going to arise with long 'compound' words. > Simple fractions are not going to fall within the hyphenation > specification anyway. For example, I set mine at 9 characters > minimum, with minimum of 4 chars before and 4 after before > hyphenation is contemplated. But what is the *default* hyphenation specification? We ought to have a solution that works whatever hyphenation is switched on for a style. TTFN, Nick -- nick kaijaks; proprietor, pinxit design - putting the solution together and; research student, physics, university of warwick, coventry cv4 7al http://www.warwick.ac.uk/Nick.Kaijaks/ mailto:Nick.Kaijaks@warwick.ac.uk Disclaimer: caveat internettor To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Dec 9 13:48:53 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52547 for opro ; Tue, 09 Dec 97 13:48:51 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881661970:05:06555:79; Tue, 09 Dec 97 10:06:10 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0605067; 9 Dec 97 10:05 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ae2027494; 9 Dec 97 10:04 GMT From: Carl Cepurneek Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 09 Dec 1997 10:02:06 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: hyphenation To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971209.100206.57@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 9 Dec 1997 10:01:07 +0930 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c cpc & swt volly: >> exception-dictrionary with all possible n1/n2 fractions :-) >Uh - "don't split fractions (i.e numbers with a / between)"? 8) But what if I only want to hyphenate fractions with non prime numerators? ;-) More seriously, how would it be done? Like the validation strings in icons? Would be handy for spelling dictionary too, to allow say any single alpha character rather then entering A to Z. A dictionalry with wildcards. >Agree. Sensible person, this Sveinung W. Tengelsen! :-) To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Dec 9 13:49:02 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52549 for opro ; Tue, 09 Dec 97 13:48:58 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881662013:12:27273:78; Tue, 09 Dec 97 10:06:53 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ac0605239; 9 Dec 97 10:06 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ag2027494; 9 Dec 97 10:04 GMT From: David Pilling Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 09 Dec 1997 10:01:43 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971209.100143.53@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 08 Dec 97 21:05:53 GMT X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c From: Sveinung Tengelsen >AKA "Widow and Orphan control". S' a good'un - should be a style-parameter. :) From: Samuel Penn >AFAICT, there isn't a 'keep together' option for styles. >Is this true? If not, is there another way of getting the >same effect? It's a shortcoming of the program at the moment that these keep together styles are not implemented. If you ever look at a DDL file you can see the provision that has been made to support them in the future. I'm not sure about workarounds. Stick your paragraph text in a frame and then embed that frame in the text story is one that springs to mind. From: "Bernard G. Hill" >I have been having trouble with the Font Family 'Duke' loaded into !Boot >Resourses >from the Font Foundry CD Rom. When a file is loaded a message states that >these fonts are not available but selecting 'subsititute' causes the file to >load and then display the fonts it claimed were not available. I suspect that >this has caused some printing difficulties I have recently experienced, but >that may be just blaming something without evidence. Sounds interesting. I'm not aware of this problem. An idea is that you may have created the document with a font "DUKEFONT" and then the fonts on the system may now be "dukefont" - change of case. That would be a bug I suppose, easy to check by looking at the fonts embedded in the document, or saving as DDL, which would allow you to change them by hand. From: "D.A.Symes" >I was under the impression (sorry) that Ov Pro used the universal >clipboard, but it doesn't seem to. No support for the universal clipboard. The usual argument is around whether it is worthwhile. From: Martin Corley >Can I suggest (a) a user-editable list of "breakable" characters, >allowing musicians and mathematicians to get the default behaviour they >desire; (b) a "keep together" emphasis (a bit like \mbox{} in LaTeX) >which would ensure that no line break ever occurred in any text so >emphasised(*); (c) a "soft break" character which acted like soft hyphen >but didn't insert any character as the result of a linebreak. Thats a neat summary. I'm happy with (c), (b) is OK, but (a) gets us into having this as part of document preferences - not impossible c.f. commas and full stops for decimal tabs, but messy. From: David Pilling >What news about the "I was just typing and it fell over" bug? I'm glad you asked me that. I have reasonably strong evidence that this is caused by having 'use inks' set on in the Colour Supplement choices. The page pal applet is innocent... David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Dec 10 13:55:31 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52618 for opro ; Wed, 10 Dec 97 13:55:30 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881746889:06:22061:27; Wed, 10 Dec 97 09:41:29 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0621129; 10 Dec 97 9:40 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ac1002406; 10 Dec 97 9:39 GMT From: Julian Meekings Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 10 Dec 1997 09:36:08 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971210.093608.25@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 9 Dec 1997 11:16:39 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Tue, 9 Dec 1997, David Pilling wrote: > From: "D.A.Symes" > >I was under the impression (sorry) that Ov Pro used the universal > >clipboard, but it doesn't seem to. > > > No support for the universal clipboard. The usual argument is around > whether it is worthwhile. I think that it is a very worthwhile thing, it is one of the only things on the wintel platform that I really wish we had on our platform, veeerry useful. Julian ******************************************************* ***************** Julian Meekings ****************** * jkhm100@york.ac.uk * ************************ To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Dec 10 13:55:35 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52620 for opro ; Wed, 10 Dec 97 13:55:34 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881746903:05:16257:34; Wed, 10 Dec 97 09:41:43 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0621412; 10 Dec 97 9:40 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ad1002406; 10 Dec 97 9:39 GMT From: David Pilling Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 10 Dec 1997 09:36:28 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971210.093628.15@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 10 Dec 97 01:22:58 GMT X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c News ---- Two new things on the www.beebug.com web site. First an alternative set of templates for the main program and colour supplement. Second, a new applet. This one generates UK Post Office bar codes. So you type in the post code and delivery point, and it generates the bar code in your document. The applet will also decode bar codes. In combination with the new mail merge features in 2.48 this applet will allow completely automatic bar coding of addresses. Incidentally a known problem is that the current versions of OPro can't display fonts in icons in applets windows. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Dec 10 13:55:41 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52622 for opro ; Wed, 10 Dec 97 13:55:40 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881746904:05:16314:29; Wed, 10 Dec 97 09:41:44 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0621593; 10 Dec 97 9:40 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ah1002406; 10 Dec 97 9:40 GMT From: Alf Chamings Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 10 Dec 1997 09:35:24 +0000 Organization: Subject: OvPro has died. Help To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971210.093524.38@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 09 Dec 1997 14:07:27 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Greetings all I have no idea what has caused this. All of a sudden, every time I try to load OvPro, the computer seizes solid. A double click on the application icon or on a document icon appears to be loading the application in that the user name, serial no. window appears. Then an error window comes up reading: 'Application may have gone wrong. Click Continue to try to resume or Quit to stop App.' When I click on Quit, another message appears: 'Internal Error, no stack for trap handler: Internal Error: branch through zero at &03813AE8, pc=00000000: register at 00115238.' After this the only response from the computer is from the reset button. No other application appears to be behaving in this way and I don't have much idea what caused it because it is a few days since I have used OvPro. I have tried re-installing to no avail. (RiscPC SA 22MB) Any suggestions? Alf -- mailto:AlfChamings@ed.ac.uk Health and Safety for the Royal Infirmary of Edinburgh tel +44 131 536 3251 fax +44 131 536 3283 http://www.med.ed.ac.uk/hew/ for occupational and environmental health To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Wed Dec 10 13:55:46 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52624 for opro ; Wed, 10 Dec 97 13:55:45 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881746986:06:22900:25; Wed, 10 Dec 97 09:43:06 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0622086; 10 Dec 97 9:42 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ai1002406; 10 Dec 97 9:40 GMT From: Adam Evans Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Wed, 10 Dec 1997 09:35:46 +0000 Organization: Subject: Printing to Networked Callligraph Printer To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971210.093546.44@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 09 Dec 1997 16:56:29 +0100 (BST) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c We have had fun and games with OvationPro and printing (Calligraph Network P) It almost always refuses to print out any of the graphics in a document, this is mainly JPEG's. The sprites tend to be a black splurge!! Has anybody got any ideas as to how to make it print correctly??? Secondly, Beebug - Give AU & AW a copy of OvationPro, I created an advert, sent it to them, and they couldn't accept it, as they haven't got a copy of OvationPro!!! Back to impression I went. What I think is taking the mickey is that beebug's ad is created in Quark!!! Cheers, Adam Evans -- Webmaster and Sales Assistant CJE, 78 Brighton Road, Worthing, mailto:adam@cje.co.uk West Sussex, BN11 2EN, England http://www.cje.co.uk/ Tel: +44 (0)1903 523666 Fax: +44 (0)1903 523679 * * * * Any views expressed by me are not necessarily those of CJE * * * * To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Dec 11 13:37:40 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52735 for opro ; Thu, 11 Dec 97 13:37:39 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881836462:05:29411:85; Thu, 11 Dec 97 10:34:22 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0619361; 11 Dec 97 10:34 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ad1012344; 11 Dec 97 10:33 GMT From: Ray Dawson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 11 Dec 1997 10:21:43 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971211.102143.72@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 10 Dec 1997 12:35:07 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c David Pilling wrote: > No support for the universal clipboard. The usual argument is around > whether it is worthwhile. If it were fairly easy to implement, then it would certainly be very useful as I have several other apps which support it (including Publisher and Voyager) Ray D -- ..===================================. | M a g R a y Document Services | Ray Dawson Tel: 0181 864 7208 | the print and braille specialists | rayd@argonet.co.uk '===================================' http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/rayd To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Dec 11 13:37:44 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52737 for opro ; Thu, 11 Dec 97 13:37:43 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881836497:12:01527:78; Thu, 11 Dec 97 10:34:57 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0619361; 11 Dec 97 10:34 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id af1012344; 11 Dec 97 10:34 GMT From: PWaud Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 11 Dec 1997 10:21:01 +0000 Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com) Subject: Re: Printing to Networked Callligraph Printer To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971211.102101.44@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 10 Dec 1997 08:32:23 EST X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I was one of the first people to buy a Calligraph A4 1200 printer, shell= ing=0Aout over =A31000 for the privelage.=0A=0AThe software that came wit= h the printer was a bit buggy, I suppose thats a=0Arisk that you take wh= en your a pioneer purchaser. I did think it was a bit=0Amuch that I had= to buy a new controller card after just over a year and when=0Athe optic= al unit went up the spout after about two years, I thought that=0Aanothe= r bill for =A3600 was just over the top!=0A=0AIve now got a HP 6L and it = works fine (using a turbo driver). Some of the=0Abugs in the driver sof= tware for the Calligraph were never sorted and Ive a few=0Amates who use = them on a network who have no end of trouble.=0A=0ASo my answer to the Ca= lligraph problem? Buy a new printer!!=0A=0APhilip Waud =0A To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Dec 11 13:37:50 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52739 for opro ; Thu, 11 Dec 97 13:37:48 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881836517:05:29735:78; Thu, 11 Dec 97 10:35:17 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0619784; 11 Dec 97 10:35 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aj1012344; 11 Dec 97 10:34 GMT From: Ray Dawson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 11 Dec 1997 10:21:21 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: OvPro has died. Help To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971211.102121.77@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 10 Dec 1997 12:29:44 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Alf Chamings wrote: > No other application appears to be behaving in this way and I > don't have much idea what caused it because it is a few days since > I have used OvPro. I have tried re-installing to no avail. > (RiscPC SA 22MB) Have you tried commenting out any other applications/modules that load as part of your boot sequence? Do you have the ROMPatch 370/2 installed in Predesk - you should do. Try booting up with Ctrl-Shift held down and release Ctrl a line at a time so that you can see any error messages that may be occurring at boot up. One last thought, temporarily remove your Applets directory from inside OPro in case it is one of them causing the hang up. Ray D -- ..===================================. | M a g R a y Document Services | Ray Dawson Tel: 0181 864 7208 | the print and braille specialists | rayd@argonet.co.uk '===================================' http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/rayd To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Dec 11 13:37:54 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52741 for opro ; Thu, 11 Dec 97 13:37:53 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881836537:05:29798:32; Thu, 11 Dec 97 10:35:37 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0619797; 11 Dec 97 10:35 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ak1012344; 11 Dec 97 10:34 GMT From: Xavier deMonneron Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 11 Dec 1997 10:22:29 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971211.102229.67@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 11 Dec 1997 08:29:55 +0100 (MET) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Wed, 10 Dec 1997, Julian Meekings wrote: > On Tue, 9 Dec 1997, David Pilling wrote: >=20 > > From: "D.A.Symes" > > >I was under the impression (sorry) that Ov Pro used the universal > > >clipboard, but it doesn't seem to. > >=20 > >=20 > > No support for the universal clipboard. The usual argument is around > > whether it is worthwhile. >=20 > I think that it is a very worthwhile thing, it is one of the only things > on the wintel platform that I really wish we had on our platform, veeerry > useful. >=20 I totally agree on that point. Universal clipboard was one of the best point on the Mac ; it does exist now on Win#$=A3=A4=B5# ; why not on our Ac= orn ? IT IS WORTHWILE !!! --=20 Xavier de Monneron, alias AsteRISC, member of ARMada and CPV Acorn RiscPC 600 24 MO/2 GO, SCSI2, 17", CDx4, 486sx33, RiscOS 3.5=20 Xavier.deMonneron@dassault-elec.fr -------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Dec 11 13:38:00 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52743 for opro ; Thu, 11 Dec 97 13:37:58 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881836574:12:01856:78; Thu, 11 Dec 97 10:36:14 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0619784; 11 Dec 97 10:36 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id an1012344; 11 Dec 97 10:35 GMT From: "adams_n@marconi-instruments.co.uk" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 11 Dec 1997 10:20:36 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re[2]: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971211.102036.59@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 10 Dec 97 10:28:02 GMT X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Now that is what I call handy! A barcode generator applet - well done David! _ Nigel J.E.Adams |_| British Bus Preservation Group - \ | Preserving the past for the present and future..... \ | A bus \ | stop! \ | \ | \| ____________________________________________________________\____________ Subject: Re: Various Author: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk at mismtpgw1 Date: 10/12/97 10:11 AM News ---- Two new things on the www.beebug.com web site. First an alternative set of templates for the main program and colour supplement. Second, a new applet. This one generates UK Post Office bar codes. So you type in the post code and delivery point, and it generates the bar code in your document. The applet will also decode bar codes. In combination with the new mail merge features in 2.48 this applet will allow completely automatic bar coding of addresses. Incidentally a known problem is that the current versions of OPro can't display fonts in icons in applets windows. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Dec 11 13:38:06 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52745 for opro ; Thu, 11 Dec 97 13:38:04 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881836579:12:01842:98; Thu, 11 Dec 97 10:36:19 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0620251; 11 Dec 97 10:36 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ao1012344; 11 Dec 97 10:35 GMT From: David Pilling Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 11 Dec 1997 10:22:05 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971211.102205.77@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 10 Dec 97 14:50:39 GMT X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c From: Julian Meekings >> No support for the universal clipboard. The usual argument is around >I think that it is a very worthwhile thing, it is one of the only things >on the wintel platform that I really wish we had on our platform, veeerry >useful. Yes, especially if it worked with Edit and Draw. From: Alf Chamings >A double click on the application icon or on a document icon appears to be >loading the application in that the user name, serial no. window appears. >Internal Error: branch through zero at &03813AE8, pc=00000000: register at >00115238.' After this the only response from the computer is from the reset >button. As ever the question is what changed? Possibilities include new software that has changed files in !System etc. perhaps those only used by OPro. Or that you've changed OPro by adding some files. I wonder if you reinstalled over the top of the previous copy? Probably not a good idea. I think I'd probably be inclined to shift drag everything out of the applets directory, just to simplify matters. From: Adam Evans >We have had fun and games with OvationPro and printing (Calligraph Network P) >It almost always refuses to print out any of the graphics in a document, this >is mainly JPEG's. The sprites tend to be a black splurge!! Over to the Caligraph users... I am not aware that OPro is doing anything wrong. >Secondly, Beebug - Give AU & AW a copy of OvationPro, I created an advert, >sent it to them, and they couldn't accept it, as they haven't got a copy of >OvationPro!!! Back to impression I went. What I think is taking the mickey is >that beebug's ad is created in Quark!!! The defensive reply is that it is open to those magazines to ask for free copies. The problem is that we give away copies, and they get passed on to friends etc. those who need them don't get them. Inertia comes into it, some people aren't that keen to change. But a matter for Ian to sort out... And Beebug, use Quark for RISC User, then try to sell the subscribers to RU under spec'd overpriced PC's, whats the message there? David Pilling To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Dec 12 13:57:49 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52848 for opro ; Fri, 12 Dec 97 13:57:48 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881925157:12:06908:80; Fri, 12 Dec 97 11:12:37 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0617987; 12 Dec 97 11:12 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ab1029139; 12 Dec 97 11:11 GMT From: Malcolm Knight Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 11:07:20 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971212.110720.94@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 11 Dec 1997 14:41:47 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Thu 11 Dec, David Pilling wrote: > And Beebug, use Quark for RISC User, then try to sell the subscribers to RU > under spec'd overpriced PC's, whats the message there? Absolutely right David. I was so peeeed off with the copious PC adverts in the latest RU that I decided there and then that when my sub expires next month they can take a jump.... I suppose I can be accused of sticking one more little nail in Acorn's coffin but not half as many as Beebug do. I wouldn't mind if the Acorns got equal billing but the pro-PC bias was disgraceful coming from the Beeb Users' Group. -- Malcolm Knight To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Dec 12 13:57:51 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52849 for opro ; Fri, 12 Dec 97 13:57:50 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881925158:05:06009:78; Fri, 12 Dec 97 11:12:38 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0618090; 12 Dec 97 11:12 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ac1029139; 12 Dec 97 11:11 GMT From: David Pilling Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 11:08:24 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971212.110824.11@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 11 Dec 97 22:17:33 GMT X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c From: D.A.Symes (private email) >Installed the POBar applet and font... >I think I need some more help please. >I know my postcode is BH7 6JT, but how on earth would I know the >International prefix or delivery point.... whatever they are. The 'international prefix' is currently not used. So leave that blank. The delivery point is a problem. You can find yours by decoding the bar code on something that is posted to you (junk mail). Or you can buy the PO CD ROM which has them for all addresses in the UK. Practically you might enter 1A because at the level delivery points apply at, they're not used, postmen don't read bar codes. The delivery point separates addresses which have identical post codes and consists of a number and a letter. David Pilling To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Dec 12 13:57:59 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52851 for opro ; Fri, 12 Dec 97 13:57:57 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881925196:05:06301:78; Fri, 12 Dec 97 11:13:16 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0618357; 12 Dec 97 11:12 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id af1029139; 12 Dec 97 11:12 GMT From: Steven Pampling Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 11:08:44 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Keep together To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971212.110844.99@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 08 Dec 1997 23:53:45 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Samuel Penn wrote: > Okay then, I've just bought Ovation Pro having been > using Impression for countless years, so naturally > I'm trying to do in Ovation what I'd do in Impression. > AFAICT, there isn't a 'keep together' option for styles. > Is this true? If not, is there another way of getting the > same effect? Not officially, however if you have a look at a saved DDL file you'll find entries for keeplines, keeppara, and keepnext. David Pilling has only partially written the support for this (at least in v2.46) Create a Style identical to the boytext style and then edit it using Edit, Zap or similar. Exaxctly what to enter as the numeric values is guesswork... HTH * SteveP -- steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk or camra@argonet.co.uk for CAMRA items ZFC A * "Cracking Toast Grommit" - Wallace * * "Cracking Real Ale Grommit" - Wallace's brother * To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Dec 12 13:58:05 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52853 for opro ; Fri, 12 Dec 97 13:58:03 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881925219:12:07402:78; Fri, 12 Dec 97 11:13:39 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0618451; 12 Dec 97 11:13 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ah1029139; 12 Dec 97 11:12 GMT From: Graham Allan Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 11:08:02 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971212.110802.62@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 11 Dec 1997 10:17:27 -0600 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c >From David Pilling > >From: Alf Chamings > >>A double click on the application icon or on a document icon appears to be >>loading the application in that the user name, serial no. window appears. >>Internal Error: branch through zero at &03813AE8, pc=00000000: register at >>00115238.' After this the only response from the computer is from the reset >>button. > >As ever the question is what changed? Possibilities include new software >that has changed files in !System etc. perhaps those only used by OPro. >Or that you've changed OPro by adding some files. I wonder if you reinstalled >over the top of the previous copy? Probably not a good idea. >I think I'd probably be inclined to shift drag everything out of the applets >directory, just to simplify matters. I was getting a type-5 error when trying to start OvPro, the other day. Moving all the applets out of the way didn't help matters. Eventually what I tried was, restart the computer - as soon as the desktop appears, hold down SHIFT, which prevents any desktop apps from starting up. In this state, OvPro would start and run ok. Then, after running successfully once, it seemed to run ok subsequently after normal restarts. Strange world. Mainly I tried this following some earlier questions about problems with OvPro and Navaho running together. They seem to be both working ok now though. Graham To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Dec 12 13:58:16 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52855 for opro ; Fri, 12 Dec 97 13:58:10 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 881925252:06:19130:29; Fri, 12 Dec 97 11:14:12 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0618357; 12 Dec 97 11:13 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aj1029139; 12 Dec 97 11:13 GMT From: Richard Hallas Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 11:06:32 +0000 Organization: KeyNote Music Typesetting Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971212.110632.75@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 11 Dec 1997 11:17:48 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c In message <19971211.102205.77@risc.demon.co.uk> David Pilling wrote: > From: Adam Evans > > > We have had fun and games with OvationPro and printing (Calligraph > > Network P) It almost always refuses to print out any of the > > graphics in a document, this is mainly JPEG's. The sprites tend to > > be a black splurge!! > > Over to the Caligraph users... I am not aware that OPro is doing > anything wrong. My A3-1200 is fine, and I'm generally extremely happy with it. However, it does appear that the Calligraph driver has problems with deep-colour sprites; they just don't appear. On the very rare occasions that I want to print one, I tend to convert it to 256 colours first, and then they're fine. (To be fair, I'm using quite an old version of the printer driver.) > And Beebug, use Quark for RISC User, then try to sell the > subscribers to RU under spec'd overpriced PC's, whats the message > there? Hang about, David, that's hardly fair. 1. Yes, RISC User uses Quark for its production. This is for traditional reasons: it would be unrealistically expensive to move over to producing the magazine on Acorn systems. Sarah is familiar with using Macs, and all the layouts are in Quark format. New machines would have to be bought, and the existing expensive Macs scrapped. We have neither the time nor the resources to do anything about this right now. When I took over as Editor, I had high hopes of being able to move the magazine over to production entirely on Ovation Pro, but realistically it isn't going to happen. It's not that we don't /want/ to, or that we don't have faith in your outstanding program. It's simply a matter of time, resources and money. We can't justify it. Given the present difficulties of the Acorn market, wasting money on moving over to production exclusively on Acorn systems for no good reason other than the look of the thing would be an ideal way of going bust, which /would/ be rather shooting ourselves in the foot, I feel. Anyway, I hasten to add that all the articles are prepared on the RISC OS side of my Risc PC. Only the page layout is done on the Mac. 2. What you say implies that RISC User is trying to flog crap PCs to its readers. That's untrue and unfair. We have very little PC coverage, being devoted entirely to Acorns, and I have no desire to cause our readers to buy PCs. (They'd then stop buying the magazine, for one thing!) Beebug does sometimes include a mailshot about its PCs with RISC User, but it's nothing to do with me, and it bears no relation whatsoever to the magazine. The RISC User mail-outs simply provide Beebug with a useful means of sending some advertising to people without having to pay for a separate mail-shot. 3. "The message" is presumably that Beebug is trying to stay alive in a tiny market; trying to get more money to continue to finance Ovation Pro and RISC User. -- Richard -=-=-=- Richard G. Hallas * Author of "Charges" * Editor of RISC User magazine Proprietor of KeyNote: Music Typesetting & General Desktop Publishing E-mail: Richard@hallas.demon.co.uk * Telephone/Facsimile: 01484 460280 To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Dec 15 21:37:00 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52959 for opro ; Mon, 15 Dec 97 21:36:59 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882177550:05:11744:78; Mon, 15 Dec 97 09:19:10 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0604917; 15 Dec 97 9:18 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ae1019023; 15 Dec 97 9:17 GMT From: Peter Blenkinsop Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 09:11:29 +0000 Organization: Subject: Linked frames To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971215.091129.97@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Sun, 14 Dec 1997 15:58:29 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Is it possible to link frames so that when I insert a new page the last frame in the previous page is linked to the first frame in the new page? -- This is my signature using Pluto Contained in the last character of this line is the secret of the universe. Rats!! I've run out of space for the last character. Peter Blenkinsop To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Dec 15 21:37:05 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52961 for opro ; Mon, 15 Dec 97 21:37:04 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882177569:12:10716:27; Mon, 15 Dec 97 09:19:29 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0604977; 15 Dec 97 9:18 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id af1019023; 15 Dec 97 9:18 GMT From: Dr A G Gray Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 09:11:49 +0000 Organization: Subject: Non-effects with ligatures To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971215.091149.43@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Sun, 14 Dec 97 11:37:06 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I've just noticed: An italicised word - eg. fifth - ends up with non-italicised fi-ligature when 'Add ligatures' is selected. This only happens if the ligature is at the start of the word. Just a little bug... -- Alan.Gray@argonet.co.uk Dr A.G.Gray. Great Warley, Essex. UK http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/alan.gray N 51 33'58" E 00 17'35" G3XQU (DXCC=323/328) Acorn RiscPC S/A 202MHz To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Dec 15 21:37:10 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52963 for opro ; Mon, 15 Dec 97 21:37:08 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882177588:05:12036:27; Mon, 15 Dec 97 09:19:48 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0604977; 15 Dec 97 9:19 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id am1019023; 15 Dec 97 9:18 GMT From: Steve Ellacott Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 09:09:21 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Printing to Networked Callligraph Printer To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971215.090921.85@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 09:01:59 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Wed 10 Dec, Adam Evans wrote: > > We have had fun and games with OvationPro and printing (Calligraph Network P) > > It almost always refuses to print out any of the graphics in a document, this > is mainly JPEG's. The sprites tend to be a black splurge!! > > Has anybody got any ideas as to how to make it print correctly??? > I also have this problem with my Calligraph (not networked). The solution is to use ChangeFSI to convert your sprites to monochrome before importing them into your document. As reported extensively here and elsewhere, the Calligraph software is dreadfully buggy. But *when* it works, it works very well. I don't know any other printer driver that allows such control over screening of images. -- Steve Ellacott, School of Computing and Mathematical Sciences, University of Brighton, Moulsecoomb, BN2 4GJ, UK Tel: Home (01273) 885845 Office: (01273) 642544 or 642414 Fax: Home (01273) 270183 Office: (01273) 642405 WWW: http://www.it.brighton.ac.uk/staff/swe To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Dec 15 21:37:19 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52965 for opro ; Mon, 15 Dec 97 21:37:13 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882177599:05:12059:48; Mon, 15 Dec 97 09:19:59 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0604917; 15 Dec 97 9:19 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ac1019023; 15 Dec 97 9:19 GMT From: David Pilling Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 09:11:08 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971215.091108.73@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 12 Dec 97 19:07:24 GMT X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c From: Graham Allan >I was getting a type-5 error when trying to start OvPro, the other day. >Eventually what I tried was, restart the computer - as soon as the >desktop appears, hold down SHIFT, which prevents any desktop apps from It's a deep area, so many other things that might clash. I suppose one point is that something can crash, damage RISC OS, and nothing short of a powercycle will get things back to rights. The various resets don't always reset things. Exciting News ------------- Like to download OPro 2.48? Then fill in this questionaire... How do you feel about reformatting your hard disc? (a) An interesting and challenging experience. (b) AAAAAAAAAAaaaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrggggggghhhhhhhh! (c) What's a hard disc? Installing the Acorn Clan Beta CD ROM was; (a) easy (b) took me three weeks (c) I can't get it out of the packet All (a)'s and you qualify. Seriously there is an upgrade kit on the www.beebug.com site. Probably only for those of an adventurous disposition at the moment. The URL of the archive is http://www.beebug.com/software/ovpro/filelib/files/ovpro.zip Early days yet, but we are getting there, and Ian is to be commended for his efforts so far. David Pilling To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Dec 15 21:37:24 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52967 for opro ; Mon, 15 Dec 97 21:37:23 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882177615:05:12224:26; Mon, 15 Dec 97 09:20:15 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0605619; 15 Dec 97 9:20 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ao1019023; 15 Dec 97 9:19 GMT From: Steve Ellacott Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 09:08:58 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: OvPro has died. Help To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971215.090858.94@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 09:06:24 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Wed 10 Dec, Alf Chamings wrote: > Greetings all > > I have no idea what has caused this. All of a sudden, every time I try to > load OvPro, the computer seizes solid. > > A double click on the application icon or on a document icon appears to be > loading the application in that the user name, serial no. window appears. > Then an error window comes up reading: 'Application may have gone wrong. > Click Continue to try to resume or Quit to stop App.' When I click on Quit, > another message appears: 'Internal Error, no stack for trap handler: > Internal Error: branch through zero at &03813AE8, pc=00000000: register at > 00115238.' After this the only response from the computer is from the reset > button. > > No other application appears to be behaving in this way and I don't have much > idea what caused it because it is a few days since I have used OvPro. I have > tried re-installing to no avail. > Do you have the Acorn Beta release installed? This causes problems with several applications (including Ovation) on my machine. Generally resetting the machine a few times helps. -- Steve Ellacott, School of Computing and Mathematical Sciences, University of Brighton, Moulsecoomb, BN2 4GJ, UK Tel: Home (01273) 885845 Office: (01273) 642544 or 642414 Fax: Home (01273) 270183 Office: (01273) 642405 WWW: http://www.it.brighton.ac.uk/staff/swe To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Dec 15 21:37:29 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52969 for opro ; Mon, 15 Dec 97 21:37:28 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882177617:12:10991:26; Mon, 15 Dec 97 09:20:17 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0605471; 15 Dec 97 9:19 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aa1019023; 15 Dec 97 9:19 GMT From: Rupert Thompson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 09:10:05 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971215.091005.16@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 12:46:50 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Fri 12 Dec, Richard Hallas wrote: > 1. Yes, RISC User uses Quark for its production. This is for > traditional reasons: it would be unrealistically expensive to move > over to producing the magazine on Acorn systems. Sarah is familiar > with using Macs, and all the layouts are in Quark format. New machines > would have to be bought, and the existing expensive Macs scrapped. We > have neither the time nor the resources to do anything about this > right now. When I took over as Editor, I had high hopes of being able > to move the magazine over to production entirely on Ovation Pro, but > realistically it isn't going to happen. Hmm ... so your parent company produces a program which you say it is "unrealistically expensive" for you to use, and you don't think that sends just a teensy-weensy signal to other magazine publishers? -- Rupert Thompson Queens' College, Cambridge, CB3 9ET, UK http://rjet1.quns.cam.ac.uk/ (when my computer's on!) http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Acropolis/4423 To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Dec 15 21:37:35 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52971 for opro ; Mon, 15 Dec 97 21:37:32 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882177655:05:12409:79; Mon, 15 Dec 97 09:20:55 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ac0605471; 15 Dec 97 9:20 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ab1019023; 15 Dec 97 9:19 GMT From: David Graddol Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 09:10:27 +0000 Organization: The English Company (UK) Ltd Subject: Re: OvPro has died. Help To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971215.091027.71@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 17:39:50 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I have a serious problem with the machine freezing up which seems attributable to Ant Inetsuite and Fresco. Basically, if I try running Fresco when Ovation is already running, the machine just stiffs. If I quit Ovation first, then there is no problem. I'm not at all sure that it is Ovation which is to blame, however. There are other applications which interact badly with Fresco but I've not had time to methodically track down the problem. Inetconfigure has a similar problem. I have no idea whether this helps, but the problem may lie in what else you're running rather than in Ovation itself. David In message <19971211.102121.77@risc.demon.co.uk> you wrote: > Alf Chamings wrote: > > > No other application appears to be behaving in this way and I > > don't have much idea what caused it because it is a few days since > > I have used OvPro. I have tried re-installing to no avail. > > > (RiscPC SA 22MB) > > Have you tried commenting out any other applications/modules that load as > part of your boot sequence? > > Do you have the ROMPatch 370/2 installed in Predesk - you should do. > > Try booting up with Ctrl-Shift held down and release Ctrl a line at a time > so that you can see any error messages that may be occurring at boot up. > > One last thought, temporarily remove your Applets directory from inside > OPro in case it is one of them causing the hang up. > > Ray D > -- To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Dec 15 21:37:43 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52973 for opro ; Mon, 15 Dec 97 21:37:39 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882177680:05:12552:79; Mon, 15 Dec 97 09:21:20 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0605619; 15 Dec 97 9:21 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id as1019023; 15 Dec 97 9:20 GMT From: "\"James White (Acorns in Spain" MMDF-Warning: Parse error in original version of preceding line at post.mail.demon.net Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 09:10:48 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971215.091048.55@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 21:50:23 +0100 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Fri 12 Dec, Richard Hallas wrote: > In message <19971211.102205.77@risc.demon.co.uk> David Pilling wrote: >=20 > 1. Yes, RISC User uses Quark for its production. This is for > traditional reasons: it would be unrealistically expensive to move > over to producing the magazine on Acorn systems. Sarah is familiar > with using Macs, Richard, you have wittingly or otherwise opened the cupboard and shown us the skeleton inside. This would seem to be a good moment to come out with a discussion of some fundamentals.=20 Quark undoubtedly _was_ superior to anything that was available on the Acorn. Now, though, I do not think that this superiority is anything like; certainly no reason _not_ to produce RU in OP. You cite as 'unrealistically expensive' any changeover to Acorns. You and I know that the cost to Beebug of one top-end RPC is 1300 pounds ready to go. Just how daunting is that; how many machines do you need? You cite Sarah as a formidable obstacle. Most people, starting from scratch, would be fully in control of OP within 3 hours, rather less for someone used to Quark. So let's face it, it is Sarah herself who is the problem. Is she SO successful on a Mac that she is patently hopeless on anything else? Moving from a one-button mouse over to a three-button one.. Phew! When you took over as Editor, you had the high hopes of making a change to Acorn/OP, splendid fellow that you are. So it's the management that's sticking. You say you can't justify the time, resources and money. In no way can anyone tell Beebug how to run their business. No, we would just turn up on the doorstep at 117 with a bunch of goons and a missionary and say "By golly, Ric, you sure got a nice place here. It'd be a real shame to have it burn to the ground. Maybe you should all think about getting yourselves baptised in this Acorn font we got". Nor would we want it to go bust. But hell, there's an opportunity here. Turn the argument around to your advantage. Blazen forth that Beebug is producing RU 100% Acorn, to show your confidence in the platform. Raise a levy on all its subscribers that would keep the 0% finance going on the new machine(s), do a guide-book on Publishing; sell more OPs as a result; attack that niche market and sell more Acorns. =20 Keeping it rational, what is it about a Mac that it should dominate in a house that is a pillar of Acorn respectability? Is it really superior to a modern Acorn? > Hang about, David, that's hardly fair. No? but it had to be said. Incidentally, how was the OP ad produced? JW --=20 ------------------------------------------- Sibelius en Espana: Mailto:jacorn@ibm.net En Andalucia: Mailto:pmoya@valnet.es Visita a http://www.argonet.co.uk/opus/spain =A1En Castellano! ------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Dec 15 21:37:48 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA52975 for opro ; Mon, 15 Dec 97 21:37:47 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882177687:12:11344:78; Mon, 15 Dec 97 09:21:27 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0605990; 15 Dec 97 9:21 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aq1019023; 15 Dec 97 9:20 GMT From: Kevin Pearcey Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 09:12:11 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Transparent Frames To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971215.091211.73@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Sun, 14 Dec 1997 22:28:44 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Mon 22 Sep, Roger Mayne wrote: > On Fri 19 Sep, David Pilling wrote: > > > From:(Roger Mayne) > > > > >It has just occured to me that life would be so much easier if my default > > >frames were always transparent. > > > > From:(Simon Jones) > > >Is it possible to set all new frames to be transparent by default rather > > >than white? > > > > As it stands, no, you're stuck with the defaults. What I want to do > > is add named master pages, one set of these would be used to > > provide prototypes for frames etc. > > > > Timewise you'd probably prefer I provided something more crude. > > > > Incidentally from the programmers point of view transparent frames > > are bad news, redraws are much less efficient because you've got > > to paint all the stuff under the frame. And I think it was this > > consideration which led to the default being white. > David > > If you are going to do something about transparent default frames, could you > also give consideration to have the option 'no text runaround' available as > default as well? > > Many thanks > > Roger > -- > Roger Mayne mailto:darprint@mail.zynet.co.uk > Darprint, Unit 21, r/o 8-14 St. Vincents Road, Dartford, Kent, DA1 1XZ > Tel: 01322 227574 Fax: 01322 291237 > > > > To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk > with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l > To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l > > > I've always wanted the ability to have all these options suppliable to a create_new_frame command. This would allow a button to create a new frame with the appropriate fill colour, borders etc.. This would be great for continous publications which use several common styled frames. Saves having to keep a file with these defined and copy & paste when each new frame is required. -- Kevin Pearcey To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Dec 16 14:01:26 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53049 for opro ; Tue, 16 Dec 97 14:01:25 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882263195:12:12177:78; Tue, 16 Dec 97 09:06:35 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ac0621441; 16 Dec 97 9:06 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ae1025234; 16 Dec 97 9:05 GMT From: Jack Evans Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 09:01:10 +0000 Organization: Subject: OPro Error Message: ETEMPF To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971216.090110.33@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 18:01:14 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I tried to Load OPro V2.46 with Pluto on the icon bar (don't know if this is significant) and up came a message from OPro 'ETEMPF'. This now happens every time I try to load the program, on a newly booted machine and/or with the V2.48 OPro upgrade. What does the message signify and is there a way out short of re-installing from scratch? -- Jack Evans mailto: jack@snave.demon.co.uk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Dec 16 14:01:31 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53051 for opro ; Tue, 16 Dec 97 14:01:29 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882263256:12:12496:90; Tue, 16 Dec 97 09:07:36 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0621703; 16 Dec 97 9:07 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id af1025234; 16 Dec 97 9:06 GMT From: Ian MacDougall Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 09:03:13 +0000 Organization: Beebug Ltd Subject: Email problems To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971216.090313.95@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 08:56:20 +0100 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Some of you may have experienced bounced mail from the list yesterday. This was due to me trying to test something on the risc account and accepting connections on port 25 (SMTP), so mail tried to get delivered to a machine that wasn't running a mailserver, sorry about that. Please resend your messages and I will try not to lose them this time. -- Ian MacDougall Beebug Ltd To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Dec 16 14:01:37 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53053 for opro ; Tue, 16 Dec 97 14:01:36 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882263260:05:09257:78; Tue, 16 Dec 97 09:07:40 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0621968; 16 Dec 97 9:07 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ak1025234; 16 Dec 97 9:06 GMT From: Ray Dawson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 08:59:06 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Linked frames To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971216.085906.03@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 14:14:14 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Peter Blenkinsop wrote: > Is it possible to link frames so that when I insert a new page the last > frame in the previous page is linked to the first frame in the new page? But it already does if you have single or multiple columns on the master page. Page..Insert page..After puts a page after the current page and clicking on the link tool shows the last column of the current page linking to the first column of the new page. Ray D -- ..===================================. | M a g R a y Document Services | Ray Dawson Tel: 0181 864 7208 | the print and braille specialists | rayd@argonet.co.uk '===================================' http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/rayd To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Dec 16 14:01:43 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53055 for opro ; Tue, 16 Dec 97 14:01:41 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882263284:12:12643:79; Tue, 16 Dec 97 09:08:04 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0622154; 16 Dec 97 9:07 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id al1025234; 16 Dec 97 9:07 GMT From: Ian Scott Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 08:59:27 +0000 Organization: Subject: OvPro Upgrade not for 2.45? To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971216.085927.14@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 14:15:31 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c David Pilling wrote: > Exciting News > ------------- > Like to download OPro 2.48? there is an upgrade kit on the > www.beebug.com site. Probably only for those of an adventurous > disposition at the moment. Perhaps it might have been useful to tell us poor 2.45 owners that the upgrade can only be used with 2.46, according to the ReadMe file which can only be read AFAICS once the upgrade has been downloaded .. :-( Nice to know that there is some progress on the upgrade though .. :-) Scotty -- ___________________________ / \ / \ / \ / \ / \ / \ ( S | C | O | T | T | Y ) Aardvarks come first! \_/ \_/ \_/ \_/ \_/ \_/ ri.scott@argonet.co.uk ___________________________ To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Dec 16 14:01:48 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53057 for opro ; Tue, 16 Dec 97 14:01:47 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882263349:05:09724:32; Tue, 16 Dec 97 09:09:09 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0622401; 16 Dec 97 9:08 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id am1025234; 16 Dec 97 9:07 GMT From: Ray Dawson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 08:59:47 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Non-effects with ligatures To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971216.085947.66@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 14:14:03 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Dr A G Gray wrote: > I've just noticed: > An italicised word - eg. fifth - ends up with non-italicised > fi-ligature when 'Add ligatures' is selected. This only happens if > the ligature is at the start of the word. > Just a little bug... I have OP 2.46 and !Ligatures 1.02 and it correctly italicises the front ligature. I just typed a sentence including fifth, italicised it and then went to Ligatures..Add ligatures and it ligatured the fi in italics Ok. Ray D -- ..===================================. | M a g R a y Document Services | Ray Dawson Tel: 0181 864 7208 | the print and braille specialists | rayd@argonet.co.uk '===================================' http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/rayd To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Dec 16 14:01:54 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53059 for opro ; Tue, 16 Dec 97 14:01:53 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882263370:05:09895:78; Tue, 16 Dec 97 09:09:30 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0622610; 16 Dec 97 9:09 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id an1025234; 16 Dec 97 9:08 GMT From: Philip Powell Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 09:02:51 +0000 Organization: Sharp Edge Subject: OvnPro 2.48 To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971216.090251.51@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 08:42:53 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c In message <19971215.091108.73@risc.demon.co.uk> David Pilling wrote: > > Exciting News > ------------- > > Like to download OPro 2.48? Then fill in this questionaire... > > > Seriously there is an upgrade kit on the www.beebug.com site. Probably > only for those of an adventurous disposition at the moment. > > The URL of the archive is > > http://www.beebug.com/software/ovpro/filelib/files/ovpro.zip > > Early days yet, but we are getting there, and Ian is to be commended for > his efforts so far. Downloads and seems to be fine - but it is only for 2.46 users according to the readme file. Others have to contact Beebug separately. -- Philip Powell Looking north across the Derwent Valley and Northumberland to the Cheviot To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Dec 16 14:02:02 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53061 for opro ; Tue, 16 Dec 97 14:01:59 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882263409:12:13268:81; Tue, 16 Dec 97 09:10:09 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0623032; 16 Dec 97 9:09 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ah1025234; 16 Dec 97 9:09 GMT From: Peter Bond Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 09:01:29 +0000 Organization: home Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971216.090129.89@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 12:45:58 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c In message <19971215.091005.16@risc.demon.co.uk> you wrote: > On Fri 12 Dec, Richard Hallas wrote: > > > 1. Yes, RISC User uses Quark for its production. This is for > > traditional reasons: it would be unrealistically expensive to move > > over to producing the magazine on Acorn systems. Sarah is familiar > > with using Macs, and all the layouts are in Quark format. New machines > > would have to be bought, and the existing expensive Macs scrapped. We > > have neither the time nor the resources to do anything about this > > right now. When I took over as Editor, I had high hopes of being able > > to move the magazine over to production entirely on Ovation Pro, but > > realistically it isn't going to happen. > > Hmm ... so your parent company produces a program which you say it > is "unrealistically expensive" for you to use, and you don't think > that sends just a teensy-weensy signal to other magazine publishers? Why on earth don't some of you fussy folk really read was was said originally instead of jumping to straight keyboard? I have enough to do keeping up with what is reasonable without all this extra garbage. So that's off my chest for a few weeks! -- Peter Bond mailto:peter@sdale1.demon.co.uk Silverdale, Lancashire To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Dec 16 14:02:09 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53063 for opro ; Tue, 16 Dec 97 14:02:08 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882263410:05:10014:78; Tue, 16 Dec 97 09:10:10 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0622825; 16 Dec 97 9:09 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ar1025234; 16 Dec 97 9:08 GMT From: Ray Dawson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 09:00:28 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971216.090028.82@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 14:13:51 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c \James White (Acorns in Spain wrote: > You cite Sarah as a formidable obstacle. Most people, starting from > scratch, would be fully in control of OP within 3 hours, rather less for > someone used to Quark. So let's face it, it is Sarah herself who is the > problem. Is she SO successful on a Mac that she is patently hopeless on > anything else? Moving from a one-button mouse over to a three-button > one.. Phew! And we are all trying to convert Publisher users to use Ovation Pro. The change from Publisher must be as difficult as changing from Quark. Or does someone@beebug consider Quark to be superior to their own flagship product. A bit like Acorn saying "we've got this brilliant Risc PC, but we prefer to use a Pentium II" :-) Ray D -- ..===================================. | M a g R a y Document Services | Ray Dawson Tel: 0181 864 7208 | the print and braille specialists | rayd@argonet.co.uk '===================================' http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/rayd To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Dec 16 14:02:15 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53065 for opro ; Tue, 16 Dec 97 14:02:13 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882263481:05:10470:79; Tue, 16 Dec 97 09:11:21 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0623253; 16 Dec 97 9:10 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id as1025234; 16 Dec 97 9:09 GMT From: Jack Evans Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 09:01:50 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: OPro Error Message: ETEMPF To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971216.090150.08@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 20:41:31 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I wrote: > I tried to Load OPro V2.46 with Pluto on the icon bar (don't know if this > is significant) and up came a message from OPro 'ETEMPF'. This now happens > every time I try to load the program, on a newly booted machine and/or with > the V2.48 OPro upgrade. > What does the message signify and is there a way out short of re-installing > from scratch? Since sending the above I have reinstalled the V2.48 upgrade from scratch and got it running for a while. But: 1. Numbered para 1 of !!ReadMe surely should read 'tick the first, *third* and fourth options'? 2. What should be done about the Extensions dir in the upgrade sparkfile? 3. Having a vague idea that there was a directory of this name in OP originally which was phased out in favour of 'Applets', I copied the Applets dir across from my old V2.46 version and added the new/upgrade applets from Extensions to it. However, after performing step 3 above and trying to load OP, it was back to the ETEMPF error message again. I'm mystified. -- Jack Evans mailto: jack@snave.demon.co.uk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Dec 16 14:02:21 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53067 for opro ; Tue, 16 Dec 97 14:02:19 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882263494:05:10501:78; Tue, 16 Dec 97 09:11:34 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0623253; 16 Dec 97 9:11 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aw1025234; 16 Dec 97 9:10 GMT From: "F.R. Polak" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 09:00:49 +0000 Organization: Subject: Version 2.48 To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971216.090049.34@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 16:20:20 +0100 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c In on Mon 15 Dec, David Pilling wrote: > > Exciting News > ------------- > > Like to download OPro 2.48? Then fill in this questionaire... > > How do you feel about reformatting your hard disc? > > (a) An interesting and challenging experience. > (b) AAAAAAAAAAaaaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrggggggghhhhhhhh! > (c) What's a hard disc? > > > Installing the Acorn Clan Beta CD ROM was; > > (a) easy > (b) took me three weeks > (c) I can't get it out of the packet > > > All (a)'s and you qualify. > > Seriously there is an upgrade kit on the www.beebug.com site. Probably > only for those of an adventurous disposition at the moment. > > The URL of the archive is > > http://www.beebug.com/software/ovpro/filelib/files/ovpro.zip > > Early days yet, but we are getting there, and Ian is to be commended for > his efforts so far. > This new upgrade procedure is a breeze! This is a good way to easily distribute upgrades with minimal extra costs, keeping the registration number, etc. intact. A quick test produced only one error sofar :-) If I click on the new button "Go to Ovation Pro WWW site" in the info window from the iconbar menu, I get a system crash, needing a hard reset! For your information, I did install the Acorn Clan Beta CD ROM and its successive upgrades without serious problems so far, so I am using the new (beta) window manager (3.97) and the latest Toolbox modules that come with it. Any ideas? Thanks, Frits Polak "Joining a flock just provides safety, the ones who fly away really get somewhere". -- -------------------------------------------------- Frits R. Polak National Aerospace Laboratory (NLR), Amsterdam Department of Air Traffic Management phone : +31-(0)20-5113543; fax: +31-(0)20-5113210 URL: mailto:polak@nlr.nl To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Dec 16 14:02:26 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53069 for opro ; Tue, 16 Dec 97 14:02:25 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882263507:05:10631:26; Tue, 16 Dec 97 09:11:47 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0623508; 16 Dec 97 9:10 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id av1025234; 16 Dec 97 9:10 GMT From: Alf Chamings Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 09:00:08 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: OvPro has died. Help To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971216.090008.07@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 12:09:25 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Thu 11 Dec, Ray Dawson wrote: > Alf Chamings wrote: > > > No other application appears to be behaving in this way and I > > don't have much idea what caused it because it is a few days since > > I have used OvPro. I have tried re-installing to no avail. > > > (RiscPC SA 22MB) > > Have you tried commenting out any other applications/modules that load as > part of your boot sequence? > > Do you have the ROMPatch 370/2 installed in Predesk - you should do. > > Try booting up with Ctrl-Shift held down and release Ctrl a line at a time > so that you can see any error messages that may be occurring at boot up. > > One last thought, temporarily remove your Applets directory from inside > OPro in case it is one of them causing the hang up. > Thanks, Ray (and DP) it was the applets after all. I remembered as soon as I had a look in the applets directory that I had downloaded the (intriguing) fog applet into the applets directory and forgotten to decompress it. This must have been the cause because the problem disappeared as soon as I removed it. Regards, Alf -- mailto:AlfChamings@ed.ac.uk Health and Safety for the Royal Infirmary of Edinburgh tel +44 131 536 3251 fax +44 131 536 3283 http://www.med.ed.ac.uk/hew/ for occupational and environmental health To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Dec 16 14:02:33 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53071 for opro ; Tue, 16 Dec 97 14:02:31 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882263570:05:10833:118; Tue, 16 Dec 97 09:12:50 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0624102; 16 Dec 97 9:12 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id az1025234; 16 Dec 97 9:11 GMT From: David Pilling Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 09:02:30 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971216.090230.41@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 15 Dec 97 22:23:32 GMT X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c From: Peter Blenkinsop >Is it possible to link frames so that when I insert a new page the last >frame in the previous page is linked to the first frame in the new page? Yes. In 2.45/2.46 the concept of 'auto linking' frames was introduced. If on the master pages you construct a series of linked frames and then link the last one to the first, then each page will have those frames daisy chained together. We're used to having the default master frames on pages link one page to the next, but making use of auto links you can have two (or more) chains of frames running through the document. I think I once read that this facility in other programs was useful for film scripts, so that directions and dialogue could run down parallel columns. From: Steve Ellacott >Do you have the Acorn Beta release installed? This causes problems with several >applications (including Ovation) on my machine. Generally resetting the machine >a few times helps. I am aware of two problems. Firstly if you clear an error box by pressing Return, then although the error box is cleared, the screen is not redrawn. Second, attempts to filer_run files for which no run type is set up e.g. you OLE an ArtWorks file but don't have ArtWorks, result in a crash. Other than that, it was OK'ish. From: David Graddol >I have a serious problem with the machine freezing up which seems >attributable to Ant Inetsuite and Fresco. In my experience there is no problem using OPro with ANT. From: Kevin Pearcey >> If you are going to do something about transparent default frames, could you >> also give consideration to have the option 'no text runaround' available as >> default as well? >I've always wanted the ability to have all these options suppliable >to a create_new_frame command. This would allow a button to create >a new frame with the appropriate fill colour, borders etc.. This >would be great for continous publications which use several common >styled frames. OPro 2.48 (which all the gung ho types will have by now), does allow you to set up frames with whatever default characteristics you wish. In addition it can expand ddl commands at the current selection, although it doesn't work properly it's almost exactly what you want. David Pilling To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Dec 16 14:02:40 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53073 for opro ; Tue, 16 Dec 97 14:02:38 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882263650:12:14507:30; Tue, 16 Dec 97 09:14:10 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ad0623253; 16 Dec 97 9:11 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ax1025234; 16 Dec 97 9:11 GMT From: "A.F. Taylor" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 09:02:09 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: V2.48 To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971216.090209.98@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 15 Dec 1997 22:43:03 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c In on Mon 15 Dec, David Pilling wrote: > Exciting News > ------------- > > Like to download OPro 2.48? Then fill in this questionaire... > > How do you feel about reformatting your hard disc? > > (a) An interesting and challenging experience. > (b) AAAAAAAAAAaaaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrggggggghhhhhhhh! > (c) What's a hard disc? > > > Installing the Acorn Clan Beta CD ROM was; > > (a) easy > (b) took me three weeks > (c) I can't get it out of the packet > > > All (a)'s and you qualify. > > Seriously there is an upgrade kit on the www.beebug.com site. Probably > only for those of an adventurous disposition at the moment. > Well, I downloaded it and (nervously!!) followed the instructions - and it seems to work OK :-) I assumed that all the old Applets, (other than the versions of !imposit and !OArtWrks) should work? All except one of my usual selection do, the exception being !Expand which causes an error on loading of: Error: Unknown identifier get_style at line 23 in [path].Applets.!Expand.Library.Expand and is then missing from the Applets list. (Mind you, I'm waiting impatiently for v2.xx which will implement my pet wish of 'localisable' default master frames - or linkable non-default master frames, sulk,sulk ;-) ) Meanwhile, thanks to Ian and everybody else concerned for getting upgrades 'on-line' Regards, -- Arthur Taylor, Parkstone, Poole. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Dec 18 13:56:54 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53289 for opro ; Thu, 18 Dec 97 13:56:52 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882439799:12:12345:87; Thu, 18 Dec 97 10:09:59 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0606752; 18 Dec 97 10:09 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ae2008902; 18 Dec 97 10:09 GMT From: Richard Watkinson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 10:01:23 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971218.100123.58@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 16 Dec 97 20:23:42 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Tue 16 Dec 97 (09:01:29 +0000), peter@sdale1.demon.co.uk wrote: > Why on earth don't some of you fussy folk really read was was said > originally instead of jumping to straight keyboard? > Because the syntax and grammar prevents us! Richard firmly in tongue cheek. -- __ __ __ __ __ ___ _____________________________________________ |__||__)/ __/ \|\ ||_ | / | || \\__/\__/| \||__ | /...Internet access for all Acorn RISC machines ___________________________/ rwatki@argonet.co.uk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Dec 18 13:56:58 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53291 for opro ; Thu, 18 Dec 97 13:56:57 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882439831:06:07070:87; Thu, 18 Dec 97 10:10:31 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ac0606724; 18 Dec 97 10:09 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ad2008902; 18 Dec 97 10:08 GMT From: Jack Evans Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 09:59:30 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: OPro Error Message: ETEMPF To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971218.095930.60@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 16:14:26 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Further to my paranoid postings following attempts to install the V2.48 upgrade, all is now well. The problem seems to have been caused by the 2 new templates designed by John Ferguson and downloaded from Beebug's website in the file temp/zip. They were installed immediately before carrying out the upgrade and restoring the original versions has(?) fixed it. -- Jack Evans mailto: jack@snave.demon.co.uk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Dec 18 13:57:03 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53293 for opro ; Thu, 18 Dec 97 13:57:02 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882439846:06:07295:78; Thu, 18 Dec 97 10:10:46 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0606752; 18 Dec 97 10:10 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id af2008902; 18 Dec 97 10:09 GMT From: Chris Manning Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 10:03:36 +0000 Organization: Organisation? Er, no... Subject: Re: OPro Error Message: ETEMPF To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971218.100336.32@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 17 Dec 1997 15:32:07 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c In message <19971216.090150.08@risc.demon.co.uk> Jack Evans wrote: > However, after performing step 3 above and trying to load OP, it was back > to the ETEMPF error message again. I'm mystified. A little rummaging reveals ETEMP Template %s not found. ETEMPX Bad template tag %d but no ETEMPF. Maybe something's amiss with your templates file? Chris To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Dec 18 13:57:08 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53295 for opro ; Thu, 18 Dec 97 13:57:06 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882439914:12:12818:78; Thu, 18 Dec 97 10:11:54 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0607324; 18 Dec 97 10:11 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id al2008902; 18 Dec 97 10:10 GMT From: "D.A.Symes" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 09:56:31 +0000 Organization: Subject: Version 2.48 To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971218.095631.80@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 11:54:50 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Well the upgrade process was quite painless... I have a backup copy of Ov Pro, almost identical to the primary one, experimented on this version obviously. One problem has arisen, not particularly major... but... The graphic logo (Draw graphic), in my headed paper had become invisible. It's still there but doesn't show. Oooer Mr Mac... Cheers Dave -- _________________________________________________________________________ Dave Symes... df.symes@argonet.co.uk Phone/Fax (01202) 432 489 ...Mem...Clan Acorn... ZFC A almost B... Mem...BSFA and others... www.argonet.co.uk/users/df.symes/index.htm News and mail with the help of Pluto V 0.37g To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Dec 18 13:57:13 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53297 for opro ; Thu, 18 Dec 97 13:57:11 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882439973:06:08053:85; Thu, 18 Dec 97 10:12:53 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0607622; 18 Dec 97 10:12 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id am2008902; 18 Dec 97 10:11 GMT From: Alan Adams +44 1327 356463 Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 09:57:37 +0000 Organization: Subject: Tips and Tricks To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971218.095737.90@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 11:40:54 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Replacing pictures: I recently has occasion to alter a sprite using ChangeFSI (pre-sharpen was used) and then replace the copy in a document. Normally this would lose the scaling, rotation etc. However I discovered a way to preserve the information: Triple click the picture, to bring up the dialog box with scaling, rotation etc. Drop the sprite file over the picture - it fits the sprite to the window. Close the dialog box - it re-applies the scaling and rotation to the sprite. I don't believe the programmer intended this to happen, but it ain't half Alan Adams To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Dec 18 13:57:17 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53299 for opro ; Thu, 18 Dec 97 13:57:16 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882439994:05:02564:87; Thu, 18 Dec 97 10:13:14 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ac0607584; 18 Dec 97 10:12 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ac2008902; 18 Dec 97 10:11 GMT From: Rupert Thompson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 09:56:52 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: V2.48 To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971218.095652.60@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 13:08:51 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Tue 16 Dec, A.F. Taylor wrote: > Error: Unknown identifier get_style at line 23 in > [path].Applets.!Expand.Library.Expand > > and is then missing from the Applets list. This is because a library !RJETLib is missing from !OvnPro.Library. Lots of my applets make use of libraries called !RJETLib, !RTFile, !RTString and RTFont (note the lack of '!' in that one for the sake of inconsistency!). That's why they come "wrapped" in an installer. The easiest thing to do is to run !InstExpnd again to install all the relevant libraries. As far as I can tell, all the applets on my website work as expected with 2.48. -- Rupert Thompson Queens' College, Cambridge, CB3 9ET, UK http://rjet1.quns.cam.ac.uk/ (when my computer's on!) To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Dec 18 13:57:23 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53301 for opro ; Thu, 18 Dec 97 13:57:21 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882440006:12:13304:78; Thu, 18 Dec 97 10:13:26 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0607324; 18 Dec 97 10:12 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id an2008902; 18 Dec 97 10:11 GMT From: Alan Adams +44 1327 356463 Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 09:58:00 +0000 Organization: Subject: RE: Auto-linked frames To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971218.095800.39@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 11:23:50 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I had trouble getting frames to link between pages. I eventually tracked it down (I think) to the difference between the default master page and an edited master page. If you use the new document option from the iconbar menu, and select two columns etc, the two column frames will link automatically. If you just left-click on the icon, then use edit master page, and change the columns to two, they won't link. On a related topic, I have a problem with a large newsletter, set up with facing pages for pamphlet printing. The footer space on the two master pages is different, and I cannot find a way to alter it, other than creating a new document and importing the newsletter. I am wary of doing that because I suspect there will be subtle differences, and a lot of editing to do. Alan Adams To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Dec 18 13:57:27 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53303 for opro ; Thu, 18 Dec 97 13:57:26 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882440020:05:02785:78; Thu, 18 Dec 97 10:13:40 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0608043; 18 Dec 97 10:13 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ao2008902; 18 Dec 97 10:12 GMT From: Richard Watkinson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 10:00:59 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Version 2.48 To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971218.100059.76@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 16 Dec 97 20:21:18 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Tue 16 Dec 97 (09:00:49 +0000), polak@nlr.nl wrote: > If I click on the new button "Go to Ovation Pro WWW site" in the info > window > from the iconbar menu, I get a system crash, needing a hard reset! > I too seem have tried clicking here and get the enigmatic message "File 'wibble' not found". No system crash but interesting in its own right. I've not played with 2.48 all that much so no real opportunities for it to go wrong. No problems downloading or upgrading other than forgaetting to copy !ovresdir, library and then upgrade the applets !macros and stuff from my original configuration. Richard -- __ __ __ __ __ ___ _____________________________________________ |__||__)/ __/ \|\ ||_ | / | || \\__/\__/| \||__ | /...Internet access for all Acorn RISC machines ___________________________/ rwatki@argonet.co.uk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Dec 18 13:57:33 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53305 for opro ; Thu, 18 Dec 97 13:57:32 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882440090:05:03127:80; Thu, 18 Dec 97 10:14:50 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0608822; 18 Dec 97 10:14 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ba2008902; 18 Dec 97 10:13 GMT From: "Graphite (in" MMDF-Warning: Parse error in original version of preceding line at post.mail.demon.net Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 09:58:23 +0000 Organization: Subject: OvnPro 2.48 - oops, bug :( To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971218.095823.97@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 11:45:57 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Firstly, congrats on the release of 2.48 and the work that has obviously gone into it. This is very much appreciated :) David Pilling wrote: > > Early days yet, but we are getting there, and Ian is to be commended > > for his efforts so far. Absolutely, very good and very easy to do :) No problems with this bit ;) OK then, a bug, I'm sorry :( There seems to be a major redraw bug for frames containing pictures in documents created in previous versions. I have a number of 'handout' type documents with pictures in various places and almost all redraw very poorly or don't appear at all! This is, so far, 100% repeatable. If the file is saved out as DDL and then reloaded and saved as OPro then all is fine! This on a StrongArm with the new Clan boot structure. Can anyone else confirm this before I try a couple of reinstalls and a full bug report? Apart from that, excellent, keep up the good work! Richard -- richard@graphitedesign.co.uk _______________________________________________________________________ Graphite Design & Presentation http://www.graphitedesign.co.uk/ Information enquiries@graphitedesign.co.uk Sales sales@graphitedesign.co.uk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Dec 18 13:57:39 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53307 for opro ; Thu, 18 Dec 97 13:57:37 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882440146:05:03368:78; Thu, 18 Dec 97 10:15:46 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0608735; 18 Dec 97 10:14 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id az2008902; 18 Dec 97 10:13 GMT From: Alan Adams +44 1327 356463 Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 09:57:14 +0000 Organization: Subject: How do I remove unreferenced font references? To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971218.095714.94@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 11:37:30 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I have a document which has been revised over a long period of time. I have changed the font associated with some styles, and I no longer initialist the old font on the system. Evert time I launch the document, OPro announces the absense of the font. Each time I tell it to replace permanently, and save the document. I eventually stopped the problem by savind as DDL, editing the DDL, and removing the line containing the font name. Reloading the DDL file and saving produces a document which doesn't give me the error message. However, this route gave me some other problems. I was using an ISV font, GYLES.SANS.BLACK.OUTLINE I think, and it was shown without OUTLINE. I reset the font name and fixed that. One line of text had two characters set to a different point size and vertical offset. This was lost. In this case, fixing it wasn't too difficult, but I would hate to have to do this with something complex, and then have to spot all the differences. So, is there a better way to remove references to fonts no longer used in the document? Alan Adams To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Dec 18 13:57:47 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53309 for opro ; Thu, 18 Dec 97 13:57:45 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882440172:06:09472:79; Thu, 18 Dec 97 10:16:12 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0609147; 18 Dec 97 10:15 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id bc2008902; 18 Dec 97 10:14 GMT From: Alan Adams +44 1327 356463 Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 09:59:09 +0000 Organization: Subject: Text flow problem in linked frames To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971218.095909.92@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 11:40:54 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c While working on a newsletter of 20 pages, I had a problem on three occasions. I am running OPro 2.46 on StrongARM. I am not running the beta desktop. There is a section of about 5 pages with an article running through it, and interspersed with about a dozen photographs. The text frames were all created manually, i.e. not using the master pages, and linked manually, running in logical order, i.e. not skipping pages or jumping backwards. Most of the frames are two-column. On three occasions I noticed that text in one of the later frames, not always the same one, was spilling out on the right hand side, and even being displayed across from the left page to the right page. Text was missing where this frame linked to the following one. Printing the pages also showed missing text. I cured it by deleting the links above this page and re-creating them. I think, but I am not certain, that the one necessary step is to delete the link into the faulty frame and re-create it. Alan Adams To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Dec 18 13:57:52 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53311 for opro ; Thu, 18 Dec 97 13:57:51 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882440173:06:09492:79; Thu, 18 Dec 97 10:16:13 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0608043; 18 Dec 97 10:15 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id bb2008902; 18 Dec 97 10:14 GMT From: Liam Gretton Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 09:58:46 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Equation Applet? To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971218.095846.25@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 12:36:41 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Fri 21 Nov, Richard Partridge wrote: > Easiwriter / Techwriter does export text as a Draw file; I've just checked > it. Having selected "Save area as Draw file" you just drag a border round > the bit you want to save. Is this only in recent versions, perhaps? Sorry to come into this discussion so late (computer's been up the spout for nearly a month and pine doesn't let me read this particular list because of the way I've set up filtering etc etc), but such a feature would be *so* useful in OP. I've seen this save-as-drawfile in action in TechWriter and it can be used to solve file translation problems at a stroke. -- Liam Gretton ljg@star.le.ac.uk CCD Group, X-Ray Astronomy Dept, liam@binliner.demon.co.uk Leicester University phone +44 (0) 116 252 3501 Leicester LE1 7RH, UK fax +44 (0) 116 252 3311 To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Dec 18 13:57:58 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53313 for opro ; Thu, 18 Dec 97 13:57:56 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882440205:06:09877:79; Thu, 18 Dec 97 10:16:45 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0609443; 18 Dec 97 10:16 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id be2008902; 18 Dec 97 10:15 GMT From: Dr A G Gray Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 10:00:37 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Non-effects with ligatures To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971218.100037.10@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 16 Dec 97 14:06:07 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Tue 16 Dec 97 (08:59:47 +0000), rayd@argonet.co.uk wrote: =8C.following my complaint of un-italicised ligatures: >I have OP 2.46 and !Ligatures 1.02 and it correctly italicises the >front ligature. Same here... >I just typed a sentence including fifth, italicised it and then went to >Ligatures..Add ligatures and it ligatured the fi in italics Ok. 1. Type 'the fifth word' 2. Click on 'Remove ligatures' in the Applets - Ligatures menu. 3. Double-click on 'fifth', then the italicise icon. 4. Click on 'Add ligatures' in the Applets -Ligatures menu. 5. Voila: upright fi-ligature and italic fth. In fact this caught me out when I copied a long document into a pamphlet-fo= rmat template and then found ligatures weren't set. When I then added ligat= ures, I found the above fault and had to do a manual search :-( -- Alan.Gray@argonet.co.uk Dr A.G.Gray. Great Warley, Essex. UK http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/alan.gray N 51 33'58" E 00 17'35" G3XQU (DXCC=3D323/328) Acorn RiscPC S/A 202MHz To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Dec 18 13:58:03 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53315 for opro ; Thu, 18 Dec 97 13:58:02 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882440249:06:10021:79; Thu, 18 Dec 97 10:17:29 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0609485; 18 Dec 97 10:16 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id bd2008902; 18 Dec 97 10:14 GMT From: Martin Tillman Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 10:00:15 +0000 Organization: Subject: OP 2.48 (was Re: Various) To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971218.100015.69@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 00:16:56 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c In message <19971215.091108.73@risc.demon.co.uk> David Pilling wrote: [snip] > Exciting News > ------------- > Like to download OPro 2.48? Then fill in this questionaire... > How do you feel about reformatting your hard disc? > (a) An interesting and challenging experience. > (b) AAAAAAAAAAaaaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrggggggghhhhhhhh! > (c) What's a hard disc? Got to be 'a'. I've reformatted my several hard disks, the main IDE in particular, more times in the last month than anyone here has had hot dinners. (Thanks A********, but real thanks to Clare's). > Installing the Acorn Clan Beta CD ROM was; > (a) easy > (b) took me three weeks > (c) I can't get it out of the packet Oh! Another 'a'. In my sleep, mate! (ish). I've even removed all the 'hooks' and found the one that you really can't remove... Done the same on the A3000 too :-). (Solid drags don't work anymore on that m/c, though :-( ). > All (a)'s and you qualify. Mmmmm... -- m. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Dec 18 13:58:13 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53317 for opro ; Thu, 18 Dec 97 13:58:10 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882440251:06:10051:78; Thu, 18 Dec 97 10:17:31 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0609614; 18 Dec 97 10:16 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aj2008902; 18 Dec 97 10:15 GMT From: Richard Watkinson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 10:01:46 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: V2.48 To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971218.100146.44@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 16 Dec 97 23:35:28 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Now that I have played with 1.28 for a while I seem to have come across a serious problem - or else have messed up somewhere in the installation process. OvPro 1.29 doesn't seem to be able to handle imported graphics correctly. When dragged into a frame it 'blinks' but remains blank. Clicking on Fit has some effect but the image soon disappears again - as it also does when using the colour supplement. I tried loading an old document created in 1.26 and this seemed ok even when a new frame was drawn. I could even import pictures into it BUT if a new document was opened and a picture frame copied from the old document to the new then the picture disappeared. After much messing about it seems that 1.28 cannot cope with creating its own picture frames the way I have installed it but is quite happy with frames created in 1.26. Richard -- __ __ __ __ __ ___ _____________________________________________ |__||__)/ __/ \|\ ||_ | / | || \\__/\__/| \||__ | /...Internet access for all Acorn RISC machines ___________________________/ rwatki@argonet.co.uk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Dec 18 13:58:18 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53319 for opro ; Thu, 18 Dec 97 13:58:16 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882440256:12:14388:79; Thu, 18 Dec 97 10:17:36 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0609856; 18 Dec 97 10:16 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id bg2008902; 18 Dec 97 10:16 GMT From: Steven Pampling Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 10:02:29 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Version 2.48 To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971218.100229.53@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 23:48:28 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c F.R. Polak wrote: > > > This new upgrade procedure is a breeze! Agreed. Not sure it could be easier!!! > This is a good way to easily istribute upgrades with minimal extra > costs, keeping the registration umber, etc. intact. quick test > produced only one error sofar :-) f I click on the new button "Go > to Ovation Pro WWW site" in the info window from the iconbar > menu, I get a system crash, needing a hard reset! Ah, you have "button-pushitis as well... :-) yeah, crashes for me too. > For your information, I did install the Acorn Clan Beta CD ROM and > its successive upgrades without serious problems so far, so I am > using the new (beta) window manager (3.97) and the latest Toolbox > modules that come with it. Yup. > Any ideas? A feature looking for the ANT internet suite? * SteveP -- steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk or camra@argonet.co.uk for CAMRA items ZFC A * "Cracking Toast Grommit" - Wallace * * "Cracking Real Ale Grommit" - Wallace's brother * To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Dec 18 13:58:24 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53321 for opro ; Thu, 18 Dec 97 13:58:22 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882440263:05:03864:78; Thu, 18 Dec 97 10:17:43 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0609697; 18 Dec 97 10:17 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id bf2008902; 18 Dec 97 10:15 GMT From: Peter Blenkinsop Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 10:02:08 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Linked frames To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971218.100208.50@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 17 Dec 1997 06:36:19 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Ray Dawson wrote: > Peter Blenkinsop wrote: > > Is it possible to link frames so that when I insert a new page the last > > frame in the previous page is linked to the first frame in the new page? > But it already does if you have single or multiple columns on the master > page. Page..Insert page..After puts a page after the current page and > clicking on the link tool shows the last column of the current page > linking to the first column of the new page. > Ray D Yes, I know that but if I have a set of, say, three frames defined in a master page then after inserting a new page I want the third frame on page 1 to be linked to frame 1 on the new page. How do I do that, please? -- This is my signature using Pluto Contained in the last character of this line is the secret of the universe. Rats!! I've run out of space for the last character. Peter Blenkinsop To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Dec 18 13:58:30 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53323 for opro ; Thu, 18 Dec 97 13:58:28 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882440353:05:04082:78; Thu, 18 Dec 97 10:19:13 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0610180; 18 Dec 97 10:18 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id bj2008902; 18 Dec 97 10:17 GMT From: Nick Kaijaks Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 09:56:10 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: V2.48 To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971218.095610.27@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 16 Dec 1997 09:58:43 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Nice one Ian (and, of course, David)! This looks fantastic. No problems with the upgrade procedure (apart from noting the options should be 1,3,4, not 1,2,4!). There are some really useful improvements as well as the odd bug-fixes. I'm Impressed ;-) A couple of comments: - I got a "Wibble not found" message from the link to the OPro website in the info box ;-) More fun than a crash! - The prepress applet mentioned in the readme file isn't there. - Couldn't the !Upgrade program make a backup for you automatically? Then you wouldn't have to do the fresh install, upgrade, copy with force, then manually copy library files, applets, macros, button bars, dictionaries, etc etc. I realise that it's safer (from a crash-test point of view) to go from a vanilla install, but that could be a pain to do for the 17th time when we're on OPro v7.42 ;-) - Italicise still doesn't work properly . That's the only thing I'm disappointed not to see :-( Still, I'm *very* glad to be able to upgrade so quickly. I still remember how frustrating it was listening to everyone on the list commenting on how great the Colour Supplement was while I waited in the queue! A.F. Taylor wrote: > Error: Unknown identifier get_style at line 23 in > [path].Applets.!Expand.Library.Expand You need to copy Rupert Thompson's library files from your old copy of OPro (the files starting RJET... or RT...). TTFN, Nick -- nick kaijaks; proprietor, pinxit design - putting the solution together and; research student, physics, university of warwick, coventry cv4 7al http://www.warwick.ac.uk/Nick.Kaijaks/ mailto:Nick.Kaijaks@warwick.ac.uk Disclaimer: caveat internettor To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Dec 18 13:58:35 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53325 for opro ; Thu, 18 Dec 97 13:58:33 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882440362:06:10692:82; Thu, 18 Dec 97 10:19:22 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0610001; 18 Dec 97 10:17 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aa2008902; 18 Dec 97 10:16 GMT From: Joyce Burton Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 10:03:12 +0000 Organization: Subject: Labels To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971218.100312.25@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Wed, 17 Dec 97 19:03:00 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I am having some difficulty in using the labels applet in conjunction with the mail merge facility. I want to print names and addresses on labels and have found the correct template which contains in the first label and in the second etc. I have created a CSV file of names addresses with six fields for each record. If I merge this with the template one field is printed on each label. I then created a new template with on a new line on each label but when I used this, although it printed the name and address correctly on the label, it printed the same name and address on every label on the sheet-using only one record for each full sheet of labels. Can somebody please tell me what I am doing wrong and what I need to alter? I should also like to know whether it is possible to print the page of labels to the screen before printing them out as my mistakes are causing the printer to churn out masses of waste paper. Any help will be gratefully received. Joyce Burton -- __ __ __ __ __ ___ _____________________________________________ |__||__)/ __/ \|\ ||_ | / | || \\__/\__/| \||__ | /...Internet access for all Acorn RISC machines ___________________________/ jaybee@argonet.co.uk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Dec 18 13:58:43 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53327 for opro ; Thu, 18 Dec 97 13:58:39 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882440371:06:10855:78; Thu, 18 Dec 97 10:19:31 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0610542; 18 Dec 97 10:18 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id bk2008902; 18 Dec 97 10:17 GMT From: David Pilling Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 09:55:46 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971218.095546.45@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 15 Dec 97 22:23:32 GMT X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c >Since sending the above I have reinstalled the V2.48 upgrade from scratch >and got it running for a while. >1. Numbered para 1 of !!ReadMe surely should read 'tick the first, *third* >and fourth options'? Correct. >2. What should be done about the Extensions dir in the upgrade sparkfile? >3. Having a vague idea that there was a directory of this name in OP >originally which was phased out in favour of 'Applets', I copied the >Applets dir across from my old V2.46 version and added the new/upgrade >applets from Extensions to it. No, no, no. The Extensions directory is merely somewhere to store new/replacement applets. They should be copied into the applets directory in the new version of OPro. Applets are probably the main problem with the upgrade as it stands. Firstly you need a new ColourSupplement applet and it's not on the 'net yet. Secondly you've got to work out a strategy for copying applets across from the old program. Some i.e. ArtWorks must be replaced by new versions as just mentioned. All of the Beebug supplied ones should be safe to just copy over. Finally some third party ones which use an installer program should be installed as from scratch. From: Ian Scott >Perhaps it might have been useful to tell us poor 2.45 owners that the >upgrade can only be used with 2.46, according to the ReadMe file which can >only be read AFAICS once the upgrade has been downloaded .. :-( Yes I'm sorry that was something I should have done. I believed that there were hardly any 2.45 users out there. I don't know what is planned for you, maybe a disc based upgrade to 2.46. From: "F.R. Polak" >If I click on the new button "Go to Ovation Pro WWW site" in the info window >from the iconbar menu, I get a system crash, needing a hard reset! Alleged (by me) to be a problem with wimp 3.97 - Clan CD etc. From: Alf Chamings >Thanks, Ray (and DP) it was the applets after all. I remembered as soon as I >had a look in the applets directory that I had downloaded the (intriguing) >fog applet into the applets directory and forgotten to decompress it. This >must have been the cause because the problem disappeared as soon as I removed >it. Anything put in the applets directory gets run sooner or later. David Pilling To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Thu Dec 18 13:58:53 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53330 for opro ; Thu, 18 Dec 97 13:58:51 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882442327:05:12498:78; Thu, 18 Dec 97 10:52:07 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0624512; 18 Dec 97 10:51 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ah2008902; 18 Dec 97 10:17 GMT From: "Howe , Chris" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 09:59:54 +0000 Organization: Subject: RE: V2.48 To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971218.095954.48@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: 17 Dec 97 12:43:00 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c David, Ian the 2.48 download was quite easy to install, I thought. No probs but a little bug in use (below). The list of corrections and improvements is quite long! I'd be interested to hear if anybody posts an applet etc to help improve mail merging, e.g using the hooks provided by you. Maybe the !!readme could be enriched a bit for the less experienced, e.g explain what dragging the one application on top of the other is supposed to do, and when the Installer util is finished say 'you can now dismiss it, it has done its work'. A couple of applets were maybe mentioned that were not in the pack. I had Drop Caps (2 units in LondonA), and they are now correctly positioned. Actually a couple were still a bit off, but I threatened them by rubbing out and reinstating, and all is well. Unfortunately I have a long local frame making a horizontal leafy decoration at the bottom of the page, and the draw file typically is not rendered at all on screen (A5000). Dragging the frame from side to side coaches reluctantly it into a partial re-draw, pressing fit to frame does make it appear on screen. It's grab handles can come up without the graphic! This didn't happen on 2.46,,, So, where do I send the money! Chris Howe Bath > > Like to download OPro 2.48? Then fill in this questionaire... > > Seriously there is an upgrade kit on the www.beebug.com site. Probably > only for those of an adventurous disposition at the moment. > To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Dec 19 13:54:46 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53426 for opro ; Fri, 19 Dec 97 13:54:44 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882534107:06:16705:80; Fri, 19 Dec 97 12:21:47 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0616429; 19 Dec 97 12:21 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ae2016031; 19 Dec 97 12:20 GMT From: "A.F. Taylor" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 19 Dec 1997 09:59:23 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: V2.48 To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971219.095923.77@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 19:43:47 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c > on Thu 18 Dec, Rupert Thompson wrote: > On Tue 16 Dec, A.F. Taylor wrote: > > > Error: Unknown identifier get_style at line 23 in > > [path].Applets.!Expand.Library.Expand > > > This is because a library !RJETLib is missing from !OvnPro.Library. snip > The easiest thing to do is to run !InstExpnd again to install all > the relevant libraries. > Oops, sorry, I forgot that! Now working OK. Thanks also to Nick Kaijaks who also pointed it out. Regards, -- Arthur Taylor, Parkstone, Poole. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Dec 19 13:54:50 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53428 for opro ; Fri, 19 Dec 97 13:54:49 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882534139:05:10785:80; Fri, 19 Dec 97 12:22:19 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0615631; 19 Dec 97 12:21 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id af2016031; 19 Dec 97 12:21 GMT From: Ian MacDougall Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 19 Dec 1997 10:00:30 +0000 Organization: Beebug Ltd Subject: Binary postings To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971219.100030.09@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 19 Dec 1997 09:51:43 +0100 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c You'll notice an article in this batch that talks about an attachment, I deleted it before you all got it. Please do not post binaries to the list, tell people where to get things rather than expect everyone to want what you are sending. For those who don't know there is a link to the program on our WWW site: http://www.beebug.com/ -- Ian MacDougall Beebug Ltd To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Dec 19 13:54:57 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53431 for opro ; Fri, 19 Dec 97 13:54:56 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882534206:12:06774:79; Fri, 19 Dec 97 12:23:26 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0617020; 19 Dec 97 12:22 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id am2016031; 19 Dec 97 12:21 GMT From: Dr A G Gray Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 19 Dec 1997 09:56:17 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Labels To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971219.095617.55@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 18 Dec 97 15:31:37 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Thu 18 Dec 97 (10:03:12 +0000), jaybee@argonet.co.uk wrote: > >I should also like to know whether it is possible to print the page of >labels to the screen before printing them out as my mistakes are >causing the printer to churn out masses of waste paper. >Any help will be gratefully received. >Joyce Burton May I recommend !ArcFax, available from an author not unadjacent to Ovation's author ;-) You can then print away to your heart's content and look at the FAXes without sending them and wasting paper... -- Alan.Gray@argonet.co.uk Dr A.G.Gray. Great Warley, Essex. UK http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/alan.gray N 51 33'58" E 00 17'35" G3XQU (DXCC=323/328) Acorn RiscPC S/A 202MHz To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Dec 19 13:55:02 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53433 for opro ; Fri, 19 Dec 97 13:55:00 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882534229:12:06873:80; Fri, 19 Dec 97 12:23:49 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0617394; 19 Dec 97 12:23 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id an2016031; 19 Dec 97 12:22 GMT From: Jack Evans Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 19 Dec 1997 09:56:37 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: OPro Error Message: ETEMPF To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971219.095637.81@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 12:05:00 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Chris Manning wrote: > In message <19971216.090150.08@risc.demon.co.uk> > Jack Evans wrote: > > However, after performing step 3 above and trying to load OP, it was back > > to the ETEMPF error message again. I'm mystified. > A little rummaging reveals > ETEMP Template %s not found. > ETEMPX Bad template tag %d > but no ETEMPF. Maybe something's amiss with your templates file? Thanks Chris. Your comment confirms my mistake - I transferred the new files across without changing their names - TemplatesO and TemplatesC - to plain Templates. Obvious, really! > To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk > with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l > To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l -- Jack Evans mailto: jack@snave.demon.co.uk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Dec 19 13:55:08 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53435 for opro ; Fri, 19 Dec 97 13:55:05 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882534305:06:17663:79; Fri, 19 Dec 97 12:25:05 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0617370; 19 Dec 97 12:23 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ao2016031; 19 Dec 97 12:22 GMT From: Ray Dawson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 19 Dec 1997 09:56:58 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Non-effects with ligatures To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971219.095658.46@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 16:25:29 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Dr A G Gray wrote: > 1. Type 'the fifth word' > 2. Click on 'Remove ligatures' in the Applets - Ligatures menu. > 3. Double-click on 'fifth', then the italicise icon. > 4. Click on 'Add ligatures' in the Applets -Ligatures menu. > 5. Voila: upright fi-ligature and italic fth. Yup, I agree with you on that - the front ligature is not italicised. Version 2.48 and !Ligatures 1.02 Ray D -- ..===================================. | M a g R a y Document Services | Ray Dawson Tel: 0181 864 7208 | the print and braille specialists | rayd@argonet.co.uk '===================================' http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/rayd To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Dec 19 13:55:13 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53437 for opro ; Fri, 19 Dec 97 13:55:12 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882534351:05:11470:83; Fri, 19 Dec 97 12:25:51 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0617717; 19 Dec 97 12:24 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aq2016031; 19 Dec 97 12:23 GMT From: David Broster Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 19 Dec 1997 09:58:19 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: OvnPro 2.48 - oops, bug :( To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971219.095819.88@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 17:07:29 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Thu 18 Dec, Graphite (in wrote: > > OK then, a bug, I'm sorry :( > There seems to be a major redraw bug for frames containing pictures in documents ... > This on a StrongArm with the new Clan boot structure. Can anyone else > confirm this before I try a couple of reinstalls and a full bug report? > Yes, I can confirm that I have the same problem. One interesting point is that if you narrow the window horizontally and open it out again slowly the picture redraws perfectly - but not if you try it vertically! David -- from David Broster ************************************************* * E-mail to mrb@davbros.demon.co.uk * ******************************************************************** To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Dec 19 13:55:15 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53438 for opro ; Fri, 19 Dec 97 13:55:14 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882534351:12:07265:83; Fri, 19 Dec 97 12:25:51 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ae0617020; 19 Dec 97 12:25 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ap2016031; 19 Dec 97 12:23 GMT From: Ray Dawson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 19 Dec 1997 09:57:58 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971219.095758.18@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 16:42:27 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c David Pilling wrote: > >If I click on the new button "Go to Ovation Pro WWW site" in the > >info window from the iconbar menu, I get a system crash, needing > >a hard reset! > Alleged (by me) to be a problem with wimp 3.97 - Clan CD etc. I have SA, wimp 3.97 and Clan !Boot and all I get is 'File wibble not found' when I click on the WWW site button. Ray D -- ..===================================. | M a g R a y Document Services | Ray Dawson Tel: 0181 864 7208 | the print and braille specialists | rayd@argonet.co.uk '===================================' http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/rayd To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Dec 19 13:55:19 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53440 for opro ; Fri, 19 Dec 97 13:55:18 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882534360:12:07415:79; Fri, 19 Dec 97 12:26:00 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0617394; 19 Dec 97 12:25 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ar2016031; 19 Dec 97 12:24 GMT From: Steven Pampling Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 19 Dec 1997 09:59:44 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971219.095944.62@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 19 Dec 1997 02:46:50 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c David Pilling wrote: > >If I click on the new button "Go to Ovation Pro WWW site" in the > >info window from the iconbar menu, I get a system crash, needing > >a hard reset! > Alleged (by me) to be a problem with wimp 3.97 - Clan CD etc. Also crashes with the wimp 3.96 - so maybe it's an incompatability problem with nested window manager overall? * SteveP -- steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk or camra@argonet.co.uk for CAMRA items ZFC A * "Cracking Toast Grommit" - Wallace * * "Cracking Real Ale Grommit" - Wallace's brother * To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Dec 19 13:55:28 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53442 for opro ; Fri, 19 Dec 97 13:55:27 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882534419:05:11872:80; Fri, 19 Dec 97 12:26:59 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ac0618437; 19 Dec 97 12:26 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ba2016031; 19 Dec 97 12:25 GMT From: John Woodthorpe Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 19 Dec 1997 09:55:36 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: V2.48 To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971219.095536.05@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 13:53:59 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c --------------------------------------- >From: Nick Kaijaks >Subject: Re: V2.48 >Date: 18/12/1997 11:29:39 am --------------------------------------- .... >Still, I'm *very* glad to be able to upgrade so quickly. I still >remember how frustrating it was listening to everyone on the list >commenting on how great the Colour Supplement was while I waited i>n the queue! Yes, well! I'm sure those of us with 2.45, and hence unable to upgrade ATM= greatly appreciate your restraint in that :o) Still, we were the first to get the Colour Supplement upgrade, so I suppose= we should pay for that by being the last to get this one installed. It's= just frustrating *having* the upgrade, but not being able to use it! I wonder what would happen if I did try it... Enjoy your Christmas, everyone playing with 2.48. Regards, John Woodthorpe --=20 31 Weston Close, Dunchurch, Rugby, Warwickshire= To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Dec 19 13:55:34 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53444 for opro ; Fri, 19 Dec 97 13:55:33 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882534451:12:07782:78; Fri, 19 Dec 97 12:27:31 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0618751; 19 Dec 97 12:27 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id bc2016031; 19 Dec 97 12:26 GMT From: Ray Dawson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 19 Dec 1997 09:57:18 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: OvnPro 2.48 - oops, bug :( To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971219.095718.25@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 16:29:31 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Graphite (in wrote: > documents created in previous versions. > I have a number of 'handout' type documents with pictures in various > places and almost all redraw very poorly or don't appear at all! This > is, so far, 100% repeatable. If the file is saved out as DDL and then > reloaded and saved as OPro then all is fine! > This on a StrongArm with the new Clan boot structure. Can anyone else > confirm this before I try a couple of reinstalls and a full bug report? I've just tried this on some muliti-picture leaflets made with 2.46 and found no problem with them in 2.48. I also have SA with the new Clan !Boot and window manager 3.97. Ray D -- ..===================================. | M a g R a y Document Services | Ray Dawson Tel: 0181 864 7208 | the print and braille specialists | rayd@argonet.co.uk '===================================' http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/rayd To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Dec 19 13:55:39 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53446 for opro ; Fri, 19 Dec 97 13:55:38 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882534461:05:11973:78; Fri, 19 Dec 97 12:27:41 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0618608; 19 Dec 97 12:27 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id bb2016031; 19 Dec 97 12:25 GMT From: David J Fairweather Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 19 Dec 1997 09:55:57 +0000 Organization: Subject: Ovation Pro upgrade To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971219.095557.26@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 15:49:28 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I have Ovation Pro 2.45. I understand that there is an upgrade somewhere on the Beebug web site. Where? However from some of the e-mails I have seen, I understand that this is for 2.46 users only - as 'there weren't many out there!' - One of the fixes that David has written into the latest version was for me as the Logo of my company is circular and there was a problem rendering Bezier curves. Are you making any provision for us poor 'few' souls with 2.45 to get upgraded? Thank you Dave F. -- -- David J Fairweather - Director of Operations, Europe. davef@cbslontd.demon.uk Snail to: CBS News 68 Knightsbridge Bowater House (0171-887-3000) London SW1X 7LL ------------------------------------------------------------------------- The views expressed here are personal and do not represent the views or opinions of Westinghouse, CBS News or any other Division of CBS. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Dec 19 13:55:44 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53448 for opro ; Fri, 19 Dec 97 13:55:42 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882534527:05:12168:78; Fri, 19 Dec 97 12:28:47 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0618972; 19 Dec 97 12:27 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id bd2016031; 19 Dec 97 12:26 GMT From: Ray Dawson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 19 Dec 1997 09:57:38 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Linked frames To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971219.095738.42@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 16:22:45 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Peter Blenkinsop wrote: > > But it already does if you have single or multiple columns on > > the master page. Page..Insert page..After puts a page after the > > current page and clicking on the link tool shows the last column > > of the current page linking to the first column of the new page. > > Ray D > Yes, I know that but if I have a set of, say, three frames defined > in a master page then after inserting a new page I want the third > frame on page 1 to be linked to frame 1 on the new page. How do I > do that, please? On the master page, link Frame 1- Frame 2- Frame 3- Frame 1. This will make text from Frame 3 link to Frame 1 in the next page. I've just tried it and if you add a page after the first page, then the text from Frame 3 on page 1 flows into Frame 1 on the new page 2. Ray D -- ..===================================. | M a g R a y Document Services | Ray Dawson Tel: 0181 864 7208 | the print and braille specialists | rayd@argonet.co.uk '===================================' http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/rayd To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Dec 19 13:55:49 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53450 for opro ; Fri, 19 Dec 97 13:55:47 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882534554:06:19788:80; Fri, 19 Dec 97 12:29:14 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0619149; 19 Dec 97 12:28 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id be2016031; 19 Dec 97 12:27 GMT From: "T.C.Ellison" Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 19 Dec 1997 09:58:41 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Labels To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971219.095841.32@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 18 Dec 1997 17:25:12 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Thu 18 Dec, Joyce Burton wrote: > I am having some difficulty in using the labels applet in conjunction with the > mail merge facility. I want to print names and addresses on labels and have > found the correct template which contains in the first label and > in the second etc. I have created a CSV file of names addresses with > six fields for each record. If I merge this with the template one field is > printed on each label. I then created a new template with on > a new line on each label but when I used this, although it printed the name and > address correctly on the label, it printed the same name and address on every > label on the sheet-using only one record for each full sheet of labels. > Can somebody please tell me what I am doing wrong and what I need to alter? > > I should also like to know whether it is possible to print the page of labels > to the screen before printing them out as my mistakes are causing the printer > to churn out masses of waste paper. > Any help will be gratefully received. > Joyce Burton > -- Joyce Try using CSVEdit (Attached) I found it does the job very well Regards Tom -- tom.sandal@argonet.co.uk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Dec 19 13:55:54 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53452 for opro ; Fri, 19 Dec 97 13:55:52 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882534563:06:20032:78; Fri, 19 Dec 97 12:29:23 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0619514; 19 Dec 97 12:29 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id bf2016031; 19 Dec 97 12:27 GMT From: Ian MacDougall Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 19 Dec 1997 10:00:06 +0000 Organization: Beebug Ltd Subject: 2.45 owners To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971219.100006.86@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 19 Dec 1997 09:35:21 +0100 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c This is how things will have to work for 2.45 owners: You either: a) return your original Program disc 1 and 2 along with a stamped addressed hard back envelope suitable for us to return you two discs. These will be 2.46 and can be installed and then you can install the patch on top. Address your envelope 2.45 to 2.46 upgrade. or: b) wait 'til we have 2.48 on disc to sell to people, don't ask me when this will happen because I don't know. You should also note that this release is just a test of the upgrading system, the application you are installing has not been fully tested (that is why there is no 2.48 on disc). It is also why I put the archive up unlinked from any page on the WWW site. We appreciate feedback about the system, but you cannot expect our first line support people here to answer questions about the upgrade. Please send us your comments here or via email to ian@beebug.co.uk -- Ian MacDougall Beebug Ltd To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Fri Dec 19 13:56:05 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53454 for opro ; Fri, 19 Dec 97 13:56:02 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882534658:06:20215:79; Fri, 19 Dec 97 12:30:58 GMT Received: from post-20.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.27]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0619652; 19 Dec 97 12:29 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id bh2016031; 19 Dec 97 12:28 GMT From: David Pilling Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Fri, 19 Dec 1997 09:59:02 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971219.095902.70@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Thu, 18 Dec 97 17:34:41 GMT X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c From: "D.A.Symes" From: "Graphite (in" From: Richard Watkinson From: "Howe , Chris" > redraw problems... All this sounds like very bad news. My hope is that you've either copied across your old ColourSupplement applet. You should not! Or that you have documents which use the Coloup Supplement features like image processing, but your new copy does not have it installed - which it won't by default. Given a fair wind I may have an upgrade kit for the colour supplement on the web pages tomorrow night. Bottom line 2.48 needs a new colour supplement, and you don't have it yet. I will also put the missing PrePress applet on the web pages today or tomorrow. A couple of other bits of admin, Ian has decided he wants to spend Christmas with his family, so no mailling list updates and presumeably no other high level OPro support from 23.12.97 till 5.1.98. I'd like to put up a page of 'resources' on the web site. What I'm thinking of is people who can take OPro documents and print them, produce books, posters etc. etc. So brief details of what you do, links to web sites etc. to my email address below. I'll accept other stuff, like magazines which use OPro, or anyone who is running DTP courses using it. From: Alan Adams +44 1327 356463 >If you use the new document option from the iconbar menu, and select two >columns etc, the two column frames will link automatically. >If you just left-click on the icon, then use edit master page, and change the >columns to two, they won't link. I doubt that. Columns are not explicitly linked. I guess in Impression to get columns you link frames. In OPro frames have columns built into them. There is no linking between the columns in a frame. A frame is just a 2 or more column frame. >On a related topic, I have a problem with a large newsletter, set up with >facing pages for pamphlet printing. The footer space on the two master pages >is different, and I cannot find a way to alter it, other than creating a new >document and importing the newsletter. I am wary of doing that because I >suspect there will be subtle differences, and a lot of editing to do. Edit Master pages, page guidelines... From: Richard Watkinson >I too seem have tried clicking here and get the enigmatic message "File >'wibble' not found". No system crash but interesting in its own right. There seems to be a problem with filer_run on the new wimp (from C), and this I'm sorry to have to admit was part of the debuging process. Thats the only 2.48 bug I know about - so far 8-) From: Alan Adams +44 1327 356463 >I have a document which has been revised over a long period of time. I have >changed the font associated with some styles, and I no longer initialist the >old font on the system. Evert time I launch the document, OPro announces the >absense of the font. Each time I tell it to replace permanently, and save the >document. This is of course a bug. As things stand the fix is what you've done, save as DDL, and hack out the incorrect references. >On three occasions I noticed that text in one of the later frames, not always >the same one, was spilling out on the right hand side, and even being >displayed across from the left page to the right page. Text was missing where >this frame linked to the following one. In the jargon, 'flow problems', text that has not been correctly flowed. The fix is to move a frame temporarily over the misflowed area, or to make some trivial style change that will force a complete reflow. Sometimes judt bashing in a couple of returns and deleting them, will fix things. From: Liam Gretton >the way I've set up filtering etc etc), but such a feature would be *so* >useful in OP. I've seen this save-as-drawfile in action in TechWriter and it >can be used to solve file translation problems at a stroke. As long as you agree to sign an agreement promising not to whinge endlessly because it doesn't work with clipping paths, ArtWorks files, etc. etc. From: Martin Tillman >Got to be 'a'. Show off. I got all (b)'s... From: Peter Blenkinsop >Yes, I know that but if I have a set of, say, three frames defined in a >master page then after inserting a new page I want the third frame on page >1 to be linked to frame 1 on the new page. How do I do that, please? Create an auto link chain as described previously. From: Joyce Burton >I am having some difficulty in using the labels applet in conjunction with the >mail merge facility. I want to print names and addresses on labels and have >address correctly on the label, it printed the same name and address on every >label on the sheet-using only one record for each full sheet of labels. >Can somebody please tell me what I am doing wrong and what I need to alter? This is an old favourite. The lables applet is nothing to do with mail merging. My ex colleague the 'applet wizzard' in his (infinite) wisdom, used to print the same address on entire boxes of lables, or at least one lable at a time on a sheet of lables. What you want to do, is the other thing, take a list of names and addresses and print out sheets of lables. One address per lable. The OPro 2.45/46 release notes tell you how to do this, and there is a shareware program on the www.beebug.com web pages to help you do the job. Basically you design a master page of lables, turn them into an auto link text chain, then drop your CSV file into the chain in the document, having first massaged it into suitable form. To add to the fun, OPro 2.48 which has just appeared has new features which present a new approach to this problem. One which will allow you to keep your CSV file intact. I'll try to write up an 'application note' on how to use the new mail merge facilities and put it on the www.beebug.com site. >I should also like to know whether it is possible to print the page of labels >to the screen before printing them out as my mistakes are causing the printer OPro 2.48 has this feature. Otherwise print to ArcFax. From: David Pilling >Isn't your comment last week about using an (incorrect) delivery point of 1A with >the bar code applet likely to plunge the Post Office into chaos. Seemingly not, today I got one from Which? magazine coded 1A which is not correct. They obviously can't afford the CD ROM either. From: Jack Evans >The problem seems to have been caused by the 2 new templates designed by >John Ferguson and downloaded from Beebug's website in the file temp/zip. >They were installed immediately before carrying out the upgrade and >restoring the original versions has(?) fixed it. The new templates are OK with my copy of 2.48. What would be bad though would be to install 2.46, change the templates and then apply the patch. Our patcher program will currently patch anything, and we don't want that, this is why we're making you install a complete new copy. In due course patching will be made simpler. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Dec 22 17:37:07 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53569 for opro ; Mon, 22 Dec 97 17:37:06 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882782269:12:00465:77; Mon, 22 Dec 97 09:17:49 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0617785; 22 Dec 97 9:17 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ac1013189; 22 Dec 97 9:16 GMT From: Eddie Lord Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 22 Dec 1997 09:11:06 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: ClipBoard To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971222.091106.62@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 19 Dec 1997 13:17:23 -0500 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c One of the few irritating things I find about Acorn machines is that there is no univeral clipboard. I was therefore suprised to find Ovation didn't support this. Back to Impression!!! Eddie 72046.251@compuserve.com To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Dec 22 17:37:14 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53571 for opro ; Mon, 22 Dec 97 17:37:13 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882782287:06:18258:77; Mon, 22 Dec 97 09:18:07 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ac0617785; 22 Dec 97 9:17 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id af1013189; 22 Dec 97 9:17 GMT From: Chris Manning Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 22 Dec 1997 09:12:51 +0000 Organization: Organisation? Er, no... Subject: Re: OPro Error Message: ETEMPF To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971222.091251.30@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Sat, 20 Dec 1997 12:35:48 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c In message <19971219.095637.81@risc.demon.co.uk> Jack Evans wrote: >>> it was back to the ETEMPF error message again. I'm mystified. >> A little rummaging reveals >> ETEMP Template %s not found. >> ETEMPX Bad template tag %d >> but no ETEMPF. Maybe something's amiss with your templates file? > Thanks Chris. Your comment confirms my mistake But I also suspect that OPro's Messages file should contain an ETEMPF token. Chris To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Dec 22 17:37:21 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53573 for opro ; Mon, 22 Dec 97 17:37:19 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882782343:12:00739:79; Mon, 22 Dec 97 09:19:03 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0618259; 22 Dec 97 9:18 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ab1013189; 22 Dec 97 9:17 GMT From: Alexander Singleton Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 22 Dec 1997 09:13:35 +0000 Organization: Subject: Mail-merge To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971222.091335.41@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Sun, 21 Dec 1997 16:56:31 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I have a database in DataPower 2 with a multi-line (address) field. When I mail-merge this into Ovation Pro, Ovation prints each separate line of the field on the same line, with each part of the address separated by a '\n'. Mail-merging with Impression results in each line of the address field being printed on a different line. Are there plans to correct this in Ovation? Thanks, Alex. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Dec 22 17:37:28 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53575 for opro ; Mon, 22 Dec 97 17:37:27 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882782389:12:00965:85; Mon, 22 Dec 97 09:19:49 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0618646; 22 Dec 97 9:19 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aj1013189; 22 Dec 97 9:18 GMT From: Carl Cepurneek Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 22 Dec 1997 09:12:30 +0000 Organization: Subject: Printing to screen, and to disc To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971222.091230.73@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 22 Dec 1997 11:15:40 +0930 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c >>I should also like to know whether it is possible to print the page of labels >>to the screen before printing them out as my mistakes are causing the printer > >OPro 2.48 has this feature. Otherwise print to ArcFax. Where, please? My upgrade went without problem, but 2.48's 'Print' menu doesn't seem to have any indication of a print to screen option. On printing to a file -- as text only, not printer code: I was wondering about the possibility of creating a series of generic web pages using OPro's mail merge facility to substitute various names and links. eg, a page for each student with their name and 'mail-to' fields. Save story as text doesn't include the csv data, and 'Mail merge...' goes through the printer driver. Any suggestions, beyond writing a little program? cpc To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Dec 22 17:37:35 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53577 for opro ; Mon, 22 Dec 97 17:37:34 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882782407:05:00571:77; Mon, 22 Dec 97 09:20:07 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0618651; 22 Dec 97 9:19 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ai1013189; 22 Dec 97 9:18 GMT From: Philip Hetherington Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 22 Dec 1997 09:12:07 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: 2.46 to 2.48 To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971222.091207.88@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 19 Dec 97 21:50:12 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I have successfully uploaded 2.48 over 2.46 from the Internet address given by David Pilling. I tried first with a new 2.46 loaded from my original discs on a newly created Ovation directory on an SCSI Hard Disc and followed the readme instructions. As this upgrade on my SCSI disc seemed to work perfectly OK trying out various files, I have now also upgraded my IDE HardDisc version, which is the one that my desktop_!boot filer_boots and puts on the pinboard. So as far as I can see the upgrader works OK. Good work Ian and David. I tried the "Go to WWW site" (as F.R.Polak 16Dec) on the icon bar menu item and got the same result - a system crash! Phil Hetherington -- Argonaut ZFC Already gold+, transmuting to mercury in 1998 philhet@argonet.co.uk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Dec 22 17:37:44 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53579 for opro ; Mon, 22 Dec 97 17:37:42 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882782456:06:19214:82; Mon, 22 Dec 97 09:20:56 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0619074; 22 Dec 97 9:20 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id am1013189; 22 Dec 97 9:19 GMT From: Peter Blenkinsop Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 22 Dec 1997 09:11:47 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Linked frames To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971222.091147.66@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Fri, 19 Dec 1997 19:33:50 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Ray Dawson wrote: > Peter Blenkinsop wrote: > > > But it already does if you have single or multiple columns on > > > the master page. Page..Insert page..After puts a page after the > > > current page and clicking on the link tool shows the last column > > > of the current page linking to the first column of the new page. > > > Ray D > > Yes, I know that but if I have a set of, say, three frames defined > > in a master page then after inserting a new page I want the third > > frame on page 1 to be linked to frame 1 on the new page. How do I > > do that, please? > On the master page, link Frame 1- Frame 2- Frame 3- Frame 1. This will > make text from Frame 3 link to Frame 1 in the next page. > I've just tried it and if you add a page after the first page, then the > text from Frame 3 on page 1 flows into Frame 1 on the new page 2. > Ray D Thanks. Simple when one knows how! -- This is my signature using Pluto Contained in the last character of this line is the secret of the universe. Rats!! I've run out of space for the last character. Peter Blenkinsop To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Mon Dec 22 17:37:49 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53581 for opro ; Mon, 22 Dec 97 17:37:48 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882782492:12:01334:78; Mon, 22 Dec 97 09:21:32 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0619425; 22 Dec 97 9:21 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id an1013189; 22 Dec 97 9:19 GMT From: Elliott Grosvenor Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 22 Dec 1997 09:13:13 +0000 Organization: The Western Commercial Arts Co. Subject: Re: Qk or Opro, Was Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971222.091313.78@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Sun, 21 Dec 1997 02:21:02 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Somewhen, somewhere, soneone wrote > Hmm ... so your parent company produces a program which you say it > is "unrealistically expensive" for you to use, and you don't think > that sends just a teensy-weensy signal to other magazine publishers? Correct me if I'm wrong, (and I know you will :-) ) but I don't think he said it was unrealistically expensive "... to use", I think he said that it was unrealistically expensive to make the change. Speaking from experience I know how a seemingly simple and inexpensive change such as this can turn into a humongous expense. There isn't only the software and the machine it runs on to consider. Its things like how long will it take to remake or convert all those standard style sheets and grids and blanks and oft-used graphics. How will the imagesetter use the files this software produces: does he know what to do with a PS text file? Will getting films exactly the way the printer likes them work first time, what if it doesn't? Can we afford the time to train the staff and will they take lightly to being told all they know is now useless and they should learn something else? Will they see their not keeping up with the "industry standard" as a possible difficulty when applying for their next job? etc etc etc... This last, by the way was an unexpected, and MAJOR problem. I am very pro-Acorn, but I think that if it aint broke, dont fix it, especially if its just to prove a point to people who don't really need the point proven. -- Kevin Simpson BA(Hons) The Western Commercial Arts Co. http://www.wcartsco.demon.co.uk graphic design - typeface design - typography - illustration - printing To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Dec 23 14:50:26 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53651 for opro ; Tue, 23 Dec 97 14:50:25 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882868635:05:18879:83; Tue, 23 Dec 97 09:17:15 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id af0611103; 23 Dec 97 9:16 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ac1006233; 23 Dec 97 9:15 GMT From: Ian MacDougall Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 23 Dec 1997 09:12:03 +0000 Organization: Beebug Ltd Subject: Happy Christmas To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971223.091203.66@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Tue, 23 Dec 1997 09:07:02 +0100 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Just a quick reminder that the list will not be filling up your mailboxes over Christmas as I am not at work to run it. May you all have a very happy Christmas. -- Ian MacDougall Beebug Ltd To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Dec 23 14:50:30 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53653 for opro ; Tue, 23 Dec 97 14:50:29 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882868636:12:03624:79; Tue, 23 Dec 97 09:17:16 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0611628; 23 Dec 97 9:16 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ae1006233; 23 Dec 97 9:16 GMT From: Chris Chorley Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 23 Dec 1997 09:09:31 +0000 Organization: Subject: 2.46 to 2.48 To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971223.090931.76@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 22 Dec 1997 13:10:59 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c No problems with the upgrade. However: Managed to crash OPro by loading a file, printing, and just as the print finished double-clicking another file to load it. OPro complained, re-loaded itself and continued with no problems. It looked like the first instance of OPro crashed out, leaving the next one loading with the new file. I'll try and replicate this. Congratulations Ian and David on the upgrade though, it works fine. Go home and have a Good Christmas & New Year. Chris. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Dec 23 14:50:34 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53655 for opro ; Tue, 23 Dec 97 14:50:33 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882868641:12:03730:78; Tue, 23 Dec 97 09:17:21 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0611655; 23 Dec 97 9:17 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ah1006233; 23 Dec 97 9:16 GMT From: Sveinung Tengelsen Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 23 Dec 1997 09:09:08 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: ClipBoard To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971223.090908.70@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 22 Dec 1997 11:21:56 +0000 (GMT+1) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Mon 22 Des, Eddie Lord wrote: > One of the few irritating things I find about Acorn machines is that there > is no univeral clipboard. > > I was therefore suprised to find Ovation didn't support this. Back to > Impression!!! How can Ovation Pro support a feature which doesn't exist? And what makes IP "more desirable" in that regard? Ho hum. -- Regards, Sveinung W. Tengelsen ----------------------------------------------------------------------- mailto:pixeleye@sn.no | I have one illusion; http://www.sn.no/~pixeleye/Index.htm | I have no illusions. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Dec 23 14:50:40 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53657 for opro ; Tue, 23 Dec 97 14:50:39 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882868684:05:19215:77; Tue, 23 Dec 97 09:18:04 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0611628; 23 Dec 97 9:17 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ai1006233; 23 Dec 97 9:16 GMT From: Gabriel Swords Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 23 Dec 1997 09:10:39 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: 2.45 owners To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971223.091039.80@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 22 Dec 1997 15:35:33 +0100 (BST) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c On Fri 19 Dec, Ian MacDougall wrote: > This is how things will have to work for 2.45 owners: > > You either: > > a) return your original Program disc 1 and 2 along with > a stamped addressed hard back envelope suitable for us > to return you two discs. These will be 2.46 and can > be installed and then you can install the patch on top. > Address your envelope 2.45 to 2.46 upgrade. > Hi, I've only just joined this mailing list... and would be grateful to know where to this the various patches/upgrades everyone seems to be talking about... Thanks Gabriel -- Gabriel Swords 01603 452807 To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Dec 23 14:50:45 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53659 for opro ; Tue, 23 Dec 97 14:50:44 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882868694:06:12121:78; Tue, 23 Dec 97 09:18:14 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0611930; 23 Dec 97 9:17 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ak1006233; 23 Dec 97 9:17 GMT From: Ray Dawson Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 23 Dec 1997 09:11:20 +0000 Organization: Subject: TransDDF and 2.48 To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971223.091120.54@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 22 Dec 1997 17:41:30 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I seem to have discovered a problem with 2.48 which I think is down to the new TransDDF filter. When importing text files, either by dragging or by Ctrl dragging, I sometimes get a problem with the !TransBMP and !TransPCX filters as supplied by (I think) IMS. I'm not sure if it is the length of the text file or characters contained within, but often the PCX loader will throw up an error box about not enough memory and then a post mortem window saying 'SWI &6D656D not known'. Other times the TransBMP loader will throw up an error 'CF08'. Other times the text loads in properly. Strange. The loaders have always been in my system and the problem has only come up since 2.48 was installed. Ray D -- ..===================================. | M a g R a y Document Services | Ray Dawson Tel: 0181 864 7208 | the print and braille specialists | rayd@argonet.co.uk '===================================' http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/rayd To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Dec 23 14:50:51 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53661 for opro ; Tue, 23 Dec 97 14:50:49 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882868751:05:19453:84; Tue, 23 Dec 97 09:19:11 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0612384; 23 Dec 97 9:18 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ap1006233; 23 Dec 97 9:18 GMT From: David Pilling Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 23 Dec 1997 09:11:01 +0000 Organization: Subject: Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971223.091101.21@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 22 Dec 97 21:49:35 GMT X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c From: Alexander Singleton >When I mail-merge this into Ovation Pro, Ovation prints each separate >line of the field on the same line, with each part of the address >separated by a '\n'. Hmm. I could have sworn that would work. I will fix it... From: Carl Cepurneek >Where, please? My upgrade went without problem, but 2.48's 'Print' menu >doesn't seem to have any indication of a print to screen option. Mail Merge... then those new buttons 'first', 'next', etc. Although this might not entirely solve your problem. It does sort out the original problem of wasting paper by not being able to see the results of a mail merge on screen. There are probably many tricks. For one thing the new printer drivers queue documents. So a mailmerge results in n documents with merged data in being queued somewhere. The new version of the program has fields, and a command to step to the next record - 20 identical pages, each with a next field command at the end... see the example archive mentioned below. From: David J Fairweather >I have Ovation Pro 2.45. I understand that there is an upgrade somewhere >on the Beebug web site. Where? I've now set up an index of the upgrade material with URL; http://www.beebug.com/software/ovpro/upgrade248/index.html This has the 2.46 upgrade, and new, some notes on using the mail merge features in 2.48, and a copy of the PrePress applet. It also has an upgrade for the colour supplement 1.00, but at the time of writing this, I don't know if this is going to be OK. The point is that this URL is where the patches will appear (or disappear if they won't work) in the near future. From: Dr A G Gray > trouble with ligatures To fix this, change the following two lines in the applet Library.Ligature file. Replace type("{Deleteb}{Deletef}" + ((c == 'i') ? "" : "")); with type(((c == 'i') ? "" : "") + "{deletef}{CLeft}{deleteb}"); Replace type("{Deletef}f" + ((c == '') ? "i" : "l")); with type("{CRight}f" + ((c == '') ? "i" : "l") + "{CLeft}{CLeft}{deleteb}"); David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Dec 23 14:50:56 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53663 for opro ; Tue, 23 Dec 97 14:50:54 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882868758:05:19492:77; Tue, 23 Dec 97 09:19:18 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab0612526; 23 Dec 97 9:19 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id aq1006233; 23 Dec 97 9:18 GMT From: John Ward Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 23 Dec 1997 09:11:41 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: Qk or Opro, Was Various To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971223.091141.75@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 22 Dec 1997 22:18:23 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Elliott Grosvenor wrote: > Somewhen, somewhere, soneone wrote > > Hmm ... so your parent company produces a program which you say it > > is "unrealistically expensive" for you to use, and you don't think > > that sends just a teensy-weensy signal to other magazine publishers? > Correct me if I'm wrong, (and I know you will :-) ) but I don't think he > said it was unrealistically expensive "... to use", I think he said that it > was unrealistically expensive to make the change. While that point is valid (which is why I have never pushed them about it) Beebug has been saying that for a number of years now. This suggests that they are either running a very old system, or have been upgrading bits here and there. The latter -- while conceivably just as costly as replacing the lot and starting afresh -- would be less "painful" financially as it would entail only a comparatively small outlay per year. I do not know any details (it isn't really my business so I haven't pried, just attended several of their Open Days) but -- as this thread has been going on awhile -- thought I'd try to see it from the point of view of someone in their position. Mind you, Beebug do need to do something about their till receipts: I've never encountered anything so low quality and easily forgeable (they don't even have a printed logo, unless this has all changed recently) anywhere else in the IT business. One could well expect better there; but the magazine is fine as a product, so no doubt change of DTP will come when the time is right for them: we don't suffer in the meantime. Does this seem reasonable? -- <*> John M Ward <*> Our last, best hope for (Usenet) peace? Member of "Convergence International", the non-Wintel group. See for what, how and why! To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Dec 23 14:51:02 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53665 for opro ; Tue, 23 Dec 97 14:51:00 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882868770:06:12548:83; Tue, 23 Dec 97 09:19:30 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0612392; 23 Dec 97 9:18 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ao1006233; 23 Dec 97 9:17 GMT From: Roger King Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 23 Dec 1997 09:09:53 +0000 Organization: Subject: Re: ClipBoard To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971223.090953.82@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 22 Dec 1997 11:20:13 +0000 (GMT) X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c Eddie Lord <72046.251@compuserve.com> wrote: > One of the few irritating things I find about Acorn machines is > that there is no universal clipboard. > I was therefore suprised to find Ovation didn't support this. Back to > Impression!!! With Ovation Pro not having access to the global clipboard, the next best option is to use the StrongED application. StrongED does use the global clipboard, and so does Impression Publisher and Style. To transfer text from Publisher or Style into Ovation Pro use the following steps. In Publisher or Style, mark all or part of the text required for transferral and send to the clipboard. Open up a StrongED window and, from the Block.Clipboard menu option, select Paste to text or use key shortcut . The marked text in Publisher or Style will immediately be transferred into the StrongED window. To mark all of the text in the StrongED window, press three times. If only a selection of text is required then mark the text in the StrongED window by dragging the mouse with the button and drag the marked text into the Ovation Pro window. For this option to work, the Drag'n Drop option from StrongED's Global Choices Block menu must be enabled. I have used this method to transfer all of my Publisher text stories into the excellent Ovation Pro application. -- __ __ __ __ __ ___ _____________________________________________ |__||__)/ __/ \|\ ||_ | / | || \\__/\__/| \||__ | /..Internet provider for all Acorn RISC machines ___________________________/ rmking@argonet.co.uk To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l From maillist@risc.demon.co.uk Tue Dec 23 14:51:10 1997 Received: from relay-5.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA53667 for opro ; Tue, 23 Dec 97 14:51:07 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 882868819:06:12972:77; Tue, 23 Dec 97 09:20:19 GMT Received: from post-10.mail.demon.net ([194.217.242.154]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa0612755; 23 Dec 97 9:19 GMT Received: from risc.demon.co.uk ([158.152.18.44]) by post.mail.demon.net id ar1006233; 23 Dec 97 9:19 GMT From: Elliott Grosvenor Sender: imac@risc.demon.co.uk Date: Tue, 23 Dec 1997 09:10:16 +0000 Organization: The Western Commercial Arts Co. Subject: OPro 2.48 disappearing graphics and more... To: Subscribers to the mailing-list OVATIONP-L Reply-To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Message-ID: <19971223.091016.43@risc.demon.co.uk> Precedence: bulk X-Posting-Date: Mon, 22 Dec 1997 15:04:48 +0000 X-MailList: MailList v0.16 the mailing-list robot for RiscOS X-Apparently-From: X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.59c I have upgraded to 2.48, and since I only received my Colour Supplement a few days ago I tried it in the new version and it worked, so the problem I am about to describe may be down to my not having the version of the ColSup that works with 2.48 after all: I have been producing a sheet of quite simple labels which are to be printed full colour and stuck to small bottles. Apart from the fact that it takes aaaagggggeeeeesssss to draw all the crop marks (takes about 15 seconds in Publisher, no... seriously) I have been having problems with both Artworks graphics and sprites disappearing from their frames. The sprite is a greyscale scan and the AW pic is a very very simple black shape. I am not changing the pics in any way with OPro, only resizing and centering in the frame. The pics have another transparent frame over them with some text in. The pics seem to randomly disappear, to get them back I use sent to back or bring to front. Sometimes when they have disappeared they still print to my laser printer, and sometimes when I can see them on screen they don't print. Also since 2.48 the colour palette applet only works intermittently sometimes it produces a blank, non-fatal error box. Any ideas? A few other niggles that have come to light: In version 2.46 many of the buttons and menu options have a slash character ( / ) after them that I'm fairly certain shouldn't be there. I didn't complain about this previously because its so obvious no one could have missed it. My new version 2.48 also has these slashes after the text in some buttons and menu options. The snap distance is INFURIATING. If I move anything to within about 5mm of a guide (or other object, if snap to objects is on) it snaps! 5mm is far too big and prevents me putting things where I want them including those damned manually drawn crop marks! In Publisher (sorry to compare) the snap distance was always the same number of pixels no matter what zoom factor the page was viewed at so if the snap was too coarse I could zoom in and position the object closer without it snapping. Is there some way to alter the snap distance? switching it on and off slows me down incredibly and seems a bit crude. When placing guide lines on a page you have to contrive to scroll the document in such a way that the ruler overlaps the page you want the guide to appear on. Why can't the guide just appear on the the page that has an active frame? As it is I forget to Yoga the page into the correct position with the scroll bars and the Guide appears on wrong page. I know I have mentioned this before but it would be good if OPro could set the correct page size itself when printing to a PS file as Publisher does. I really need more control over the size and position of crop marks placed around a page. I often produce huge amounts of film which can only be done economically by fitting six A4's on a singe sheet of the film my imagesetting bureau uses (sheet-fed drum imagesetter). This can only be done by making the crop marks 2mm long and 1mm away from the page edge. The OPro 7mm default means I could only get 4 sheets to a film and would increase the cost enormously. (I know you can't do this with Publisher's auto crop marks but it can be done very very very easily and quickly with another method that isn't possible in OPro) It doesn't appear to be possible possible to create a document bigger than available RAM. I need OPI. the facility to take a low res scan and have the bureau's equipment automatically substitute the high res when outputting the films is essential, especially when suffering from the problem in the previous point. At the moment the above issues are so important to me that they are preventing me from making the move to OPro for more than about 15% of my work. I know there are work-arounds but they are slow/cumbersome/why bother, and time is money. And another thing (I'll stop in a minute)... Manipulating bit images in OPro after they have been processed in some way (duotoned for example) is very slow and difficult because the image disappears for seconds at a time. All in all OPro is an excellent package and is in many ways a lot more flexible than Publisher (and Quark). I am beginning to make the switch from Publisher now because I can see it has enormous potential. -- Kevin Simpson BA(Hons) The Western Commercial Arts Co. http://www.wcartsco.demon.co.uk graphic design - typeface design - typography - illustration - printing To unsubscribe send a message to: maillist@risc.demon.co.uk with the Subject: SIGNOFF ovationp-l To subscribe the Subject line should be: SIGNON ovationp-l Date: Tue, 23 Dec 97 20:25:49 GMT Message-Id: <53707@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) Reply-To: david@pilling.demon.co.uk To: ovationp-l@risc.demon.co.uk Subject: Re: Various From: Chris Chorley >Managed to crash OPro by loading a file, printing, and just as the print >finished double-clicking another file to load it. OPro complained, re-loaded >itself and continued with no problems. It looked like the first instance of >OPro crashed out, leaving the next one loading with the new file. I'll try >and replicate this. The common situation is that a program does not acknowledge a file load message until it has loaded the file. So if it crashes whilst loading, another copy of the program gets run. The scary one (don't try this at home kids) is to set off printing a file and then close all the windows on it whilst the printing is still going on. From: Ray Dawson >I seem to have discovered a problem with 2.48 which I think is down to the >new TransDDF filter. >I'm not sure if it is the length of the text file or characters contained >within, but often the PCX loader will throw up an error box about not >enough memory and then a post mortem window saying 'SWI &6D656D not >known'. Other times the TransBMP loader will throw up an error 'CF08'. Well these loaders have always been a bit weak at sifting one sort of file from another. The catch with the new DDF filter is that I left it set up to examine all text files. That has always been an option, you un bar comment two lines, one in !Run and one in !Boot - have a look at an old copy. (then reset the machine). By looking at all text files you gain the benefit of not having to settype Impression DDF files before you import them. The point was to allow drag and drop of mail merge fields from Impulse, making use of the new Impulse features. From: Elliott Grosvenor >I have upgraded to 2.48, and since I only received my Colour Supplement a >Also since 2.48 the colour palette applet only works intermittently >sometimes it produces a blank, non-fatal error box. You need the new colour supplement. From http://www.beebug.com/software/ovpro/upgrade248/index.html >In version 2.46 many of the buttons and menu options have a slash character >( / ) Off hand I don't know but it's badly wrong. >The snap distance is INFURIATING. If I move anything to within about 5mm of I'll fix this. >When placing guide lines on a page you have to contrive to scroll the >document in such a way that the ruler overlaps the page you want the guide >to appear on. Why can't the guide just appear on the the page that has an >active frame? As it is I forget to Yoga the page into the correct position Fairish point. What if there is no active frame? >I know I have mentioned this before but it would be good if OPro could set >the correct page size itself when printing to a PS file as Publisher does. Even though doing so is illegal? >I really need more control over the size and position of crop marks placed >around a page. I often produce huge amounts of film which can only be done >economically by fitting six A4's on a singe sheet of the film my Probably the very next thing I will do is allow crop marks for any object. You can change the size of the OPro crop marks, but it's not very easy. >It doesn't appear to be possible possible to create a document bigger than >available RAM. OPI (referencing external graphics) would effectively fix that. >And another thing (I'll stop in a minute)... Manipulating bit images in OPro >after they have been processed in some way (duotoned for example) is very >slow and difficult because the image disappears for seconds at a time. Again OPI would fix this. You'll find that if you switch off 'use inks' things are much faster. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK.